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I personally judge a church by its authorities and foundational texts, and the authorities and foundational texts of Catholicism are uncontrovertibly in support

by Fezzik 4y ago

I personally judge a church by its authorities and foundational texts, and the authorities and foundational texts of Catholicism are uncontrovertibly in support of the notion that demons and exorcisms are real things. Heck, one of the taglines for Jesus is that he “casts out demons.” Edit: spelling (and deleted and responded to the correct comment).

s1artibartfast 4y ago
If you want to think that the pope was talking about a demon that is taking human form as an imposter in the Vatican, then I can't stop you. I think that the context of the quote clearly proves that this is wrong.
- Fezzik 4y ago
  Don’t get me wrong, I know that demons aren’t real and that anyone that thinks they are is a buffoon. But let’s not pretend the Catholic Church (the authorities and foundational texts) is not all in on believing in demons: “Chronic mental and emotional problems may be exacerbated by demons,” he says, “because the devil likes to attack us where we’re weakest. But not every problem has a demon behind it.” https://www.catholic.com/news/the-truth-about-demons https://www.catholic.com/news/the-truth-about-demons “Demons are fallen angels under the command of Satan, those who are still free after the Gen. 6 affair. Satan is called the Prince, or Ruler, of all demons in Matthew 9:34; 12:24; Mark 3:22; Luke 11:15. Demons are also called the ministers, or ambassadors of Satan, Luke 4:35; 9:1,42; John 10:21. Satan is brilliant, an administrative genius. He has an excellent organization, mentioned in Eph. 6:10-12 (READ) The Bible also makes a distinction between demon possession and demon influence.” https://www.catholic.org/saints/angels/fallen.php https://www.catholic.org/saints/angels/fallen.php “This essay discusses the nature and behavior of demons, demonic possession, and the effects of demonic activity. Rev. Michael P. Orsi provides specific indicators of demonic possession and ways to rule out mental illness and / or the free will actions of a bad person.” https://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=7370 https://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?rec... “Church officials say that rediscovered obsessions with the occult, such as with Ouija boards, paganism, and Satanism, are causing people to suffer demonic possessions at an unparalleled rate. Priests can cast out demons by the rite of exorcism, but it requires special training that few priests have. Several dioceses, particularly in Spain and Italy, are sending priests to train for spiritual warfare unlike that seen in ages - if ever.” and “We would do well to remember that Pope Francis warned, "there are those that belong to him" (referring to Satan).” https://www.catholic.org/news/hf/faith/story.php?id=53779 https://www.catholic.org/news/hf/faith/story.php?id=53779 Edit, to add: my only point is that it is not unreasonable, given what the Catholic Church actually preaches (see above), to think it was a reference to an actual demon.
Incipient 4y ago
I do agree on judging an establishment by its foundational texts, at least in part - also considering modern actions are important too to consider evolution of understanding and concepts. On the point of "casting out demons", these are old texts translated from heavily evolved languages. Literal translations are often lost (eg today how we greet others "what's up?"). However taking it on its literal meaning, if the act of casting out literal demons to make one a better person is not outdated today, is the end result not still worthy? Doctors used to bleed patients to heal fever. While that act is outdated, is trying to cure the fever no less important? (full disclosure, I am catholic, but I'm not sure what I'm trying to say)

by Fezzik 4y ago

s1artibartfast 4y ago

If you want to think that the pope was talking about a demon that is taking human form as an imposter in the Vatican, then I can't stop you. I think that the context of the quote clearly proves that this is wrong.

Fezzik 4y ago
Don’t get me wrong, I know that demons aren’t real and that anyone that thinks they are is a buffoon. But let’s not pretend the Catholic Church (the authorities and foundational texts) is not all in on believing in demons: “Chronic mental and emotional problems may be exacerbated by demons,” he says, “because the devil likes to attack us where we’re weakest. But not every problem has a demon behind it.” https://www.catholic.com/news/the-truth-about-demons https://www.catholic.com/news/the-truth-about-demons “Demons are fallen angels under the command of Satan, those who are still free after the Gen. 6 affair. Satan is called the Prince, or Ruler, of all demons in Matthew 9:34; 12:24; Mark 3:22; Luke 11:15. Demons are also called the ministers, or ambassadors of Satan, Luke 4:35; 9:1,42; John 10:21. Satan is brilliant, an administrative genius. He has an excellent organization, mentioned in Eph. 6:10-12 (READ) The Bible also makes a distinction between demon possession and demon influence.” https://www.catholic.org/saints/angels/fallen.php https://www.catholic.org/saints/angels/fallen.php “This essay discusses the nature and behavior of demons, demonic possession, and the effects of demonic activity. Rev. Michael P. Orsi provides specific indicators of demonic possession and ways to rule out mental illness and / or the free will actions of a bad person.” https://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=7370 https://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?rec... “Church officials say that rediscovered obsessions with the occult, such as with Ouija boards, paganism, and Satanism, are causing people to suffer demonic possessions at an unparalleled rate. Priests can cast out demons by the rite of exorcism, but it requires special training that few priests have. Several dioceses, particularly in Spain and Italy, are sending priests to train for spiritual warfare unlike that seen in ages - if ever.” and “We would do well to remember that Pope Francis warned, "there are those that belong to him" (referring to Satan).” https://www.catholic.org/news/hf/faith/story.php?id=53779 https://www.catholic.org/news/hf/faith/story.php?id=53779 Edit, to add: my only point is that it is not unreasonable, given what the Catholic Church actually preaches (see above), to think it was a reference to an actual demon.

Incipient 4y ago

I do agree on judging an establishment by its foundational texts, at least in part - also considering modern actions are important too to consider evolution of understanding and concepts. On the point of "casting out demons", these are old texts translated from heavily evolved languages. Literal translations are often lost (eg today how we greet others "what's up?"). However taking it on its literal meaning, if the act of casting out literal demons to make one a better person is not outdated today, is the end result not still worthy? Doctors used to bleed patients to heal fever. While that act is outdated, is trying to cure the fever no less important? (full disclosure, I am catholic, but I'm not sure what I'm trying to say)