11 ms·

The Female Gaze

31 points by WallyFunk 4y ago

KingLancelot 4y ago
Fatnino 4y ago
Is this part of that metaverse thing?
DIVx0 4y ago
Giving the subject "agency" from a handful of preselected poses and backgrounds seems like no agency at all and is forcing a predetermined outcome. I don't know when this was created but I wonder if a new StableDiffusion (w/dreambooth) powered version would be more interesting since the observer/editor gives their interpretation of "female gaze" for the subject VS what the author tells what agency is. It would be illustrative to see where the public matches or deviates from the author's perspective.
vagabund 4y ago
This is cartoonishly bad, from conception to execution.
- antiquark 4y ago
  It's also based on straw-manning the entire culture. "Artists are all men, and they all portray women as docile." This is pure BS, based on even a brief reflection on the matter.
bunabhucan 4y ago
https://www.adsoftheworld.com/campaigns/the-female-gaze https://www.adsoftheworld.com/campaigns/the-female-gaze https://kunsthalcharlottenborg.dk/en/aktuelt/2022/08/30/create-your-own-version-of-historic-painting-in-unique-vr-experience-at-kunsthal-charlottenborg/ https://kunsthalcharlottenborg.dk/en/aktuelt/2022/08/30/crea...
torben-friis 4y ago
I used to work for a “10 guys in a garage” kind of start up. We made virtual reality demos for potential products for clients, marketing events, etc. That was 10 years ago, with an incredible low-budget, and all juniors mostly out of uni. I’m surprised at how little our past products differ from what meta is doing right now with enough budget to form a country.
dijit 4y ago
There is a strong implication that only men are artists, photographers etc; and thus women are depicted not as they are. This is wrong on two levels On the first level: there absolutely are women painters, photographers and artists, throughout history. Élisabeth Vigée Le Brun almost exclusively painted women and was a large influence on the depictions of women throughout the remainder of the 18th, the 19th and even 20th century. On the second level: outside observation is a valid truth, what one person sees is not the same as that person themselves sees. There was a hair dye ad in the 90s that covered this notion pretty nicely: a man is riding up an escalator feeling himself quite handsome, believing that his grey hair makes him look distinguished! A woman rides down the escalator, they lock eyes, she thinks he looks tired and unkempt. The things we see as strengths can be seen as weaknesses and the things we see as weaknesses can be seen as strengths; but a self-portrait is rarely true to what people actually see.
- preommr 4y ago
  > I'm going to flag it because I know the flame war that's coming. That's not a valid reason to flag a post.
  - dijit 4y ago
    1) Yes it is, content moderation is everyones job here. 2) I could also say that it's misleading, and flag it for that reason. If there is something intellectually curious in the content submitted: then I'm wrong. As it stands it reads like bait to attract controversy for the sake of advertising. *EDIT:* After reading the HN guidelines I've removed that line. Third line from the bottom of the page says not to mention if you flag, likely to avoid conversations like this one: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - neopw 4y ago
    Dang downranks controversial stuff from the homepage, locks comments, etc all the time.
- maxbond 4y ago
  Worth considering that in the example you cited, the outside observer reduced and derided the subject, took something they viewed as reflective of their rich inner life and a product of their experience and chose to view it as contemptible. And so the subject presumably decided to buy the hair dye to erase this part of themselves. Outside observation is a truth, but it is overvalued in our society. Our emphasis on it leads us to pressure people into conforming to arbitrary standards and narrows the human experience.
preommr 4y ago
The lack of focus and clear leadership is part of the reason I am doubtful about Meta being able to execute it's vision even though I am very optimistic about VR. This is an art piece so I think it's worth giving a lot of slack, even though imo it's very flawed in it's execution of it's base premise. However, that meta decides to associate itself with things like this is a bigger problem. The quality required to traverse a controversial and loaded area like this isn't there and somebody at Meta should've known better.
Noumenon72 4y ago
What is it? I clicked on the floor, the viewpoint moved. It seemed to be a static 3-D view. The tutorial said you could change where the lighting came from but that didn't seem interesting, so I quit. The "female gaze" stuff didn't tell me what to expect it to do.
Camisa 4y ago
I love when people unite technology and art. Its duality reminds me of the of the the useful and the pretty, the male and the female. I thank those who were involved in its creation as it is a nice concept. I liked the controls, they are impressively intuitive. It could have more knobs, or more individual movement of the elements of the scene so that we could have even more flexibility. I can't help but notice the bitterness associated with men in this piece though. It seems to indicate that men taint the image of women with an incomplete representations of their personhood when they manifest their "Male Gaze" into art. Since I am one of those wretched beings I will defend my perspective: men of these times saw things worth preserving. You might not like it but that's not the point. And it seems that we overloaded the servers with submissions or something because I got an error submitting my picture. It was a nice experience still.
aimor 4y ago
I love these kinds of demos, and it's cool seeing them on the web (again). There's joy in doing a creative exercise and sharing the results with each other. I see it here and there: sharing Advent of Code solutions is a big one right now, or TikTok trends, making "meme" images isn't far from photoshop contests or caption contests from long ago. The recent AI tools have been great about getting people involved in a process. But on the whole the web still feels very unidirectional right now, most interaction is limited to forums and comments sections (I lump social media in here). I'd like that to change, include visitors in creative processes, invite participation instead of passive consumption.

