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But the Mac Pro was always for a highly niche market. Even the cheapest Intel-based Mac Pro is $6000. And that's with a pretty meager 8-core CPU that gets worse

by Hamuko 4y ago

But the Mac Pro was always for a highly niche market. Even the cheapest Intel-based Mac Pro is $6000. And that's with a pretty meager 8-core CPU that gets worse single-core and multi-core Geekbench scores than the M1 Max found in a $2000 Mac Studio.

NeverFade 4y ago
Fair, but there's still a big difference between the base model currently costing $6,000 and a base model that will cost over $10,000. That's a 70% price hike.
- Hamuko 4y ago
  It's possible that they're positioning the $4000 Mac Studio as the replacement for the entry-level $6000 Mac Pro, and the $10,000+ Apple Silicon Mac Pro is a replacement for the upmarket SKUs. If the M2 Extreme is to the M2 Ultra what the M1 Ultra is to the M1 Max, namely that it's just two chips pasted together, then the M2 Extreme might start with 128 GB of RAM (Max: 32 GB, Ultra: 64 GB). That alone is a $1000+ upgrade to the current Mac Pro.
- brookst 4y ago
  That “price hike” depends on how many people buy the base model. If 90% of customers were spending $10k+ anyway, it might make economic sense to just not offer a model at the $6k price point.
vbezhenar 4y ago
It was not always like that. It's the current generation. Old generations had more reasonable pricing.
- sleepybrett 4y ago
  I feel like the switch was the garbage can pro. I wonder if it's just more of a 'it's not where the market is' thing. Working in tech and creative industries even previous to the garbage can there was a dramatic shift in people just opting into laptops instead of desktops. With only the people with really demanding workflows sticking with the desktops. Now I mostly only see mac desktops in video production contexts (editing stations, compositing/effects, 3d.. maybe you'd also see that in high end audio production as well). As offices have changed over the years with more hot desking etc. it's hard justifying a desktop machine... not to mention the pandemic. So maybe apple made a conscious decision. Keep the mac mini to serve a lower end mostly stationary workforce or for installation type work, kill the whole middle-to-lower-highend desktop line and cater to a high end 'studio' workstation.
- KennyBlanken 4y ago
  Yup. I asked for an OG intel cheese-grater at an old job. The boss blinked and said something along the lines of "we're not spending that kind of money for your system" and I pointed out that with 16gb of ram but otherwise base config, it was about the same price and a much better deal performance-wise than a Macbook Pro. Xeons versus an intel mobile i5, and the widest/fastest memory bus around at the time? No contest. The water-cooled ones were an absolute shitshow...Apple was pushing the edge too hard on that. AIO coolers are still kinda hit-or-miss (the good, well-made ones are fine.)
- rconti 4y ago
  Yup. My 2006 Mac Pro (first gen intel mac pro, the original cheese grater tower) cost me under $3000. IIRC, that plus a 24" Dell display added up to $3k total, or $4400 in today's money.
wkat4242 4y ago
> that gets worse single-core and multi-core Geekbench scores than the M1 Max found in a $2000 Mac Studio. That's also because they didn't bother updating it for years. Just like the previous trashcan model. I don't really understand how Apple gets away with that. The people that spend this kind of money to get top of the line hardware are the same ones that are ok buying 4-year-old hardware at introduction price???
- bluenomatterwho 4y ago
  underpowered and overpriced ;) This irks me a little bit from time to time. But right now we're in a sweet spot where used 2010-2020 Intel hardware can be had for pretty cheap: Apple MacBook Pro 13in Core i5 Retina 2.7GHz (MF840LL/A), 8GB Memory, 256GB Solid State Drive (Renewed) $379.99 I wanted a 90's era Powerbook so bad. The 2015 is a great machine in 2022. Over the years I heard the elders say it: buy used on the cycle if you can't afford the newer gen. It's really true. And I rarely hear someone who buys the expensive loaded kit complain, even 10 years later. This is how they get away with it. I think I must have learned Linux attempting to rescue my Windows systems, haha. Now I want to rant about Darwin...
lapcat 4y ago
In 2012, Apple was still selling an Intel Mac Pro for $2500.

by Hamuko 4y ago

NeverFade 4y ago

Fair, but there's still a big difference between the base model currently costing $6,000 and a base model that will cost over $10,000. That's a 70% price hike.

