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Musk ruining Twitter may be bad for his wallet, but actually good for the Freedom of speech in a way he didn't expect. The world doesn't need a platform ruled b

Musk ruining Twitter may be bad for his wallet, but actually good for the Freedom of speech in a way he didn't expect. The world doesn't need a platform ruled by people who know better. It needs decentralized means of communication where censorship is just technically not possible. as for Musk, let's hope he will not ruin his other projects, i still want to see some people on Mars

mhoad 4y ago
Tesla is potentially in meaningful trouble at this point. Basically the entire market of everyone who realistically might consider an electric vehicle in the next five years overwhelmingly wants nothing to do with him moving forward. Sounds like it’s already starting to bite as well https://www.cnet.com/tech/tesla-buyers-are-bailing-because-of-elon-musk-the-worst-troll/ https://www.cnet.com/tech/tesla-buyers-are-bailing-because-o...
- survirtual 4y ago
  There is still no real general contenders for Tesla realistically speaking, and I would really like it if there was. There just isn’t. No one else is putting out EVs at the volume and quality (functional quality, not finishes / luxury) that Teslas have and it isn’t even close. The Tesla battery is stupidly reliable. The car in general is the most reliable vehicle I’ve owned and it isn’t even close. I have ~200k miles on my 2019 Model 3, and I taken it to ungodly places off roads, through deserts, tornadoes, hurricanes, blizzards, beach coasts, every terrain imaginable — some even jeeps would have issues with. I had to replace the bottom a least twice because I ripped up the covers, but not once did the vehicle ever stop running or being reliable. When I set in other vehicles, it is like I’m in the past, or some invisible super powers have left me. I don’t have high opinions of Musk and wish he didn’t get involved with Twitter at all. It would have been better for him to be focused on acquiring more funds for the mission towards sustainable energy and multi-planet species. Stop taking credit for the work of others and do everything possible to enable them instead of managing them; his companies do well because the people believe in the mission, not because of him. After this situation boils down, Tesla will still be producing the best EVs on the market, because the mission is a good one. Long story short, I don’t want to do with Musk but in the foreseeable future I don’t see me getting any EV besides a Tesla. There are just too many variables to consider when managing a battery and battery life, and even if another company comes out with something that looks better, I’m willing to bet reliability won’t even be close & the battery pack will be significantly degraded after a year — not to mention the lack of a nation-scale charging network.
  - d23 4y ago
    Where is this “stupid reliable battery” line coming from? I’ve heard this exact phrase multiple times, and I have no idea how a consumer would be in a position to judge such a thing, so it makes me suspicious.
    - bravetraveler 4y ago
      Similar thoughts here. Taking the car on terrain is more a question of ride height than durability, anyway Being able to roll over things is the minimum The real car manufacturers are slow and lazy, but they only need to learn how to slap electric motors and batteries in there As far as I'm concerned, musk did his part. He got EVs to be a part of the conversation
      - stjohnswarts 4y ago
        This has been my point in many arguments. I don't need an autopilot or 24/7 connectivity. I just want a basic jeep/sedan/truck that does what we've been doing with them for the past 100 years. My phone can do the rest of what I need from connectivity. I would be fine (more than fine) with a usb stick firmware upgrade. The less my car is connected over wifi/5g the better. I don't need anything beyond the standard instrument cluster. Upgrade me all around to LED lights everything and we're good. Think of me as a digital Amish. I only want those things that are functional and efficient.
