4 ms·

Ask HN: Why aren't people medicated to fear death less?

10 points by amichail 4y ago

Isn't the fear of death a kind of torture that should be alleviated with medication?

groffee 4y ago
'If I am, then death is not. If Death is, then I am not. Why should I fear that which can only exist when I do not?' - Epicurus
- WhiteBlueSkies 4y ago
  Because the transition from alive to dead is horrible? Stoicism is good when your biggest problem in life is waiting too long for a starbucks coffee.
  - potsandpans 4y ago
    he knows from all the transitions into death hes experienced
tosc 4y ago
Do you mean people with terminal illness?
- amichail 4y ago
  No, I mean everybody who fears death regardless of whether they are ill.
  - 082349872349872 4y ago
    I wonder what makes people fearful of the time after their death but not the time before their birth?
    - coldtea 4y ago
      Since being alive is what most people cherish, time before birth is an unconscious countdown to this nice state. Whereas time before death is a conscious countdown to have it taken from you. That both times are a "period where you're not alive" isn't enough to make people treat them equally. It's the difference in context that matters. Else one might ask "why people aren't afraid of kitchen knives when they're cooking, but are when a serial killer charges at them with one?" People wouldn't give a fuck about the time after their death if it was in the past, like their time before birth always is while they are alive.
    - tosc 4y ago
      Because the time before their birth is not in the future?
  - TechBro8615 4y ago
    That sounds like a mental illness that should be treated with some sort of anti-anxiety medication. I'm not sure that medicating the general population to numb their most basic survival instincts is such a great idea. Do you want a bunch of people driving around with no fear of death? I don't... Another word for someone who doesn't fear death is "reckless."
    - WhiteBlueSkies 4y ago
      It's a mental illness not to fear death. Most don't fear it because they are ignorant about how close it is.
iwanttocomment 4y ago
I want to point out that this is a plot point of recent Netflix movie WHITE NOISE.
082349872349872 4y ago
"Remember one cubic centimetre cures ten gloomy sentiments."
- schwartzworld 4y ago
  Better a gram than a damn
type0 4y ago
Psychedelics can help with that; anguish and fear of death also makes relatives suffer all that more, it's inhumane that valuable drugs are denied and stigmatized by big pharma and gov agencies.
coldtea 4y ago
Because it sounds like a psychological/attitude issue to solve with counselling. That said, for general anxiety (which would include frequent thoughts of fear of death) there are tons of medications doctors give... And most people don't fear death that much, except rarely. I mean they might fear it when they think deep about it, but they don't care about it most of the time...
- amichail 4y ago
  I think it is rational to fear death and hence the need for medication rather than counseling.
  - coldtea 4y ago
    It's rational (in the sense death is a thing, and is coming), but it's not a natural healthy state, as people are wired to ignore it most of the time. When they can't, it points to a psychological issue, that can be numbed with medication, sure, but even better if it's solved with counselling. Else medication is a patch, but the problem is still there, the person is just numbed that they ignore it (which has its own issues, from addiction to the medication, to loss of certain functioning etc. Medication is a wide brush, it can't target "fear of death" alone with precision and leave all the rest of our functioning alone).
    - amichail 4y ago
      Convincing someone not to fear death that much is convincing someone not to be rational. I wouldn't call that a good outcome.
      - coldtea 4y ago
        On the contrary, being overly rational is an unatural and harmful state. "We'll die anyway, so why not just kill myself now" is perfectly rational too. "I should cheat everybody, including my own parents, spouse, and kids, if it benefits me materially and it's 100% certain I can get away with it", is perfectly rational also. And there are many more failure modes of rationality-only based function, a lot of which totally hurt the person doing the rational-only thinking - and literature on the matter, both scientific and philosophical. Complete rationality in all things, all the time, would result in a broken functioning and even mental illness. That's why emotions were evolutionarily developed. They are a great shortcut/heuristic to prioritize things necessary for functioning/survival without full information. It too has failure modes, but 100% rationality would be as damaging as 100% emotional decision making. But the thoughts above are about rationality in general. In this specific case, "Fear of death" as a frequent/constant thought (as opposed to something helpful to avoid an accident, or an ocassional reflection on mortality) is hardly rational. It amounts to: "Let's have a dehabilitating -to the point that I have it constantly and need medication- fear of something inevitable, that will impact the functioning and enjoying of my actual life for no productive reason at all, as I'm going to die eventually anyway. In fact it even take me to an early grave, the very thing I want to avoid, due to anxiety induced physiological issues". Does that sound rational? It sure isn't by any utilitarian measure of rationality. Einstein said (or they attributed to him, but it's a good quote anyway) "“Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results". Well, fearing death day after day, an act that will not change anything about the result, qualifies.
alx__ 4y ago
It's why people invented religion
- fargle 4y ago
  It's why people invented beer.
  - 082349872349872 4y ago
    And malt does more than Milton can To justify God's ways to man.
dudul 4y ago
"Brave New World" is not supposed to be a manual.
greggarious 4y ago
I’m the only sober man in this bar OP, they’re medicated. Self medicated :-) - Greg Sent from my iPhone
jmrm 4y ago
Shouldn't it be the opposite? Most common psychological problems are created by the hostile environment people are living on. More meds would be the equivalent of pumping up the volume on the radio on a car whose engine make more concerning and intense noises every day. Don't get me wrong, your question is totally valid and interesting, but I think we forgot we need to feel both good things and bad things not only for have a more complete experience of life, but also to value even more those good parts we have on them. If some people fear of death because they are going to die due to an illness, probably they have more pain than fear, and if they fears it due to their long are, they shouldn't: They must be doing enjoying that little or that much they have remaining.
giantg2 4y ago
"Isn't the fear of death a kind of torture that should be alleviated with medication?" Depends on the degree of fear. The general answer is "no". People who have an abnormal fear of death that interferes with their daily lives could use some sort of intervention.
vonseel 4y ago
This question reminds me of something I read in the below article. In short, overcoming fear of death is thought to be one of the steps taken on the mental journey towards suicide. Fearing death keeps us alive. https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/bering-in-mind/being-suicidal-what-it-feels-like-to-want-to-kill-yourself/ https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/bering-in-mind/being-su... Step 6: Disinhibition We’ve now set the mental stage, but it is of course the final act that separates suicidal ideation from an actual suicide. Baumeister speculates that behavioral disinhibition, which is required to overcome the intrinsic fear of causing oneself pain through death, not to mention the anticipated suffering of loved ones left behind to grieve, is another consequence of cognitive deconstruction. This is because it disallows the high-level abstractions (reflecting on the inherent “wrongness” of suicide, how others will feel, even concerns about self-preservation) that, under normal conditions, keep us alive.
ffwacom 4y ago
Fucking hell, read a book.
high_byte 4y ago
What course of medication alleviates fear of death? What are the side effects?
- high_byte 4y ago
  In all honesty I've always wondered why airlines don't offer similar services. Imagine flying under the influence of sleeping pills or anesthesia, it's basically teleportation services! I can settle for anti-anxiety meds of choice too. (microdose of psilocybin should do the trick)
racktash 4y ago
Thankfully there are much more interesting and positive ways to get over the fear of death than drugs: philosophy (existentialism etc.), humanistic psychology, religion (this one didn't work for me, but it seems to work for many people), literature.

