4 ms·

The broader tactic is redefining the meaning of words to claim the moral high ground in a debate. They steal the entire intellectual history of a concept by ju

The broader tactic is redefining the meaning of words to claim the moral high ground in a debate. They steal the entire intellectual history of a concept by just redefining it to support their argument.

MrBuddyCasino 4y ago
“When I use a word,” Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, “it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.” “The question is,” said Alice, “whether you can make words mean so many different things.” “The question is,” said Humpty Dumpty, “which is to be master – – that’s all.”
- TeMPOraL 4y ago
  You know what's terrifying? I've seen the first line of this quote used straight, by otherwise seemingly intelligent people, to shut down someone who rightfully pointed they're being manipulative with words. Yes, language is evolving, and dictionaries are descriptive, not prescriptive. But the idea that you can use words in whichever way you want, and any misunderstanding is the listener's problem, is just shitting at the idea of communication, and nothing but a thinly veiled power grab.
  - MrBuddyCasino 4y ago
    People are slowly coming to the realisation that there is no "open dialogue", no "marketplace of ideas". You've been had. The reality is that when you're in power, you can use words in whichever way you want. This is what power means. Only now has is become so obvious that people can't help but notice.
    - rajin444 4y ago
      The marketplace of ideas is a nobel and ideal state. However, its weakness shows in a low trust culture - those like Kendi will exploit it to initially be heard then discard it once they’re in power. Without strict controls over who is and isn’t allowed in our culture we’re left with a “at your feet or at your throat” predicament. Subversive individuals are death to a culture (the thing Popper was referring to in the paradox of tolerance - you have to draw the line at life or death, not simply because you disagree). Trust is everything.
      - MrBuddyCasino 4y ago
        Or to put it in different terms: democracy can AT BEST work somewhat ok in a homogenous high-IQ population. As soon as the constituency becomes multi-ethnic, people stop voting for "whats best" and start voting "which group is favoured". This is not a theory but a historical observation. Popper was an idiot and his "Paradox Of Tolerance" can only lead to tolerance becoming the only permissible value and therefore decline, since tolerance is the absence of values. His university colleagues held him in such disregard that they threatened to quit unless he was cast out. Truly the patron saint of midwits and leftist.
  - MaxBarraclough 4y ago
    Right, it's not hard to demonstrate how absurd that idea is. There was an xkcd that nailed this - https://xkcd.com/1860/ https://xkcd.com/1860/
- swayvil 4y ago
  Look at popular media. "who is master" is everything. Who is up and who is down. Who dominates and who submits. It's a topic very dear to our hairy little monkey hearts.
  - JetAlone 4y ago
TexanFeller 4y ago
Ibram X. Kendi and similar figures' redefinition of racism is the obvious example that comes to mind. I'd love to hear other examples, I'm struggling to think of them.
- schappim 4y ago
  Misogyny and misandry (originally meant a hatred of *men), now it includes any perceived slight, or lack of respect.
- tsimionescu 4y ago
  Even this list itself shows such an example. It calls out the expression "calling a spade a spade" as problematic, and the explanation given is "Although the term has its origins in Greek literature, the subsequent negative connotations with the word "spade" means that the phrase should be used with caution or not at all.". So they are inventing some redefinition of the phrase that could be problematic in order to jettison it. Note: as a non-native speaker, I have no idea what is problematic about the word "spade". I have only ever seen it to mean either a tool for digging or a type of sword, but I will take them at their word that it does have some other meaning.
  - GlenTheMachine 4y ago
    As a native speaker, I am also unaware of any other meaning.
    - skeeter2020 4y ago
      Spade is a rather dated term for a black person, historically from Harlem.
    - eclipxe 4y ago
      This is why lists like this exist. I’m aware of the term and it’s derogatory use. I can see how when used in a professional context it could be harmful. But many people might not be aware, so this list helps build awareness.
    - 4y ago
Cthulhu_ 4y ago
That sounds like a scummy tactic to dismiss someone's argument based on their choice of words. I'm so glad debating isn't a thing much.

