5 ms·

Not sure I agree. You, as with most critics actually, seem to be asserting there are clear "quality" lines to be drawn between great novels. IMO we're into the

Not sure I agree. You, as with most critics actually, seem to be asserting there are clear "quality" lines to be drawn between great novels. IMO we're into the realm of subjectivity here and it's really up to the reader to decide what they like. I didn't like Tender is the Night too much, and I love Hemingway's novels more than his stories (generally), chiefly The Sun Also Rises and For Whom the Bell Tolls. Do I know better than you or do famous critics know better than me? I don't think so.

eternalban 4y ago
You are denying that writing is an art that has its own inherent (~objective) system of evaluation that transcends the grasp/reading of a specific reader. The individual reader is entitled to its opinion, but any given school of criticism within the confines of the discipline (here writing) is also entitled to its professional assessment of the work. We make distinction between great and good code. We celebrate certain software at the source code level. And what should we think of say someone who has never written a line of code telling us that there are no clear lines separating source codes and dismiss us as "critics". Mencken gave a professional review. He rated the story as banal, but true to the scene depicted. He rated the character development as spotty. But he seemed pretty excited about the crafting of the sentences and pages. Now this here is something that will likely escape the notice of the general reader (they may just 'like it a lot' but won't be able to tell you why) but a pro like Mencken zeroes in on that.
proxyon 4y ago
Good art is not entirely subjective
poulsbohemian 4y ago
> I love Hemingway's novels more than his stories (generally), chiefly The Sun Also Rises and For Whom the Bell Tolls. I think it's in some ways unfortunate the way we have high school students ready things like A Farewell to Arms, maybe For Whom the Bell Tools, or Old Man and the Sea, rather than for example, moving students through more of a progression. For example, you read The Nick Adams stories that Hemingway used as almost "notes" for his later works. There's something gritty and unrefined about the stories, but you can see Hemingway starting to build a style. Islands in the Stream, published posthumously, is more of an insight into how the writer worked than a complete, finished novel. If we are going claim to your students that this Hemingway guy was the great writer of the 20th century, we should at least owe it to them to really demonstrate why.

eternalban 4y ago

You are denying that writing is an art that has its own inherent (~objective) system of evaluation that transcends the grasp/reading of a specific reader. The individual reader is entitled to its opinion, but any given school of criticism within the confines of the discipline (here writing) is also entitled to its professional assessment of the work. We make distinction between great and good code. We celebrate certain software at the source code level. And what should we think of say someone who has never written a line of code telling us that there are no clear lines separating source codes and dismiss us as "critics". Mencken gave a professional review. He rated the story as banal, but true to the scene depicted. He rated the character development as spotty. But he seemed pretty excited about the crafting of the sentences and pages. Now this here is something that will likely escape the notice of the general reader (they may just 'like it a lot' but won't be able to tell you why) but a pro like Mencken zeroes in on that.

proxyon 4y ago

Good art is not entirely subjective

poulsbohemian 4y ago

> I love Hemingway's novels more than his stories (generally), chiefly The Sun Also Rises and For Whom the Bell Tolls. I think it's in some ways unfortunate the way we have high school students ready things like A Farewell to Arms, maybe For Whom the Bell Tools, or Old Man and the Sea, rather than for example, moving students through more of a progression. For example, you read The Nick Adams stories that Hemingway used as almost "notes" for his later works. There's something gritty and unrefined about the stories, but you can see Hemingway starting to build a style. Islands in the Stream, published posthumously, is more of an insight into how the writer worked than a complete, finished novel. If we are going claim to your students that this Hemingway guy was the great writer of the 20th century, we should at least owe it to them to really demonstrate why.