10 points by amichail 4y ago

Isn't the fear of death a kind of torture that should be alleviated with medication?

'If I am, then death is not. If Death is, then I am not. Why should I fear that which can only exist when I do not?' - Epicurus

WhiteBlueSkies 4y ago
Because the transition from alive to dead is horrible? Stoicism is good when your biggest problem in life is waiting too long for a starbucks coffee.
- potsandpans 4y ago
  he knows from all the transitions into death hes experienced

tosc 4y ago

Do you mean people with terminal illness?

amichail 4y ago
No, I mean everybody who fears death regardless of whether they are ill.
- 082349872349872 4y ago
  I wonder what makes people fearful of the time after their death but not the time before their birth?
  - coldtea 4y ago
    Since being alive is what most people cherish, time before birth is an unconscious countdown to this nice state. Whereas time before death is a conscious countdown to have it taken from you. That both times are a "period where you're not alive" isn't enough to make people treat them equally. It's the difference in context that matters. Else one might ask "why people aren't afraid of kitchen knives when they're cooking, but are when a serial killer charges at them with one?" People wouldn't give a fuck about the time after their death if it was in the past, like their time before birth always is while they are alive.
  - tosc 4y ago
    Because the time before their birth is not in the future?
- TechBro8615 4y ago
  That sounds like a mental illness that should be treated with some sort of anti-anxiety medication. I'm not sure that medicating the general population to numb their most basic survival instincts is such a great idea. Do you want a bunch of people driving around with no fear of death? I don't... Another word for someone who doesn't fear death is "reckless."
  - WhiteBlueSkies 4y ago
    It's a mental illness not to fear death. Most don't fear it because they are ignorant about how close it is.

iwanttocomment 4y ago

I want to point out that this is a plot point of recent Netflix movie WHITE NOISE.

