7 ms·

60beat iPad Gaming Accessory Could Be The iOS Missing Link

28 points by FluidDjango 15y ago

ricardobeat 15y ago
why the audio input? Are there any restrictions in Apple's hardware partner program for gaming devices?
- TomasSedovic 15y ago
  Presumably you may want to use the dock connector for charging.
- shalmanese 15y ago
  Getting certification for the dock is both onerous and expensive since it requires Apple approval and a license fee for every device. The audio jack is open so anyone can build on top of it.
- deepkut 15y ago
  Regarding question 1: DAC on the controller, ADC on the iPad Regarding question 2: I'm unsure, but I couldn't imagine this being an issue. Very clever, pretty cool! Thanks for sharing this ricardobeat
danso 15y ago
How proprietary is this technology and is there an input on the controller for headphone jacks?
nubela 15y ago
don't mean to be that guy but when you think of how Android has USB host and is compatible with various console controllers, gotta give props to Google for being forward looking.
- kalleboo 15y ago
  iOS can use USB over the dock port, but is subject to strict approval and licensing from Apple which is why there are very few dock port accessories. Meanwhile since Android devices just use microUSB, there's no licensing involved.
- kstenerud 15y ago
  It's more an issue of openness rather than one of forward thinking. Apple just doesn't want unapproved hardware connecting to their devices. They also want royalties from anyone who DOES get their approval. They'd even block audio hacks like this if they could. Once a company gains too much control over the consumer, innovation suffers.
dconway 15y ago
The design of the controller is obviously very similar to a playstation controller. I don't know much about IP/copyright/patent. What are the chances of this guy getting sued by Sony?
- dazzawazza 15y ago
  I haven't held the device but I think it's only superficially similar. It looks like any number of after market PS2/3 devices that already exist and tbh are usually of a VERY low quality. I'm looking forward to giving it a go though. My iPad really needs one of these.
jonknee 15y ago
Bluetooth would make a whole lot more sense.
- tl 15y ago
  Bluetooth has the property of not being an option whatsoever because of the way Apple supports it. Instead we get custom libraries limited to one controller hacked over the audio jack.
  - jonknee 15y ago
    Could it not function as a Bluetooth keyboard?
    - DerekL 15y ago
      The iCADE works as a Bluetooth keyboard. Each key and joystick direction (up, down, left, right) sends one letter when pushed and a different letter when released. The iControlpad can also work in this mode. I don't know if there's a way to support analog controls over Bluetooth.
dazzawazza 15y ago
"virtually no latency" I really hope he means less than 1/60th of a second otherwise it's gonna be awful to play with.
- littleguy 15y ago
  It looked like it had quite a bit of latency in-game, compare it to when he controlled it on the touchpad.
cstross 15y ago
What next -- a three-button mouse or a punched card reader? (Let me unpack that: the iPad -- with multitouch screen and accelerometer and gyro -- provides a unique user interface of its own. While this accessory is fundamentally the n'th generation descendant of the 1970s console game controller. I'm kind of annoyed, because if this catches on it will potentially cost us a raft of new user interface innovations by allowing lazy back-ports of console titles instead of forcing developers to confront the inherent strengths and weaknesses of an entirely new and different way of doing things. If I wanted a console with a traditional controller I'd buy a PS3 or an XBox360 ...)
- chedigitz 15y ago
  Agree 100%. The whole thing feels backwards, a lazy bandaid. What's next, using a bridle to control a car?
- brudgers 15y ago
  >"a unique user interface of its own." For a game developer, this might tend to limit the desirability of porting existing games to the market or even developing games for it. A lot of time and thought went into the dual stick interface.
  - extension 15y ago
    As a player, I don't want to see existing joystick games ported to iOS. I can already play those games in their existing form, and the virtual joystick experience, for all the thought that has been put into it, still sucks. What I want to see on iOS are games that fit naturally into the touch interface, which can be existing games that just adapt well, or entirely new concepts. What makes a touch interface work, I think, is directly manipulating what you see. Control schemes that rely on "body extension", like a joystick or directional pad, rarely translate well.
  - ja2ke 15y ago
    I don't think the unique input methods brought on by a multitouch glass display has limited the desirability to game developers... 3-4 years ago that could have been a concern, but the huge iOS games market has shown that to not be the case. We're getting unique, tremendously well-selling experiences on touch/mobile devices with great regularity. Major publishers and indies are churning out games for these devices, all without a keyboard, mouse, or controller required to play. It's true that you can't play every genre of game on an iPad, but it's also been true for years that not every genre of PC game would play well on a mainline TV console (traditional adventure games, strategy games, and anything with a lot of diverse/unique user input or complex underlying systems tends to fail on a 360 controller/living room couch situation), and not every GameBoy/DS game would work well there either. That aside, personally as a gamer I'm glad that there are game systems out there with nearly mutually exclusive input methods, because it prevents lazy ports, and lazy ports generally, basically, suck to play.
int3rnaut 15y ago
As a gamer I can't help but wonder, why is this the missing link in IOS gaming? It seems like a step backwards. There are some really fantastic games on this platform that have made use of the on-device controls and the ones that don't well they seem to be uninventive and poorly created clones/ports of console and computer games. I can't speak for everyone, but what I like about the IOS gaming experience is I can quickly and conveniently take out my device for short bursts. I can't imagine waiting for a meeting and pulling out a controller. In most circumstances if I wanted a controller experience, I think I'd rather wait to play on my console. The problem here isn't that this is a dumb invention, it's not, it's really cool, and I applaud the hack, but I question if this is the "missing link" when there are fantastic and well controlled games already available on this platform.
ibisum 15y ago
I'd rather just use my perfectly-working Bluetooth-based iControlpad. http://icontrolpad.com/ http://icontrolpad.com/ Its just simply awesome, and has a much better chance of support, since the developers have been working very hard on providing firmware updates that add iCade compatability, BT-controller (yes, its available now in iOS5), and even a 'keyboard emulating' mode .. you just hold down key combos to command the iControlPad which mode you want it in, and oila: instant gaming fun. Note: works great on iOS with many, many games, no Jailbreak'ing required, Android support as well. I use mine with iMAME on my old non-JB iPad and my legal ROM collection - its bloody brilliant!
bane 15y ago
Funny how many people here seem not for this device when: a) I don't remember people being against http://www.thinkgeek.com/electronics/retro-gaming/e762/ http://www.thinkgeek.com/electronics/retro-gaming/e762/ b) On-screen controls that try to mimic a controller are at best a kludge and never really work as well as a real tactile controller. Having a physical controller to use is huge. My tablet is sitting here right next to me, I'd love to use a real controller with it and treat it like a mini game console.
- baddox 15y ago
  Or, that iPad tactile keyboard thing: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/740785012/touchfire-the-screen-top-keyboard-for-ipad http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/740785012/touchfire-the-.... I think that one is still the worst idea that the HN community seemed to approve of.
- nitrogen 15y ago
  My tablet is sitting here right next to me, I'd love to use a real controller with it and treat it like a mini game console. This is possible, at least with Android. I have a friend who spends much of his spare time playing emulators on his Xoom tablet with his Xbox controller.

