5 ms·

Hasn't that been pretty well established for a while? I thought it well grounded that mammals had evolved on Gondwana (the southern part of Pangea) during the

Hasn't that been pretty well established for a while? I thought it well grounded that mammals had evolved on Gondwana (the southern part of Pangea) during the process of it splitting away from Laurasia, and had settled Laurasia from Gondwana Gondwana was composed of now South America, Africa, India, and Australia.

ttyprintk 4y ago
National Geographic covered it about a year ago: https://archive.vn/YHs1H https://archive.vn/YHs1H
- WelcomeShorty 4y ago
  Fascinating article. "Many paleontologists angrily reject the DNA findings, arguing there must be something wrong with the molecular clocks the geneticists use to date their findings. The geneticists counter that paleontologists just haven't found the right fossils yet." And that should make clear it is not that clear cut as I (with ZERO background knowledge in either area) thought it was.
  - brightball 4y ago
    I think there are certain things that we're simply never going to be able to know with certainty, but it sure it fun to talk about. That Ancient Apocalypse show in Netflix is really interesting along those lines.
    - JoeAltmaier 4y ago
      Hm; I thought that Ancient Apocalypse had been debunked here, as a collection of old myths that had been thoroughly discredited, but now presented as current issues. Just an invented-content money grab kind of thing?
      - rhodorhoades 4y ago
        Well… the whole ‘ancient apocalypse theory’ might be discredited, but the sites they visit date back extremely far into our ancient history. It also shows that pockets of architectural knowledge rapidly advanced and then receded all across the known world. One thing is for sure, the human story is far from a ladder, with periods of around 1000 years of advancements and then everything collapses for a couple generations. I think it goes back to the OP’s original point… there are some things we cannot ever know for sure but they are fun to learn and talk about.
        ummonk 4y ago
        You're making it sound like everything advanced and then receded at the same time across the world. This hasn't been the case since the end of the last glacial period. There have been recedings of local civilizations scattered throughout history, as well as some large scale regional disruptions (e.g. late bronze age collapse, decline of the roman empire), but nothing like periods where everything collapses globally.
        nomel 4y ago
        With "pockets of", I read this > It also shows that pockets of architectural knowledge rapidly advanced and then receded all across the known world. as "individual pockets, all around the world, advanced and receded."
        ummonk 4y ago
        Oh, you're right. My objection was based on my own misinterpretation of "pockets" as referring to time periods and/or specific architectural knowledge rather than to particular locations.
        Maursault 4y ago
        > but nothing like periods where everything collapses globally. What else but a population bottleneck could explain the lack of any genetic diversity to speak of in humans? No human alive today is more distantly related to you than 37th cousin. Any two random individuals are 99.9% identical. That's weird. For this to have occurred, something must have happened everywhere all at once.[1] [1] https://https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toba_catastrophe_theory https://https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toba_catastrophe_theor...
    - ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
      > That Ancient Apocalypse show in Netflix I started to watch it, then figured out that I didn't really want to.
    - mkehrt 4y ago
      Uh, that show is horrific pseudoscience nonsense; you know that, right?
      - ummonk 4y ago
        Apparently even on HN some people fall for History Channel type nonsense.
        beaned 4y ago
        Don't understand why you guys characterize these things this way. The person who brought it up would probably just say that it stimulates thought and make you think. In your response, you assume one who shares the show has "fallen for" it - like definitely believes it, without doubt. Never heard this type of pushback about Ancient Aliens, which is even more ridiculous. I feel like the replies are going to be "but nobody took that seriously anyway." Firstly, I dunno about that. Secondly, not sure anyone's taking Ancient Apocalypse more seriously. The show presents a theory, it's not claiming a fact. It's so bizarre that out of all the media out there that walks the line between history, science, and outlandish ideas, this one very specific show, for some reason, gets all this hateful focus. Very weird.
        ummonk 4y ago
        If someone posted about Ancient Aliens or any other pseudoscience show on here and said it's "really interesting" in a discussion about history (rather than, say, fantasy or entertainment), we'd characterize it the same way. I don't know why you think Ancient Apocalypse is being singled out when I explicitly said "History Channel type nonsense".
        andrewflnr 4y ago
        > Never heard this type of pushback about Ancient Aliens, which is even more ridiculous. That's odd, because "this type of pushback" is the only context in which I've heard of "ancient aliens".
      - labster 4y ago
    - ordu 4y ago
      > Ancient Apocalypse show in Netflix is really interesting along those lines. https://www.sapiens.org/archaeology/ancient-apocalypse-pseudoscience/ https://www.sapiens.org/archaeology/ancient-apocalypse-pseud...
    - WalterBright 4y ago
      I watched with some interest. I was amused by their claim that lining up a structure with the sun was some sort of advanced cosmology or evidence that they had advanced science, or any science at all. The megastructures, while large, showed no evidence of sophisticated engineering.
  - olddustytrail 4y ago
    > Many paleontologists angrily reject Just this quote immediately put me off the article. Weasel word "many" to start with (how many? Four or five? Half of them?) and followed up with emotive language (how angry were they? Perhaps they were just bored with shoddy justifications?)
Maursault 4y ago
> Gondwana was composed of now South America, Africa, India, and Australia. How do we know Gondwana was in the Southern Hemisphere? How do we know that we didn't get the Hemispheres mixed up in the first place?[1] [1] https://images.theconversation.com/files/162021/original/image-20170322-31217-3p4bxk.jpg https://images.theconversation.com/files/162021/original/ima...

