5 ms·

It’s their one trick, the operation of electric motors mean that you get Max torque immediately so they can put power down at the low end very effectively. So y

It’s their one trick, the operation of electric motors mean that you get Max torque immediately so they can put power down at the low end very effectively. So yes, we all know we want price, charge speed and range, but marketing is about selling what you have, not redesigning the product. It’s like the clip from mad men when they decide to advertise cigarettes as “Toasted”. You’d like to say they don’t cause cancer… but you can’t, so you say something else instead.

clouddrover 4y ago
> It’s their one trick Two other tricks of the EV6 are: - 18 minute 10-80% charge time in ideal conditions (which is very good) - Vehicle to load capability. You can run appliances off the battery. If you're desperate you can charge another EV (but it will be slow).
- fragmede 4y ago
  Those are neat! Are there any EVs you can tow behind another vehicle and have that charge it's battery?
  - clouddrover 4y ago
    Yes, all EVs with regenerative braking. You can also charge it by rolling it down a hill. Tow charge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaGVoB4Zn-Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaGVoB4Zn-Y Another tow charge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gxi4sn3KXg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gxi4sn3KXg Gravity charge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5k5wAaDZw1o https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5k5wAaDZw1o
- pmontra 4y ago
  - 18 minute 10-80% charge time in ideal conditions (which is very good) Having to wait almost 20 minutes on a 60 minutes commute is far from ideal. That time is very good when one recharges at home or during a long trip or at destination (office / mall / etc) while doing other things. But in the last case it takes away a charging spot until the owner comes back. How is that managed now?
  - clouddrover 4y ago
    > Having to wait almost 20 minutes on a 60 minutes commute is far from ideal. Yes, you'll need have enough battery to get there or charge before you leave. > That time is very good when one recharges at home You won't get that charge time at home unless you decide to put in a 350 kW charger at your house, which will be expensive. An 18 minute charge time on a fast charger can support about three cars per hour. There still need to be better batteries that can sustain higher C-rates to make fuller use of the existing 350 kW chargers and future 400 kW chargers and beyond. For a future, high C-rate battery with 100 kWh usable capacity, 10 to 80% would be 70 kWh. If it could charge 10-80% at a flat 350 kW then that would take 12 minutes. At 400 kW it would take 10.5 minutes. Battery swaps can currently be done in 6 minutes. Swapping in a 100 kWh battery charged to 90% in 6 minutes is equivalent to a flat 0-90% charge curve at 900 kW: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmWL1hZQmD0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmWL1hZQmD0
  - saturn_vk 4y ago
    > Having to wait almost 20 minutes on a 60 minutes commute is far from ideal. You will either need to only charge once a few days, or if you are lucky, charge overnight at your home or during work. No car will need to be charged every 60 minutes.
  - kylecordes 4y ago
    For commuting, you charge at home with a much slower charger than this. You start each morning at a high charge %, and never stop at any charger at all. The fast charger is for road trips - at the moment, the number and reliability of high-speed charge points is probably a bigger constraint than the relative speed of this model versus others.
  - ulfw 4y ago
    a 60 minute commute (aka at most 70 miles or so, likely much less door-to-door) does not use 70% of the battery. Not even half that.
    - pmontra 4y ago
      It will, day after day. In a city where people park on the streets because there are no or not enough personal parking slots (very common in Europe, don't know in the USA,) it's either a (metered?) charger for every public parking slot or a boring 20 minutes stop every few days.
- IndrekR 4y ago
  Have 41Mm on my Ioniq5 that has the same “superpowers”. Have used 350kW charger only once in that time. It was fast, but in my use case (30Mm/yr) hardly is needed. You always leave home with full tank. Usually 10m top-up while visiting a loo at the 50..150kW charger will do the trick for longer journeys. Maybe it is my “old” age, my bladder can not stand longer than 6h driving without stops. As for the V2L — thus I have used lot more. Have had power failures at home where I switched all the critical systems to the car, have “taken electricity” to my father in law, have use it to power tools outside (mitre saw, for example) and boiled tea with a 2.7kW kettle.
  - tracker1 4y ago
    Bigger for me, is the charging network layout... I have done a lot of road trips in the past decade or so, and have often stopped where there are there are at least 5-6 or more cars waiting for the ~6 or so charging spots... even if it's 20m of extra wait, that's close to a half hour to get a spot then another half hour, give or take. Not sure I'd like that. I know a lot of people that love their EVs for daily commute. And before I started working from home full time, had been considering it. At this point, for the tank every couple weeks that I use, I'd just assume stick to petrol and keep my car longer.
fragmede 4y ago
A car's 0-60mph time has been used to advertise how quickly a car accelerates long before Tesla was even founded.
xaerise 4y ago
With that much torque things will break faster... Think like: It is not the speed that kills, it is the sudden stop. Like the VW automatic transmissions. Here in Europe, no one will trim VW with diesel and automatic transmission because the torque will kill the transmission.
- ddalex 4y ago
  > no one will trim VW with diesel and automatic transmission Passat 2.0 TDI SCR 7-speed is a diesel automatic transmission that is offered as standard. What are you talking about?
- simonebrunozzi 4y ago
  > no one will trim VW with diesel and automatic transmission Majority of diesel cars in Germany, AFAIK, are sold with automatic transmission.
- jackmott 4y ago
  EVs don’t normally have a transmission to break. just reduction gears which are beefy.
- dsfyu404ed 4y ago
  They know how much torque they're dealing with so they'll just spec heavier components to deal with it. > no one will trim VW with diesel and automatic transmission because the torque will kill the transmission That's just because it's a crap transmission or it's tuned to be crap.