28 points by FluidDjango 15y ago

ricardobeat 15y ago

why the audio input? Are there any restrictions in Apple's hardware partner program for gaming devices?

TomasSedovic 15y ago
Presumably you may want to use the dock connector for charging.
shalmanese 15y ago
Getting certification for the dock is both onerous and expensive since it requires Apple approval and a license fee for every device. The audio jack is open so anyone can build on top of it.
deepkut 15y ago
Regarding question 1: DAC on the controller, ADC on the iPad Regarding question 2: I'm unsure, but I couldn't imagine this being an issue. Very clever, pretty cool! Thanks for sharing this ricardobeat

danso 15y ago

How proprietary is this technology and is there an input on the controller for headphone jacks?

nubela 15y ago

don't mean to be that guy but when you think of how Android has USB host and is compatible with various console controllers, gotta give props to Google for being forward looking.

kalleboo 15y ago
iOS can use USB over the dock port, but is subject to strict approval and licensing from Apple which is why there are very few dock port accessories. Meanwhile since Android devices just use microUSB, there's no licensing involved.
kstenerud 15y ago
It's more an issue of openness rather than one of forward thinking. Apple just doesn't want unapproved hardware connecting to their devices. They also want royalties from anyone who DOES get their approval. They'd even block audio hacks like this if they could. Once a company gains too much control over the consumer, innovation suffers.

dconway 15y ago

The design of the controller is obviously very similar to a playstation controller. I don't know much about IP/copyright/patent. What are the chances of this guy getting sued by Sony?

dazzawazza 15y ago
I haven't held the device but I think it's only superficially similar. It looks like any number of after market PS2/3 devices that already exist and tbh are usually of a VERY low quality. I'm looking forward to giving it a go though. My iPad really needs one of these.

jonknee 15y ago

Bluetooth would make a whole lot more sense.

tl 15y ago
Bluetooth has the property of not being an option whatsoever because of the way Apple supports it. Instead we get custom libraries limited to one controller hacked over the audio jack.
- jonknee 15y ago
  Could it not function as a Bluetooth keyboard?
  - DerekL 15y ago
    The iCADE works as a Bluetooth keyboard. Each key and joystick direction (up, down, left, right) sends one letter when pushed and a different letter when released. The iControlpad can also work in this mode. I don't know if there's a way to support analog controls over Bluetooth.

