4 ms·

They’re hoarding capital instead of distributing it to their workers. Furthermore, they’re utilizing shared resources for their companies profit without paying

They’re hoarding capital instead of distributing it to their workers. Furthermore, they’re utilizing shared resources for their companies profit without paying proportionally.

AussieWog93 4y ago
>They’re hoarding capital This is GP's point, AFAICT. They're not hoarding grain or iron or silicon or network bandwidth - in fact the only reason they got rich in the first place is because they allocated these physical resources effectively to serve a wide group of people. (See AWS for example. The average computer runs at maybe 10% utilisation for 2 hours a day; whereas theirs are at a high utilisation 24/7.) As you rightly said, the things that Bezos, Musk and Gates are "hoarding" is capital in the literal sense. Their net worth isn't made of gold coins sitting in a swimming pool doing nothing, but car factories, server farms and massive logistics networks.
rmk 4y ago
Wrong on that score too. To 'hoard' capital is to take it and put it in the equivalent of a mattress. I assure you, the family offices of these billionaires are doing anything but hoarding capital: huge chunks of it are invested in various vehicles. And the idea that billionaires should simply give away their wealth to their workers is widespread, but wishful thinking. The average person who wins a lottery (the equivalent of the recipient of a billionaire's largesse that you envision) pisses it all away in a few years, rarely deploying it for his own benefit, let alone that of society.
- thebigman433 4y ago
  > The average person who wins a lottery (the equivalent of the recipient of a billionaire's largesse that you envision) pisses it all away in a few years, rarely deploying it for his own benefit, let alone that of society. I want to point out that first of all, this isnt even a good comparison, because nobody is talking about just giving people a massive lump sum of cash. Its about putting the money back into the workers creating it, as well as public welfare systems to ensure future safety nets. And second of all, even if we just gave the money away and people "pissed it away", the money is still being circulated and put back into the economy.
  - rmk 4y ago
    That's called taxation, and the billionaires you are referring to pay all the taxes that are due. None are behind on any tax bills AFAIK. Of course it is easy to say 'put money back into workers creating it'. But the labor market is just that - a market, and no-one is being forced to give away their labor for free or less than it's worth. If the tax code is riddled with tens of thousands of exceptions that incentivise a gazillion different behaviours, again, that's the will of the people asserting itself via the tax code. It's much harder to unpick those, right? Thus the highly enlightened conversation about making billionaries illegal and such. > And second of all, even if we just gave the money away and people "pissed it away", the money is still being circulated and put back into the economy. Yeah, that worked out great and totally did not result in historically high inflation that will now cause a recession with massive job losses (thus hurting the cause of the workers it purports to support). Also, the inflation is totally not a tax that will be paid mostly by poor people or those on fixed incomes.

They’re hoarding capital instead of distributing it to their workers. Furthermore, they’re utilizing shared resources for their companies profit without paying proportionally.

AussieWog93 4y ago

>They’re hoarding capital This is GP's point, AFAICT. They're not hoarding grain or iron or silicon or network bandwidth - in fact the only reason they got rich in the first place is because they allocated these physical resources effectively to serve a wide group of people. (See AWS for example. The average computer runs at maybe 10% utilisation for 2 hours a day; whereas theirs are at a high utilisation 24/7.) As you rightly said, the things that Bezos, Musk and Gates are "hoarding" is capital in the literal sense. Their net worth isn't made of gold coins sitting in a swimming pool doing nothing, but car factories, server farms and massive logistics networks.

rmk 4y ago

Wrong on that score too. To 'hoard' capital is to take it and put it in the equivalent of a mattress. I assure you, the family offices of these billionaires are doing anything but hoarding capital: huge chunks of it are invested in various vehicles. And the idea that billionaires should simply give away their wealth to their workers is widespread, but wishful thinking. The average person who wins a lottery (the equivalent of the recipient of a billionaire's largesse that you envision) pisses it all away in a few years, rarely deploying it for his own benefit, let alone that of society.

thebigman433 4y ago
> The average person who wins a lottery (the equivalent of the recipient of a billionaire's largesse that you envision) pisses it all away in a few years, rarely deploying it for his own benefit, let alone that of society. I want to point out that first of all, this isnt even a good comparison, because nobody is talking about just giving people a massive lump sum of cash. Its about putting the money back into the workers creating it, as well as public welfare systems to ensure future safety nets. And second of all, even if we just gave the money away and people "pissed it away", the money is still being circulated and put back into the economy.
- rmk 4y ago
  That's called taxation, and the billionaires you are referring to pay all the taxes that are due. None are behind on any tax bills AFAIK. Of course it is easy to say 'put money back into workers creating it'. But the labor market is just that - a market, and no-one is being forced to give away their labor for free or less than it's worth. If the tax code is riddled with tens of thousands of exceptions that incentivise a gazillion different behaviours, again, that's the will of the people asserting itself via the tax code. It's much harder to unpick those, right? Thus the highly enlightened conversation about making billionaries illegal and such. > And second of all, even if we just gave the money away and people "pissed it away", the money is still being circulated and put back into the economy. Yeah, that worked out great and totally did not result in historically high inflation that will now cause a recession with massive job losses (thus hurting the cause of the workers it purports to support). Also, the inflation is totally not a tax that will be paid mostly by poor people or those on fixed incomes.