ttyprintk 4y ago

National Geographic covered it about a year ago: https://archive.vn/YHs1H https://archive.vn/YHs1H

WelcomeShorty 4y ago
Fascinating article. "Many paleontologists angrily reject the DNA findings, arguing there must be something wrong with the molecular clocks the geneticists use to date their findings. The geneticists counter that paleontologists just haven't found the right fossils yet." And that should make clear it is not that clear cut as I (with ZERO background knowledge in either area) thought it was.
- brightball 4y ago
  I think there are certain things that we're simply never going to be able to know with certainty, but it sure it fun to talk about. That Ancient Apocalypse show in Netflix is really interesting along those lines.
  - JoeAltmaier 4y ago
    Hm; I thought that Ancient Apocalypse had been debunked here, as a collection of old myths that had been thoroughly discredited, but now presented as current issues. Just an invented-content money grab kind of thing?
    - rhodorhoades 4y ago
      Well… the whole ‘ancient apocalypse theory’ might be discredited, but the sites they visit date back extremely far into our ancient history. It also shows that pockets of architectural knowledge rapidly advanced and then receded all across the known world. One thing is for sure, the human story is far from a ladder, with periods of around 1000 years of advancements and then everything collapses for a couple generations. I think it goes back to the OP’s original point… there are some things we cannot ever know for sure but they are fun to learn and talk about.
      - ummonk 4y ago
        You're making it sound like everything advanced and then receded at the same time across the world. This hasn't been the case since the end of the last glacial period. There have been recedings of local civilizations scattered throughout history, as well as some large scale regional disruptions (e.g. late bronze age collapse, decline of the roman empire), but nothing like periods where everything collapses globally.
        nomel 4y ago
        With "pockets of", I read this > It also shows that pockets of architectural knowledge rapidly advanced and then receded all across the known world. as "individual pockets, all around the world, advanced and receded."
        ummonk 4y ago
        Oh, you're right. My objection was based on my own misinterpretation of "pockets" as referring to time periods and/or specific architectural knowledge rather than to particular locations.
        Maursault 4y ago
        > but nothing like periods where everything collapses globally. What else but a population bottleneck could explain the lack of any genetic diversity to speak of in humans? No human alive today is more distantly related to you than 37th cousin. Any two random individuals are 99.9% identical. That's weird. For this to have occurred, something must have happened everywhere all at once.[1] [1] https://https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toba_catastrophe_theory https://https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toba_catastrophe_theor...
  - ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
    > That Ancient Apocalypse show in Netflix I started to watch it, then figured out that I didn't really want to.
  - mkehrt 4y ago
    Uh, that show is horrific pseudoscience nonsense; you know that, right?
    - ummonk 4y ago
      Apparently even on HN some people fall for History Channel type nonsense.
      - beaned 4y ago
        Don't understand why you guys characterize these things this way. The person who brought it up would probably just say that it stimulates thought and make you think. In your response, you assume one who shares the show has "fallen for" it - like definitely believes it, without doubt. Never heard this type of pushback about Ancient Aliens, which is even more ridiculous. I feel like the replies are going to be "but nobody took that seriously anyway." Firstly, I dunno about that. Secondly, not sure anyone's taking Ancient Apocalypse more seriously. The show presents a theory, it's not claiming a fact. It's so bizarre that out of all the media out there that walks the line between history, science, and outlandish ideas, this one very specific show, for some reason, gets all this hateful focus. Very weird.
        ummonk 4y ago
        If someone posted about Ancient Aliens or any other pseudoscience show on here and said it's "really interesting" in a discussion about history (rather than, say, fantasy or entertainment), we'd characterize it the same way. I don't know why you think Ancient Apocalypse is being singled out when I explicitly said "History Channel type nonsense".
        andrewflnr 4y ago
        > Never heard this type of pushback about Ancient Aliens, which is even more ridiculous. That's odd, because "this type of pushback" is the only context in which I've heard of "ancient aliens".
    - labster 4y ago
  - ordu 4y ago
    > Ancient Apocalypse show in Netflix is really interesting along those lines. https://www.sapiens.org/archaeology/ancient-apocalypse-pseudoscience/ https://www.sapiens.org/archaeology/ancient-apocalypse-pseud...
  - WalterBright 4y ago
    I watched with some interest. I was amused by their claim that lining up a structure with the sun was some sort of advanced cosmology or evidence that they had advanced science, or any science at all. The megastructures, while large, showed no evidence of sophisticated engineering.
- olddustytrail 4y ago
  > Many paleontologists angrily reject Just this quote immediately put me off the article. Weasel word "many" to start with (how many? Four or five? Half of them?) and followed up with emotive language (how angry were they? Perhaps they were just bored with shoddy justifications?)

Maursault 4y ago

> Gondwana was composed of now South America, Africa, India, and Australia. How do we know Gondwana was in the Southern Hemisphere? How do we know that we didn't get the Hemispheres mixed up in the first place?[1] [1] https://images.theconversation.com/files/162021/original/image-20170322-31217-3p4bxk.jpg https://images.theconversation.com/files/162021/original/ima...