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I don’t understand your lack of empathy. I agree: It’s a pathetic act of plagiarism and he should fail the class for it. If he didn’t, then his teachers made a

by ugh 15y ago

I don’t understand your lack of empathy. I agree: It’s a pathetic act of plagiarism and he should fail the class for it. If he didn’t, then his teachers made a serious mistake. If he could get away with it, then that’s pretty fucked up. If this is a one time thing I see no reason not to forgive it after he has failed the class. And if it’s not a one time thing he would fail classes all the time and he wouldn’t be able to get a degree anyway. That’s assuming his teachers are competent. That’s all I’m saying.

DanBC 15y ago
If it was just a one time thing (caused by some traumatic event in his personal life) then sure, it was stupid but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. People do weird things when they're stressed, and sometimes those things are not just weird but bad. But, now he's been caught cheating the once, maybe his other work needs to get a little bit more scrutiny? And maybe his tutors need a bit of support to catch and punish those who cheat? (I've read up-thread about the reasons why punishing for plagiarism is hard). Some people are saying this essay is ridiculous. I know very little about history or the Magna Carta (I'm English; we don't care about that any more) so I have no idea if it's just bad, or really awful. I really want to know how would it compare to honest papers from his colleagues, or to a great paper from someone at that level?
- tankenmate 15y ago
  Although large sections of the Magna Carta have been repealed over the larger part of a millenia, it could be easily argued that the most important parts of the Magna Carta Act are the ones that are still in force. To be English and say that you don't care about the Magna Carta Act is almost tantamount to saying that you don't care about justice; maybe that is your point. The Magna Carta was the point at which England ceased to be a despotism; an absolute monarchy. If the Magna Carta was to be fully repealed without legislation that was morally equivalent to replace it, the justice system in England, and probably the rest of the UK, would come to a halt.
  - DanBC 15y ago
    England has detention without charge, let alone trial. It starts with 14 days, but extends to 28 days. People keep wanting to push it to longer; 48 days and 90 days are commonly heard desires. (http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2008/jun/10/terrorism.uksecurity1?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487 http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2008/jun/10/terrorism.uks...) There's a whole bunch of stuff under counter-terrorism law that pretty much tramples over Magna Carta rights.
    - tankenmate 15y ago
      I think you might be thinking of Habeas Corpus, which came about in part through common law and later in the form of the Habeas Corpus Act, some 400 years later than the Magna Carta Act. The most important part of the Magna Carta Act is the guarantee that you will be tried by your peers. In civil cases at the moment in the UK there is a strong resistance to have secret evidence even though the current Justice Minister suggests that some evidence should be withheld from the accused! So common law cases, like Habeas Corpus actions, are still tried in front of your peers with open evidence. This may change if Ken Clarke, and according to some accounts lobbying from the US CIA, have their way.

by ugh 15y ago

DanBC 15y ago

If it was just a one time thing (caused by some traumatic event in his personal life) then sure, it was stupid but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. People do weird things when they're stressed, and sometimes those things are not just weird but bad. But, now he's been caught cheating the once, maybe his other work needs to get a little bit more scrutiny? And maybe his tutors need a bit of support to catch and punish those who cheat? (I've read up-thread about the reasons why punishing for plagiarism is hard). Some people are saying this essay is ridiculous. I know very little about history or the Magna Carta (I'm English; we don't care about that any more) so I have no idea if it's just bad, or really awful. I really want to know how would it compare to honest papers from his colleagues, or to a great paper from someone at that level?

tankenmate 15y ago
Although large sections of the Magna Carta have been repealed over the larger part of a millenia, it could be easily argued that the most important parts of the Magna Carta Act are the ones that are still in force. To be English and say that you don't care about the Magna Carta Act is almost tantamount to saying that you don't care about justice; maybe that is your point. The Magna Carta was the point at which England ceased to be a despotism; an absolute monarchy. If the Magna Carta was to be fully repealed without legislation that was morally equivalent to replace it, the justice system in England, and probably the rest of the UK, would come to a halt.
- DanBC 15y ago
  England has detention without charge, let alone trial. It starts with 14 days, but extends to 28 days. People keep wanting to push it to longer; 48 days and 90 days are commonly heard desires. (http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2008/jun/10/terrorism.uksecurity1?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487 http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2008/jun/10/terrorism.uks...) There's a whole bunch of stuff under counter-terrorism law that pretty much tramples over Magna Carta rights.
  - tankenmate 15y ago
    I think you might be thinking of Habeas Corpus, which came about in part through common law and later in the form of the Habeas Corpus Act, some 400 years later than the Magna Carta Act. The most important part of the Magna Carta Act is the guarantee that you will be tried by your peers. In civil cases at the moment in the UK there is a strong resistance to have secret evidence even though the current Justice Minister suggests that some evidence should be withheld from the accused! So common law cases, like Habeas Corpus actions, are still tried in front of your peers with open evidence. This may change if Ken Clarke, and according to some accounts lobbying from the US CIA, have their way.