The Female Gaze

31 points by WallyFunk 4y ago

KingLancelot 4y ago

Fatnino 4y ago

Is this part of that metaverse thing?

DIVx0 4y ago

Giving the subject "agency" from a handful of preselected poses and backgrounds seems like no agency at all and is forcing a predetermined outcome. I don't know when this was created but I wonder if a new StableDiffusion (w/dreambooth) powered version would be more interesting since the observer/editor gives their interpretation of "female gaze" for the subject VS what the author tells what agency is. It would be illustrative to see where the public matches or deviates from the author's perspective.

vagabund 4y ago

This is cartoonishly bad, from conception to execution.

antiquark 4y ago
It's also based on straw-manning the entire culture. "Artists are all men, and they all portray women as docile." This is pure BS, based on even a brief reflection on the matter.

bunabhucan 4y ago

https://www.adsoftheworld.com/campaigns/the-female-gaze https://www.adsoftheworld.com/campaigns/the-female-gaze https://kunsthalcharlottenborg.dk/en/aktuelt/2022/08/30/create-your-own-version-of-historic-painting-in-unique-vr-experience-at-kunsthal-charlottenborg/ https://kunsthalcharlottenborg.dk/en/aktuelt/2022/08/30/crea...

torben-friis 4y ago

I used to work for a “10 guys in a garage” kind of start up. We made virtual reality demos for potential products for clients, marketing events, etc. That was 10 years ago, with an incredible low-budget, and all juniors mostly out of uni. I’m surprised at how little our past products differ from what meta is doing right now with enough budget to form a country.

dijit 4y ago

There is a strong implication that only men are artists, photographers etc; and thus women are depicted not as they are. This is wrong on two levels On the first level: there absolutely are women painters, photographers and artists, throughout history. Élisabeth Vigée Le Brun almost exclusively painted women and was a large influence on the depictions of women throughout the remainder of the 18th, the 19th and even 20th century. On the second level: outside observation is a valid truth, what one person sees is not the same as that person themselves sees. There was a hair dye ad in the 90s that covered this notion pretty nicely: a man is riding up an escalator feeling himself quite handsome, believing that his grey hair makes him look distinguished! A woman rides down the escalator, they lock eyes, she thinks he looks tired and unkempt. The things we see as strengths can be seen as weaknesses and the things we see as weaknesses can be seen as strengths; but a self-portrait is rarely true to what people actually see.

preommr 4y ago
> I'm going to flag it because I know the flame war that's coming. That's not a valid reason to flag a post.
- dijit 4y ago
  1) Yes it is, content moderation is everyones job here. 2) I could also say that it's misleading, and flag it for that reason. If there is something intellectually curious in the content submitted: then I'm wrong. As it stands it reads like bait to attract controversy for the sake of advertising. *EDIT:* After reading the HN guidelines I've removed that line. Third line from the bottom of the page says not to mention if you flag, likely to avoid conversations like this one: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- neopw 4y ago
  Dang downranks controversial stuff from the homepage, locks comments, etc all the time.
maxbond 4y ago
Worth considering that in the example you cited, the outside observer reduced and derided the subject, took something they viewed as reflective of their rich inner life and a product of their experience and chose to view it as contemptible. And so the subject presumably decided to buy the hair dye to erase this part of themselves. Outside observation is a truth, but it is overvalued in our society. Our emphasis on it leads us to pressure people into conforming to arbitrary standards and narrows the human experience.

preommr 4y ago

The lack of focus and clear leadership is part of the reason I am doubtful about Meta being able to execute it's vision even though I am very optimistic about VR. This is an art piece so I think it's worth giving a lot of slack, even though imo it's very flawed in it's execution of it's base premise. However, that meta decides to associate itself with things like this is a bigger problem. The quality required to traverse a controversial and loaded area like this isn't there and somebody at Meta should've known better.

Noumenon72 4y ago

What is it? I clicked on the floor, the viewpoint moved. It seemed to be a static 3-D view. The tutorial said you could change where the lighting came from but that didn't seem interesting, so I quit. The "female gaze" stuff didn't tell me what to expect it to do.

Camisa 4y ago

I love when people unite technology and art. Its duality reminds me of the of the the useful and the pretty, the male and the female. I thank those who were involved in its creation as it is a nice concept. I liked the controls, they are impressively intuitive. It could have more knobs, or more individual movement of the elements of the scene so that we could have even more flexibility. I can't help but notice the bitterness associated with men in this piece though. It seems to indicate that men taint the image of women with an incomplete representations of their personhood when they manifest their "Male Gaze" into art. Since I am one of those wretched beings I will defend my perspective: men of these times saw things worth preserving. You might not like it but that's not the point. And it seems that we overloaded the servers with submissions or something because I got an error submitting my picture. It was a nice experience still.

aimor 4y ago

I love these kinds of demos, and it's cool seeing them on the web (again). There's joy in doing a creative exercise and sharing the results with each other. I see it here and there: sharing Advent of Code solutions is a big one right now, or TikTok trends, making "meme" images isn't far from photoshop contests or caption contests from long ago. The recent AI tools have been great about getting people involved in a process. But on the whole the web still feels very unidirectional right now, most interaction is limited to forums and comments sections (I lump social media in here). I'd like that to change, include visitors in creative processes, invite participation instead of passive consumption.