4 ms·

As long as we're using dueling anecdotes, I've lived in SF 20+ years, and as far as I can tell crime levels are about the same. Is it possible that criminal gr

As long as we're using dueling anecdotes, I've lived in SF 20+ years, and as far as I can tell crime levels are about the same. Is it possible that criminal groups are doing some organized shoplifting? I'd believe it. But this may be just a change in method for existing criminals. Or it may be that we're hearing about it more because it's a topic that has gained sudden media interest. In any case, that cuts against your theory that the cops don't care, because doing it in bulk or in an organized fashion will turn it from a misdemeanor to a felony, making cops much more interested. And indeed, SF just announced results from exactly that kind of operation: https://sfist.com/2022/12/16/sfpd-touts-60-arrests-in-new-retail-shoplifting-crackdown/ https://sfist.com/2022/12/16/sfpd-touts-60-arrests-in-new-re...

lazide 4y ago
If they can’t/won’t arrest low level offenders, it makes it easier to construct a ring. Just like the link you posted. If it’s too easy to prosecute low level folks, the friction is too high. Glad they’re going after the rings at least!
- wpietri 4y ago
  A lack of cash bail doesn't make it any harder to arrest or charge low-level offenders, so I think that's a bit of a red herring here.
  - lazide 4y ago
    It makes it harder to keep them off the street, which makes departments deprioritize arresting people for those crimes. Same as 5150 for mentally unstable folks on the street. When it’s clearly a revolving door, folks stop trying to spend so much effort pushing people into it. It’s often part of the same platform too - at least for Chesa Boudin. [https://sfstandard.com/politics/the-recall-of-chesa-boudin-how-the-pandemic-fed-a-national-attack-on-progressive-prosectors/ https://sfstandard.com/politics/the-recall-of-chesa-boudin-h...]
    - wpietri 4y ago
      It doesn't "make" departments deprioritize that. They choose it. Note also you are once again conflating pre-trial detainment with post-trial punishment. People presumed innocent should not be generally kept off the streets. Even given the (dubious and ineffective) goal of keeping people off the streets, a removal of cash bail would in theory make them work even harder, so that a) true repeat offenders would receive the sort of escalating penalties that would put them away for a long time, and b) people failing to abide by the terms of their non-cash bail would not be allowed back out again. So the end of cash bail should make them more dedicated. But Boudin is material here. SF cops sandbagged on doing their job because they didn't like him. He was foursquare for a modicum police accountability and they hated that. And if you'd like to post nominal facts about the Boudin recall, please don't use ones from a publication wholly funded by one of the people who paid for the Boudin recall.

lazide 4y ago

If they can’t/won’t arrest low level offenders, it makes it easier to construct a ring. Just like the link you posted. If it’s too easy to prosecute low level folks, the friction is too high. Glad they’re going after the rings at least!

wpietri 4y ago
A lack of cash bail doesn't make it any harder to arrest or charge low-level offenders, so I think that's a bit of a red herring here.
- lazide 4y ago
  It makes it harder to keep them off the street, which makes departments deprioritize arresting people for those crimes. Same as 5150 for mentally unstable folks on the street. When it’s clearly a revolving door, folks stop trying to spend so much effort pushing people into it. It’s often part of the same platform too - at least for Chesa Boudin. [https://sfstandard.com/politics/the-recall-of-chesa-boudin-how-the-pandemic-fed-a-national-attack-on-progressive-prosectors/ https://sfstandard.com/politics/the-recall-of-chesa-boudin-h...]
  - wpietri 4y ago
    It doesn't "make" departments deprioritize that. They choose it. Note also you are once again conflating pre-trial detainment with post-trial punishment. People presumed innocent should not be generally kept off the streets. Even given the (dubious and ineffective) goal of keeping people off the streets, a removal of cash bail would in theory make them work even harder, so that a) true repeat offenders would receive the sort of escalating penalties that would put them away for a long time, and b) people failing to abide by the terms of their non-cash bail would not be allowed back out again. So the end of cash bail should make them more dedicated. But Boudin is material here. SF cops sandbagged on doing their job because they didn't like him. He was foursquare for a modicum police accountability and they hated that. And if you'd like to post nominal facts about the Boudin recall, please don't use ones from a publication wholly funded by one of the people who paid for the Boudin recall.