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In general I agree with you in regards to accusations vs. due process. But in a plagiarism case like this, it's hard to imagine a situation in which the accusat

In general I agree with you in regards to accusations vs. due process. But in a plagiarism case like this, it's hard to imagine a situation in which the accusation isn't true. If the essay was factual, the student could claim that the similarity between the essays was coincidental, but an essay which just happens to contain the same made-up facts as the original? That's proof enough for me.

raganwald 15y ago
How is it proof enough for you when you haven’t even heard what this wretched person has to say in their defence? Imagine you were a juror. Having heard the prosecution, would you tell the defence that they are wasting their breath calling their own witnesses? I don’t know if you intended to scare me out of my skin, but I find that phrase chilling. Men have been lynched and hanged without trial given that very same sentiment.
- dandelany 15y ago
  Maybe you're right and I'm being a bit heavy-handed here. But if I painted a painting or released a song that showed up in someone else's portfolio, I wouldn't think twice about writing a blog post naming them. This doesn't really seem much different to me. Accusing someone of plagiarism on the Internet and sentencing someone to death are such completely different scenarios that I have a hard time comparing the two. edit: Upon further reflection, I do think that creating a honeypot essay for the sole purpose of shaming whoever copies it does seem rather malicious to me. However, I'm speaking more about the general case of publicly naming plagiarists than this particular witch-hunt.
  - raganwald 15y ago
    I think we’re talking at cross purposes. I agree that a lynch mob is a heavy-handed comparison. I am trying to speak to what we do when we encounter the accusation, rather than whether the accusation should be made. I amy not be clear about that, and of course I may not be right.
    - dandelany 15y ago
      Agreed. Thanks for clarifying.
- philwelch 15y ago
  I wouldn't hang this guy from a tree if that's what you're asking.
FuzzyDunlop 15y ago
In terms of discussion and priority, I find it hard to give a plagiarism case equal worth to any number of social and political controversies that grace the front page of HN, or any reputable news site for that matter. Plagiarism is a matter for the plagiarist, their employer or their institution, and the person whose work was copied (at a stretch). It's not the responsibility of a vigilante or a mob to chase up and vilify someone who has made an entirely academic mistake, deliberately or not. That it's proof enough for you, or me, or anyone in this thread, is irrelevant, unless you're one of the three aforementioned parties involved. What influence do you or I have on their academic conduct? That's the teacher's, tutor's, or lecturer's job. And since I'm overlooking the fact that plagiarism in itself is a form of copyright infringement, I'll posit this: people are against SOPA because it bypasses due process and presumes guilt, as decided entirely by the self-certified victim. How is a name-and-shame post like this, where the accused has had no opportunity to defend themselves or explain, any better? Were they even made aware of this beforehand? Does anyone even know under what circumstances this happened either? Because an undergrad copying an article means absolutely nothing compared to a PhD doing the same.

raganwald 15y ago

How is it proof enough for you when you haven’t even heard what this wretched person has to say in their defence? Imagine you were a juror. Having heard the prosecution, would you tell the defence that they are wasting their breath calling their own witnesses? I don’t know if you intended to scare me out of my skin, but I find that phrase chilling. Men have been lynched and hanged without trial given that very same sentiment.

dandelany 15y ago
Maybe you're right and I'm being a bit heavy-handed here. But if I painted a painting or released a song that showed up in someone else's portfolio, I wouldn't think twice about writing a blog post naming them. This doesn't really seem much different to me. Accusing someone of plagiarism on the Internet and sentencing someone to death are such completely different scenarios that I have a hard time comparing the two. edit: Upon further reflection, I do think that creating a honeypot essay for the sole purpose of shaming whoever copies it does seem rather malicious to me. However, I'm speaking more about the general case of publicly naming plagiarists than this particular witch-hunt.
- raganwald 15y ago
  I think we’re talking at cross purposes. I agree that a lynch mob is a heavy-handed comparison. I am trying to speak to what we do when we encounter the accusation, rather than whether the accusation should be made. I amy not be clear about that, and of course I may not be right.
  - dandelany 15y ago
    Agreed. Thanks for clarifying.
philwelch 15y ago
I wouldn't hang this guy from a tree if that's what you're asking.

FuzzyDunlop 15y ago

In terms of discussion and priority, I find it hard to give a plagiarism case equal worth to any number of social and political controversies that grace the front page of HN, or any reputable news site for that matter. Plagiarism is a matter for the plagiarist, their employer or their institution, and the person whose work was copied (at a stretch). It's not the responsibility of a vigilante or a mob to chase up and vilify someone who has made an entirely academic mistake, deliberately or not. That it's proof enough for you, or me, or anyone in this thread, is irrelevant, unless you're one of the three aforementioned parties involved. What influence do you or I have on their academic conduct? That's the teacher's, tutor's, or lecturer's job. And since I'm overlooking the fact that plagiarism in itself is a form of copyright infringement, I'll posit this: people are against SOPA because it bypasses due process and presumes guilt, as decided entirely by the self-certified victim. How is a name-and-shame post like this, where the accused has had no opportunity to defend themselves or explain, any better? Were they even made aware of this beforehand? Does anyone even know under what circumstances this happened either? Because an undergrad copying an article means absolutely nothing compared to a PhD doing the same.