082349872349872 4y ago

"Remember one cubic centimetre cures ten gloomy sentiments."

schwartzworld 4y ago
Better a gram than a damn

type0 4y ago

Psychedelics can help with that; anguish and fear of death also makes relatives suffer all that more, it's inhumane that valuable drugs are denied and stigmatized by big pharma and gov agencies.

coldtea 4y ago

Because it sounds like a psychological/attitude issue to solve with counselling. That said, for general anxiety (which would include frequent thoughts of fear of death) there are tons of medications doctors give... And most people don't fear death that much, except rarely. I mean they might fear it when they think deep about it, but they don't care about it most of the time...

amichail 4y ago
I think it is rational to fear death and hence the need for medication rather than counseling.
- coldtea 4y ago
  It's rational (in the sense death is a thing, and is coming), but it's not a natural healthy state, as people are wired to ignore it most of the time. When they can't, it points to a psychological issue, that can be numbed with medication, sure, but even better if it's solved with counselling. Else medication is a patch, but the problem is still there, the person is just numbed that they ignore it (which has its own issues, from addiction to the medication, to loss of certain functioning etc. Medication is a wide brush, it can't target "fear of death" alone with precision and leave all the rest of our functioning alone).
  - amichail 4y ago
    Convincing someone not to fear death that much is convincing someone not to be rational. I wouldn't call that a good outcome.
    - coldtea 4y ago
      On the contrary, being overly rational is an unatural and harmful state. "We'll die anyway, so why not just kill myself now" is perfectly rational too. "I should cheat everybody, including my own parents, spouse, and kids, if it benefits me materially and it's 100% certain I can get away with it", is perfectly rational also. And there are many more failure modes of rationality-only based function, a lot of which totally hurt the person doing the rational-only thinking - and literature on the matter, both scientific and philosophical. Complete rationality in all things, all the time, would result in a broken functioning and even mental illness. That's why emotions were evolutionarily developed. They are a great shortcut/heuristic to prioritize things necessary for functioning/survival without full information. It too has failure modes, but 100% rationality would be as damaging as 100% emotional decision making. But the thoughts above are about rationality in general. In this specific case, "Fear of death" as a frequent/constant thought (as opposed to something helpful to avoid an accident, or an ocassional reflection on mortality) is hardly rational. It amounts to: "Let's have a dehabilitating -to the point that I have it constantly and need medication- fear of something inevitable, that will impact the functioning and enjoying of my actual life for no productive reason at all, as I'm going to die eventually anyway. In fact it even take me to an early grave, the very thing I want to avoid, due to anxiety induced physiological issues". Does that sound rational? It sure isn't by any utilitarian measure of rationality. Einstein said (or they attributed to him, but it's a good quote anyway) "“Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results". Well, fearing death day after day, an act that will not change anything about the result, qualifies.

alx__ 4y ago

It's why people invented religion

fargle 4y ago
It's why people invented beer.
- 082349872349872 4y ago
  And malt does more than Milton can To justify God's ways to man.

dudul 4y ago

"Brave New World" is not supposed to be a manual.

greggarious 4y ago

I’m the only sober man in this bar OP, they’re medicated. Self medicated :-) - Greg Sent from my iPhone

jmrm 4y ago

Shouldn't it be the opposite? Most common psychological problems are created by the hostile environment people are living on. More meds would be the equivalent of pumping up the volume on the radio on a car whose engine make more concerning and intense noises every day. Don't get me wrong, your question is totally valid and interesting, but I think we forgot we need to feel both good things and bad things not only for have a more complete experience of life, but also to value even more those good parts we have on them. If some people fear of death because they are going to die due to an illness, probably they have more pain than fear, and if they fears it due to their long are, they shouldn't: They must be doing enjoying that little or that much they have remaining.

giantg2 4y ago

"Isn't the fear of death a kind of torture that should be alleviated with medication?" Depends on the degree of fear. The general answer is "no". People who have an abnormal fear of death that interferes with their daily lives could use some sort of intervention.

vonseel 4y ago

This question reminds me of something I read in the below article. In short, overcoming fear of death is thought to be one of the steps taken on the mental journey towards suicide. Fearing death keeps us alive. https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/bering-in-mind/being-suicidal-what-it-feels-like-to-want-to-kill-yourself/ https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/bering-in-mind/being-su... Step 6: Disinhibition We’ve now set the mental stage, but it is of course the final act that separates suicidal ideation from an actual suicide. Baumeister speculates that behavioral disinhibition, which is required to overcome the intrinsic fear of causing oneself pain through death, not to mention the anticipated suffering of loved ones left behind to grieve, is another consequence of cognitive deconstruction. This is because it disallows the high-level abstractions (reflecting on the inherent “wrongness” of suicide, how others will feel, even concerns about self-preservation) that, under normal conditions, keep us alive.

ffwacom 4y ago

Fucking hell, read a book.

high_byte 4y ago

What course of medication alleviates fear of death? What are the side effects?

high_byte 4y ago
In all honesty I've always wondered why airlines don't offer similar services. Imagine flying under the influence of sleeping pills or anesthesia, it's basically teleportation services! I can settle for anti-anxiety meds of choice too. (microdose of psilocybin should do the trick)

racktash 4y ago

Thankfully there are much more interesting and positive ways to get over the fear of death than drugs: philosophy (existentialism etc.), humanistic psychology, religion (this one didn't work for me, but it seems to work for many people), literature.