        survirtual 4y ago
        I actually agree with this. Want to start a new EV company? Could build a barebones, rugged EV that is cheap as hell, easy to hack, and has no unneeded electronics / no connectivity. I would switch over to that in a heartbeat.
    - survirtual 4y ago
      I’m in a position to judge it because I have 200k miles in ~3 years, with a battery that has gotten beat to hell, in the coldest and warmest places in the US with 95% fast charging. It runs basically nonstop in the most extreme climates in the US. I’d call that stupid reliable. Doesn’t matter to me in any case; as long as Tesla can survive, all this hate just means there will be a shorter line when I grab my next one.
- ZeroGravitas 4y ago
  The Chinese competition overtaking them in the EV market (apparently they keep having to discount Tesla's in China to keep sales up) is likely a deeper reasons but the Twitter shenanigans may well be the element that catalyses that realisation more widely.
- mcv 4y ago
  One crazy theory in the "4D chess" category is that he did the Twitter thing explicitly to alienate liberals and be embraced by Trumpists in order to get the gas-guzzling coal rollers to buy his electric cars. Liberals would just switch to Nissan Leafs or something like that.
  - mhoad 4y ago
    That theory fundamentally misunderstands Trumpist mentality which in no way is going to start buying electric cars because they see it as an affront to their fragile sense of masculinity.
    - mcv 4y ago
      Unless they can do it to own the libs, perhaps? I don't know. It's certainly a massive gambit in that 4D chess game, and unclear it's going to pay off.
      - mhoad 4y ago
        I promise you this isn’t a “let’s wait and see” situation. Nobody is going to be splashing out the kind of money needed to buy a Tesla as a car they up until this point they hated at a conceptual level to “own the libs”. These are some of the most insecure men alive that we are talking about here. They don’t want to explain to their friends why they are suddenly driving an electric vehicle. They will look for a million other performative ways to own the libs before they ever consider that.
  - gregjor 4y ago
    Let's not pretend Musk plays a 4D chess game we can't understand. Musk admits he makes it up as he goes. He repeatedly demonstrates an inability to plan or make meaningful predictions, or to deliver on promises. He lacks the planning ability and patience to play even 2D chess. Musk craves constant attention. If he can get that by flirting with the right and pissing off some segment of "the libs" he'll take it. A person tweeting nonsense at 4am just wants attention, in whatever form it takes.
- stjohnswarts 4y ago
  I think the people voting him step down from twitter were trying to save him and tesla (etc) and not trying to be mean. Most people can recognize an individual in crisis.
felix_n 4y ago
You think Elon Musk is pivotal to putting humans on Mars?
- Zigurd 4y ago
  If he can put a thousand fashy techbros on a different planet, I will take back every mean thing I've said about him.
alkonaut 4y ago
Decentralization doesn’t solve the moderation problem. (And to not end up in a discussion about free speech or censorship, let’s assume “moderation” here means making the product usable e.g by having an acceptable level of spam).
papito 4y ago
This sudden love of "freedom of speech" among billionaires really reeks of hypocrisy and authoritarianism. This usually comes from individuals who are used to doing and saying what they want, and suddenly being called out on being horrible. This is new to them, and they don't like it. When they talk about "freedom" and "the people", it's ultimately about them. First of all. Second of all, the Internet - at least in the US - never had this newly-discovered freedom of speech problem. Even in the early days, when we hung out on compartmentalized HTML discussion boards, the admins would bring down the hammer on idiots and trolls with no mercy, and no one complained. The place was much more civilized.