Hamuko 4y ago
It's possible that they're positioning the $4000 Mac Studio as the replacement for the entry-level $6000 Mac Pro, and the $10,000+ Apple Silicon Mac Pro is a replacement for the upmarket SKUs. If the M2 Extreme is to the M2 Ultra what the M1 Ultra is to the M1 Max, namely that it's just two chips pasted together, then the M2 Extreme might start with 128 GB of RAM (Max: 32 GB, Ultra: 64 GB). That alone is a $1000+ upgrade to the current Mac Pro.
brookst 4y ago
That “price hike” depends on how many people buy the base model. If 90% of customers were spending $10k+ anyway, it might make economic sense to just not offer a model at the $6k price point.

vbezhenar 4y ago

It was not always like that. It's the current generation. Old generations had more reasonable pricing.

sleepybrett 4y ago
I feel like the switch was the garbage can pro. I wonder if it's just more of a 'it's not where the market is' thing. Working in tech and creative industries even previous to the garbage can there was a dramatic shift in people just opting into laptops instead of desktops. With only the people with really demanding workflows sticking with the desktops. Now I mostly only see mac desktops in video production contexts (editing stations, compositing/effects, 3d.. maybe you'd also see that in high end audio production as well). As offices have changed over the years with more hot desking etc. it's hard justifying a desktop machine... not to mention the pandemic. So maybe apple made a conscious decision. Keep the mac mini to serve a lower end mostly stationary workforce or for installation type work, kill the whole middle-to-lower-highend desktop line and cater to a high end 'studio' workstation.
KennyBlanken 4y ago
Yup. I asked for an OG intel cheese-grater at an old job. The boss blinked and said something along the lines of "we're not spending that kind of money for your system" and I pointed out that with 16gb of ram but otherwise base config, it was about the same price and a much better deal performance-wise than a Macbook Pro. Xeons versus an intel mobile i5, and the widest/fastest memory bus around at the time? No contest. The water-cooled ones were an absolute shitshow...Apple was pushing the edge too hard on that. AIO coolers are still kinda hit-or-miss (the good, well-made ones are fine.)
rconti 4y ago
Yup. My 2006 Mac Pro (first gen intel mac pro, the original cheese grater tower) cost me under $3000. IIRC, that plus a 24" Dell display added up to $3k total, or $4400 in today's money.

wkat4242 4y ago

> that gets worse single-core and multi-core Geekbench scores than the M1 Max found in a $2000 Mac Studio. That's also because they didn't bother updating it for years. Just like the previous trashcan model. I don't really understand how Apple gets away with that. The people that spend this kind of money to get top of the line hardware are the same ones that are ok buying 4-year-old hardware at introduction price???

bluenomatterwho 4y ago
underpowered and overpriced ;) This irks me a little bit from time to time. But right now we're in a sweet spot where used 2010-2020 Intel hardware can be had for pretty cheap: Apple MacBook Pro 13in Core i5 Retina 2.7GHz (MF840LL/A), 8GB Memory, 256GB Solid State Drive (Renewed) $379.99 I wanted a 90's era Powerbook so bad. The 2015 is a great machine in 2022. Over the years I heard the elders say it: buy used on the cycle if you can't afford the newer gen. It's really true. And I rarely hear someone who buys the expensive loaded kit complain, even 10 years later. This is how they get away with it. I think I must have learned Linux attempting to rescue my Windows systems, haha. Now I want to rant about Darwin...

lapcat 4y ago

In 2012, Apple was still selling an Intel Mac Pro for $2500.