dazzawazza 15y ago

"virtually no latency" I really hope he means less than 1/60th of a second otherwise it's gonna be awful to play with.

littleguy 15y ago
It looked like it had quite a bit of latency in-game, compare it to when he controlled it on the touchpad.

cstross 15y ago

What next -- a three-button mouse or a punched card reader? (Let me unpack that: the iPad -- with multitouch screen and accelerometer and gyro -- provides a unique user interface of its own. While this accessory is fundamentally the n'th generation descendant of the 1970s console game controller. I'm kind of annoyed, because if this catches on it will potentially cost us a raft of new user interface innovations by allowing lazy back-ports of console titles instead of forcing developers to confront the inherent strengths and weaknesses of an entirely new and different way of doing things. If I wanted a console with a traditional controller I'd buy a PS3 or an XBox360 ...)

chedigitz 15y ago
Agree 100%. The whole thing feels backwards, a lazy bandaid. What's next, using a bridle to control a car?
brudgers 15y ago
>"a unique user interface of its own." For a game developer, this might tend to limit the desirability of porting existing games to the market or even developing games for it. A lot of time and thought went into the dual stick interface.
- extension 15y ago
  As a player, I don't want to see existing joystick games ported to iOS. I can already play those games in their existing form, and the virtual joystick experience, for all the thought that has been put into it, still sucks. What I want to see on iOS are games that fit naturally into the touch interface, which can be existing games that just adapt well, or entirely new concepts. What makes a touch interface work, I think, is directly manipulating what you see. Control schemes that rely on "body extension", like a joystick or directional pad, rarely translate well.
- ja2ke 15y ago
  I don't think the unique input methods brought on by a multitouch glass display has limited the desirability to game developers... 3-4 years ago that could have been a concern, but the huge iOS games market has shown that to not be the case. We're getting unique, tremendously well-selling experiences on touch/mobile devices with great regularity. Major publishers and indies are churning out games for these devices, all without a keyboard, mouse, or controller required to play. It's true that you can't play every genre of game on an iPad, but it's also been true for years that not every genre of PC game would play well on a mainline TV console (traditional adventure games, strategy games, and anything with a lot of diverse/unique user input or complex underlying systems tends to fail on a 360 controller/living room couch situation), and not every GameBoy/DS game would work well there either. That aside, personally as a gamer I'm glad that there are game systems out there with nearly mutually exclusive input methods, because it prevents lazy ports, and lazy ports generally, basically, suck to play.

int3rnaut 15y ago

As a gamer I can't help but wonder, why is this the missing link in IOS gaming? It seems like a step backwards. There are some really fantastic games on this platform that have made use of the on-device controls and the ones that don't well they seem to be uninventive and poorly created clones/ports of console and computer games. I can't speak for everyone, but what I like about the IOS gaming experience is I can quickly and conveniently take out my device for short bursts. I can't imagine waiting for a meeting and pulling out a controller. In most circumstances if I wanted a controller experience, I think I'd rather wait to play on my console. The problem here isn't that this is a dumb invention, it's not, it's really cool, and I applaud the hack, but I question if this is the "missing link" when there are fantastic and well controlled games already available on this platform.

ibisum 15y ago

I'd rather just use my perfectly-working Bluetooth-based iControlpad. http://icontrolpad.com/ http://icontrolpad.com/ Its just simply awesome, and has a much better chance of support, since the developers have been working very hard on providing firmware updates that add iCade compatability, BT-controller (yes, its available now in iOS5), and even a 'keyboard emulating' mode .. you just hold down key combos to command the iControlPad which mode you want it in, and oila: instant gaming fun. Note: works great on iOS with many, many games, no Jailbreak'ing required, Android support as well. I use mine with iMAME on my old non-JB iPad and my legal ROM collection - its bloody brilliant!

bane 15y ago

Funny how many people here seem not for this device when: a) I don't remember people being against http://www.thinkgeek.com/electronics/retro-gaming/e762/ http://www.thinkgeek.com/electronics/retro-gaming/e762/ b) On-screen controls that try to mimic a controller are at best a kludge and never really work as well as a real tactile controller. Having a physical controller to use is huge. My tablet is sitting here right next to me, I'd love to use a real controller with it and treat it like a mini game console.

baddox 15y ago
Or, that iPad tactile keyboard thing: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/740785012/touchfire-the-screen-top-keyboard-for-ipad http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/740785012/touchfire-the-.... I think that one is still the worst idea that the HN community seemed to approve of.
nitrogen 15y ago
My tablet is sitting here right next to me, I'd love to use a real controller with it and treat it like a mini game console. This is possible, at least with Android. I have a friend who spends much of his spare time playing emulators on his Xoom tablet with his Xbox controller.