MrBuddyCasino 4y ago

“When I use a word,” Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, “it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.” “The question is,” said Alice, “whether you can make words mean so many different things.” “The question is,” said Humpty Dumpty, “which is to be master – – that’s all.”

TeMPOraL 4y ago
You know what's terrifying? I've seen the first line of this quote used straight, by otherwise seemingly intelligent people, to shut down someone who rightfully pointed they're being manipulative with words. Yes, language is evolving, and dictionaries are descriptive, not prescriptive. But the idea that you can use words in whichever way you want, and any misunderstanding is the listener's problem, is just shitting at the idea of communication, and nothing but a thinly veiled power grab.
- MrBuddyCasino 4y ago
  People are slowly coming to the realisation that there is no "open dialogue", no "marketplace of ideas". You've been had. The reality is that when you're in power, you can use words in whichever way you want. This is what power means. Only now has is become so obvious that people can't help but notice.
  - rajin444 4y ago
    The marketplace of ideas is a nobel and ideal state. However, its weakness shows in a low trust culture - those like Kendi will exploit it to initially be heard then discard it once they’re in power. Without strict controls over who is and isn’t allowed in our culture we’re left with a “at your feet or at your throat” predicament. Subversive individuals are death to a culture (the thing Popper was referring to in the paradox of tolerance - you have to draw the line at life or death, not simply because you disagree). Trust is everything.
    - MrBuddyCasino 4y ago
      Or to put it in different terms: democracy can AT BEST work somewhat ok in a homogenous high-IQ population. As soon as the constituency becomes multi-ethnic, people stop voting for "whats best" and start voting "which group is favoured". This is not a theory but a historical observation. Popper was an idiot and his "Paradox Of Tolerance" can only lead to tolerance becoming the only permissible value and therefore decline, since tolerance is the absence of values. His university colleagues held him in such disregard that they threatened to quit unless he was cast out. Truly the patron saint of midwits and leftist.
- MaxBarraclough 4y ago
  Right, it's not hard to demonstrate how absurd that idea is. There was an xkcd that nailed this - https://xkcd.com/1860/ https://xkcd.com/1860/
swayvil 4y ago
Look at popular media. "who is master" is everything. Who is up and who is down. Who dominates and who submits. It's a topic very dear to our hairy little monkey hearts.
- JetAlone 4y ago

TexanFeller 4y ago

Ibram X. Kendi and similar figures' redefinition of racism is the obvious example that comes to mind. I'd love to hear other examples, I'm struggling to think of them.

schappim 4y ago
Misogyny and misandry (originally meant a hatred of *men), now it includes any perceived slight, or lack of respect.
tsimionescu 4y ago
Even this list itself shows such an example. It calls out the expression "calling a spade a spade" as problematic, and the explanation given is "Although the term has its origins in Greek literature, the subsequent negative connotations with the word "spade" means that the phrase should be used with caution or not at all.". So they are inventing some redefinition of the phrase that could be problematic in order to jettison it. Note: as a non-native speaker, I have no idea what is problematic about the word "spade". I have only ever seen it to mean either a tool for digging or a type of sword, but I will take them at their word that it does have some other meaning.
- GlenTheMachine 4y ago
  As a native speaker, I am also unaware of any other meaning.
  - skeeter2020 4y ago
    Spade is a rather dated term for a black person, historically from Harlem.
  - eclipxe 4y ago
    This is why lists like this exist. I’m aware of the term and it’s derogatory use. I can see how when used in a professional context it could be harmful. But many people might not be aware, so this list helps build awareness.
  - 4y ago

Cthulhu_ 4y ago

That sounds like a scummy tactic to dismiss someone's argument based on their choice of words. I'm so glad debating isn't a thing much.