mhoad 4y ago

Tesla is potentially in meaningful trouble at this point. Basically the entire market of everyone who realistically might consider an electric vehicle in the next five years overwhelmingly wants nothing to do with him moving forward. Sounds like it’s already starting to bite as well https://www.cnet.com/tech/tesla-buyers-are-bailing-because-of-elon-musk-the-worst-troll/ https://www.cnet.com/tech/tesla-buyers-are-bailing-because-o...

survirtual 4y ago
There is still no real general contenders for Tesla realistically speaking, and I would really like it if there was. There just isn’t. No one else is putting out EVs at the volume and quality (functional quality, not finishes / luxury) that Teslas have and it isn’t even close. The Tesla battery is stupidly reliable. The car in general is the most reliable vehicle I’ve owned and it isn’t even close. I have ~200k miles on my 2019 Model 3, and I taken it to ungodly places off roads, through deserts, tornadoes, hurricanes, blizzards, beach coasts, every terrain imaginable — some even jeeps would have issues with. I had to replace the bottom a least twice because I ripped up the covers, but not once did the vehicle ever stop running or being reliable. When I set in other vehicles, it is like I’m in the past, or some invisible super powers have left me. I don’t have high opinions of Musk and wish he didn’t get involved with Twitter at all. It would have been better for him to be focused on acquiring more funds for the mission towards sustainable energy and multi-planet species. Stop taking credit for the work of others and do everything possible to enable them instead of managing them; his companies do well because the people believe in the mission, not because of him. After this situation boils down, Tesla will still be producing the best EVs on the market, because the mission is a good one. Long story short, I don’t want to do with Musk but in the foreseeable future I don’t see me getting any EV besides a Tesla. There are just too many variables to consider when managing a battery and battery life, and even if another company comes out with something that looks better, I’m willing to bet reliability won’t even be close & the battery pack will be significantly degraded after a year — not to mention the lack of a nation-scale charging network.
- d23 4y ago
  Where is this “stupid reliable battery” line coming from? I’ve heard this exact phrase multiple times, and I have no idea how a consumer would be in a position to judge such a thing, so it makes me suspicious.
  - bravetraveler 4y ago
    Similar thoughts here. Taking the car on terrain is more a question of ride height than durability, anyway Being able to roll over things is the minimum The real car manufacturers are slow and lazy, but they only need to learn how to slap electric motors and batteries in there As far as I'm concerned, musk did his part. He got EVs to be a part of the conversation
    - stjohnswarts 4y ago
      This has been my point in many arguments. I don't need an autopilot or 24/7 connectivity. I just want a basic jeep/sedan/truck that does what we've been doing with them for the past 100 years. My phone can do the rest of what I need from connectivity. I would be fine (more than fine) with a usb stick firmware upgrade. The less my car is connected over wifi/5g the better. I don't need anything beyond the standard instrument cluster. Upgrade me all around to LED lights everything and we're good. Think of me as a digital Amish. I only want those things that are functional and efficient.
      - survirtual 4y ago
        I actually agree with this. Want to start a new EV company? Could build a barebones, rugged EV that is cheap as hell, easy to hack, and has no unneeded electronics / no connectivity. I would switch over to that in a heartbeat.
  - survirtual 4y ago
    I’m in a position to judge it because I have 200k miles in ~3 years, with a battery that has gotten beat to hell, in the coldest and warmest places in the US with 95% fast charging. It runs basically nonstop in the most extreme climates in the US. I’d call that stupid reliable. Doesn’t matter to me in any case; as long as Tesla can survive, all this hate just means there will be a shorter line when I grab my next one.
ZeroGravitas 4y ago
The Chinese competition overtaking them in the EV market (apparently they keep having to discount Tesla's in China to keep sales up) is likely a deeper reasons but the Twitter shenanigans may well be the element that catalyses that realisation more widely.
mcv 4y ago
One crazy theory in the "4D chess" category is that he did the Twitter thing explicitly to alienate liberals and be embraced by Trumpists in order to get the gas-guzzling coal rollers to buy his electric cars. Liberals would just switch to Nissan Leafs or something like that.
- mhoad 4y ago
  That theory fundamentally misunderstands Trumpist mentality which in no way is going to start buying electric cars because they see it as an affront to their fragile sense of masculinity.
  - mcv 4y ago
    Unless they can do it to own the libs, perhaps? I don't know. It's certainly a massive gambit in that 4D chess game, and unclear it's going to pay off.
    - mhoad 4y ago
      I promise you this isn’t a “let’s wait and see” situation. Nobody is going to be splashing out the kind of money needed to buy a Tesla as a car they up until this point they hated at a conceptual level to “own the libs”. These are some of the most insecure men alive that we are talking about here. They don’t want to explain to their friends why they are suddenly driving an electric vehicle. They will look for a million other performative ways to own the libs before they ever consider that.
- gregjor 4y ago
  Let's not pretend Musk plays a 4D chess game we can't understand. Musk admits he makes it up as he goes. He repeatedly demonstrates an inability to plan or make meaningful predictions, or to deliver on promises. He lacks the planning ability and patience to play even 2D chess. Musk craves constant attention. If he can get that by flirting with the right and pissing off some segment of "the libs" he'll take it. A person tweeting nonsense at 4am just wants attention, in whatever form it takes.
stjohnswarts 4y ago
I think the people voting him step down from twitter were trying to save him and tesla (etc) and not trying to be mean. Most people can recognize an individual in crisis.

felix_n 4y ago

You think Elon Musk is pivotal to putting humans on Mars?

Zigurd 4y ago
If he can put a thousand fashy techbros on a different planet, I will take back every mean thing I've said about him.

alkonaut 4y ago

Decentralization doesn’t solve the moderation problem. (And to not end up in a discussion about free speech or censorship, let’s assume “moderation” here means making the product usable e.g by having an acceptable level of spam).

papito 4y ago

This sudden love of "freedom of speech" among billionaires really reeks of hypocrisy and authoritarianism. This usually comes from individuals who are used to doing and saying what they want, and suddenly being called out on being horrible. This is new to them, and they don't like it. When they talk about "freedom" and "the people", it's ultimately about them. First of all. Second of all, the Internet - at least in the US - never had this newly-discovered freedom of speech problem. Even in the early days, when we hung out on compartmentalized HTML discussion boards, the admins would bring down the hammer on idiots and trolls with no mercy, and no one complained. The place was much more civilized.