4 ms·

Cops Cast Doubt on Musk’s Claim That ‘Crazy Stalker’ Followed His Son

60 points by greyface- 4y ago

t_sawyer 4y ago
I'm losing track on when we should trust cops to ignore or doubt things and when we shouldn't.
- the_cat_kittles 4y ago
  when they stand to gain / justify bloated budgets, they are probably lying. when they have nothing to gain, and contradict the worlds least reliable source, they are probably not lying.
- atoav 4y ago
  Easy: If the cops tell me water is wet I trust them. If they tell me to not trust my own eyes when they do something wrong I don't. Cops in the US operate under perverse incentives. Knowing these incentives will help you to decide when you can consider trusting their statements and when you can not.
  - wittycardio 4y ago
    Elon simps are slow they don't really understand conditional logic.
- res0nat0r 4y ago
  Don't even really need to in this case, as some Bellingcat users tracked down where the photo was taken: https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/1603454821700452365?s=20 https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/1603454821700452365?...
- 323 4y ago
  You don't need to trust them. The cops love to arrest people, especially in a high-profile incident. They didn't arrest anyone in this case.
- bandyaboot 4y ago
  It's not something you really need to keep track of. The recommended approach is to use your brain and consider all of the context available to you on a case by case basis. But I suspect this is more about not wanting to accept the ever increasing evidence that Elon's characterization of what happened was largely a farce.
- seanhunter 4y ago
  Perhaps that's good. This could be an opportunity to engage your own critical thinking and rather than just blindly trusting or distrusting anyone you evaluate the facts for yourself.
- Zigurd 4y ago
  Nobody was willing to sign their name to a report saying any member of Elon's family encountered a stalker. Reporters, who were then banned from Twitter, had already determined the time of the video was not close to any flights, nor was the location close to an airport. You should not trust the cops. Get more info.
downrightmike 4y ago
He's pretty deranged already. All he has to do to be a super villain is hold the IIS resupply missions hostage for $44 Billion.
- kelseyfrog 4y ago
  I'm not seeing that play out in a way that works in his benefit. Resupply missions like CRS-2 involve contractual agreements. In this case it is a legal agreement between Space Exploration Inc and NASA[1]. If SpaceX was found to be in breech of the contract, I'm confident for a reason such as(or perceived to be) "Musk wants to extort the US Government to make up a $44B shortfall on a loan for Twitter," that a judge would compel him under threat of contempt of court[2] for failure to comply with a lawful court order. Maybe that's where we differ, but I don't think he's so deranged that he would go to jail for six months over it. Besides, the next person in charge, seeing Musk imprisoned and without the same incentives, would easily comply, leaving Musk with a punishment for literally no monetary gain. 1. For example https://www.defensedaily.com/wp-content/uploads/post_attachment/145634.pdf https://www.defensedaily.com/wp-content/uploads/post_attachm... 2. Punishable in CA with up to six months in jail https://www.shouselaw.com/ca/defense/penal-code/166/ https://www.shouselaw.com/ca/defense/penal-code/166/
  - jacquesm 4y ago
    I'm pretty sure that would result in instant nationalization of SpaceX under NASA oversight. There is no way the US would let that happen.
    - mhh__ 4y ago
      Being unpopular and the company being private also makes it easier for the US gov to get away with it.
berenza 4y ago
FTA: "In a press release on Tuesday, the South Pasadena Police Department outlined a different set of facts, declaring at first that “detectives do not believe Mr. Musk or any member of his family were present during the confrontation,” which Deputy City Manager Domenica Megerdichian confirmed in a phone call with The Daily Beast. Soon after, the department released an updated press release, which simply stated that Musk wasn’t present during the incident." sounds like the "detectives" working on this don't even know who was there. It would be nice to see the actual press releases.
- rsynnott 4y ago
  Those don't seem _different_, as such; just a clarification. "We don't think [X] happened, but we'll have to confirm" followed by "We checked, [X] did not happen" isn't a particularly unreasonable stance.
  - anthlax 4y ago
    Disagree - “Musk or any family member” vs “Musk” are fundamentally different - the first implies none of his family was present. The second could be seen as “we discovered a family member of musk was present, but musk was not”
fiat_fandango 4y ago
The irony of the HN crowd struggling to direct rage at either cops or Elon is hilarious. Moreso HN crowd "supporting police" is quite frankly the very definition of cope. I'm somewhat moderate and I definitely do not trust cops and do not appreciate their presence in my neighborhood or around my home. I get it, it's a hard job, but at least attempt to solve heinous crimes - for instance, a robber shot a handgun 12 times and the police simply threw their hands up saying "yeah, we just cant find that guy" even though a neighbor had clear video evidence of the license plate and individual attempting to walk up to their garage.
- dang 4y ago
  "Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community." It's reliably a marker of bad comments and worse threads. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- thefurdrake 4y ago
  I'm not seeing a lot of struggle here in this thread. Did you post this on the wrong thread? At worst, I'm seeing some people have an opinion, others disagree, and most of them manage to stay above the quality of your opening sentence.

60 points by greyface- 4y ago

t_sawyer 4y ago

I'm losing track on when we should trust cops to ignore or doubt things and when we shouldn't.

the_cat_kittles 4y ago
when they stand to gain / justify bloated budgets, they are probably lying. when they have nothing to gain, and contradict the worlds least reliable source, they are probably not lying.
atoav 4y ago
Easy: If the cops tell me water is wet I trust them. If they tell me to not trust my own eyes when they do something wrong I don't. Cops in the US operate under perverse incentives. Knowing these incentives will help you to decide when you can consider trusting their statements and when you can not.
- wittycardio 4y ago
  Elon simps are slow they don't really understand conditional logic.
res0nat0r 4y ago
Don't even really need to in this case, as some Bellingcat users tracked down where the photo was taken: https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/1603454821700452365?s=20 https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/1603454821700452365?...
323 4y ago
You don't need to trust them. The cops love to arrest people, especially in a high-profile incident. They didn't arrest anyone in this case.
bandyaboot 4y ago
It's not something you really need to keep track of. The recommended approach is to use your brain and consider all of the context available to you on a case by case basis. But I suspect this is more about not wanting to accept the ever increasing evidence that Elon's characterization of what happened was largely a farce.
seanhunter 4y ago
Perhaps that's good. This could be an opportunity to engage your own critical thinking and rather than just blindly trusting or distrusting anyone you evaluate the facts for yourself.
Zigurd 4y ago
Nobody was willing to sign their name to a report saying any member of Elon's family encountered a stalker. Reporters, who were then banned from Twitter, had already determined the time of the video was not close to any flights, nor was the location close to an airport. You should not trust the cops. Get more info.

downrightmike 4y ago

He's pretty deranged already. All he has to do to be a super villain is hold the IIS resupply missions hostage for $44 Billion.

kelseyfrog 4y ago
I'm not seeing that play out in a way that works in his benefit. Resupply missions like CRS-2 involve contractual agreements. In this case it is a legal agreement between Space Exploration Inc and NASA[1]. If SpaceX was found to be in breech of the contract, I'm confident for a reason such as(or perceived to be) "Musk wants to extort the US Government to make up a $44B shortfall on a loan for Twitter," that a judge would compel him under threat of contempt of court[2] for failure to comply with a lawful court order. Maybe that's where we differ, but I don't think he's so deranged that he would go to jail for six months over it. Besides, the next person in charge, seeing Musk imprisoned and without the same incentives, would easily comply, leaving Musk with a punishment for literally no monetary gain. 1. For example https://www.defensedaily.com/wp-content/uploads/post_attachment/145634.pdf https://www.defensedaily.com/wp-content/uploads/post_attachm... 2. Punishable in CA with up to six months in jail https://www.shouselaw.com/ca/defense/penal-code/166/ https://www.shouselaw.com/ca/defense/penal-code/166/
- jacquesm 4y ago
  I'm pretty sure that would result in instant nationalization of SpaceX under NASA oversight. There is no way the US would let that happen.
  - mhh__ 4y ago
    Being unpopular and the company being private also makes it easier for the US gov to get away with it.

berenza 4y ago

FTA: "In a press release on Tuesday, the South Pasadena Police Department outlined a different set of facts, declaring at first that “detectives do not believe Mr. Musk or any member of his family were present during the confrontation,” which Deputy City Manager Domenica Megerdichian confirmed in a phone call with The Daily Beast. Soon after, the department released an updated press release, which simply stated that Musk wasn’t present during the incident." sounds like the "detectives" working on this don't even know who was there. It would be nice to see the actual press releases.

rsynnott 4y ago
Those don't seem _different_, as such; just a clarification. "We don't think [X] happened, but we'll have to confirm" followed by "We checked, [X] did not happen" isn't a particularly unreasonable stance.
- anthlax 4y ago
  Disagree - “Musk or any family member” vs “Musk” are fundamentally different - the first implies none of his family was present. The second could be seen as “we discovered a family member of musk was present, but musk was not”

fiat_fandango 4y ago

The irony of the HN crowd struggling to direct rage at either cops or Elon is hilarious. Moreso HN crowd "supporting police" is quite frankly the very definition of cope. I'm somewhat moderate and I definitely do not trust cops and do not appreciate their presence in my neighborhood or around my home. I get it, it's a hard job, but at least attempt to solve heinous crimes - for instance, a robber shot a handgun 12 times and the police simply threw their hands up saying "yeah, we just cant find that guy" even though a neighbor had clear video evidence of the license plate and individual attempting to walk up to their garage.

dang 4y ago
"Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community." It's reliably a marker of bad comments and worse threads. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
thefurdrake 4y ago
I'm not seeing a lot of struggle here in this thread. Did you post this on the wrong thread? At worst, I'm seeing some people have an opinion, others disagree, and most of them manage to stay above the quality of your opening sentence.