clouddrover 4y ago

> It’s their one trick Two other tricks of the EV6 are: - 18 minute 10-80% charge time in ideal conditions (which is very good) - Vehicle to load capability. You can run appliances off the battery. If you're desperate you can charge another EV (but it will be slow).

fragmede 4y ago
Those are neat! Are there any EVs you can tow behind another vehicle and have that charge it's battery?
- clouddrover 4y ago
  Yes, all EVs with regenerative braking. You can also charge it by rolling it down a hill. Tow charge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaGVoB4Zn-Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaGVoB4Zn-Y Another tow charge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gxi4sn3KXg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gxi4sn3KXg Gravity charge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5k5wAaDZw1o https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5k5wAaDZw1o
pmontra 4y ago
- 18 minute 10-80% charge time in ideal conditions (which is very good) Having to wait almost 20 minutes on a 60 minutes commute is far from ideal. That time is very good when one recharges at home or during a long trip or at destination (office / mall / etc) while doing other things. But in the last case it takes away a charging spot until the owner comes back. How is that managed now?
- clouddrover 4y ago
  > Having to wait almost 20 minutes on a 60 minutes commute is far from ideal. Yes, you'll need have enough battery to get there or charge before you leave. > That time is very good when one recharges at home You won't get that charge time at home unless you decide to put in a 350 kW charger at your house, which will be expensive. An 18 minute charge time on a fast charger can support about three cars per hour. There still need to be better batteries that can sustain higher C-rates to make fuller use of the existing 350 kW chargers and future 400 kW chargers and beyond. For a future, high C-rate battery with 100 kWh usable capacity, 10 to 80% would be 70 kWh. If it could charge 10-80% at a flat 350 kW then that would take 12 minutes. At 400 kW it would take 10.5 minutes. Battery swaps can currently be done in 6 minutes. Swapping in a 100 kWh battery charged to 90% in 6 minutes is equivalent to a flat 0-90% charge curve at 900 kW: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmWL1hZQmD0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmWL1hZQmD0
- saturn_vk 4y ago
  > Having to wait almost 20 minutes on a 60 minutes commute is far from ideal. You will either need to only charge once a few days, or if you are lucky, charge overnight at your home or during work. No car will need to be charged every 60 minutes.
- kylecordes 4y ago
  For commuting, you charge at home with a much slower charger than this. You start each morning at a high charge %, and never stop at any charger at all. The fast charger is for road trips - at the moment, the number and reliability of high-speed charge points is probably a bigger constraint than the relative speed of this model versus others.
- ulfw 4y ago
  a 60 minute commute (aka at most 70 miles or so, likely much less door-to-door) does not use 70% of the battery. Not even half that.
  - pmontra 4y ago
    It will, day after day. In a city where people park on the streets because there are no or not enough personal parking slots (very common in Europe, don't know in the USA,) it's either a (metered?) charger for every public parking slot or a boring 20 minutes stop every few days.
IndrekR 4y ago
Have 41Mm on my Ioniq5 that has the same “superpowers”. Have used 350kW charger only once in that time. It was fast, but in my use case (30Mm/yr) hardly is needed. You always leave home with full tank. Usually 10m top-up while visiting a loo at the 50..150kW charger will do the trick for longer journeys. Maybe it is my “old” age, my bladder can not stand longer than 6h driving without stops. As for the V2L — thus I have used lot more. Have had power failures at home where I switched all the critical systems to the car, have “taken electricity” to my father in law, have use it to power tools outside (mitre saw, for example) and boiled tea with a 2.7kW kettle.
- tracker1 4y ago
  Bigger for me, is the charging network layout... I have done a lot of road trips in the past decade or so, and have often stopped where there are there are at least 5-6 or more cars waiting for the ~6 or so charging spots... even if it's 20m of extra wait, that's close to a half hour to get a spot then another half hour, give or take. Not sure I'd like that. I know a lot of people that love their EVs for daily commute. And before I started working from home full time, had been considering it. At this point, for the tank every couple weeks that I use, I'd just assume stick to petrol and keep my car longer.

fragmede 4y ago

A car's 0-60mph time has been used to advertise how quickly a car accelerates long before Tesla was even founded.

xaerise 4y ago

With that much torque things will break faster... Think like: It is not the speed that kills, it is the sudden stop. Like the VW automatic transmissions. Here in Europe, no one will trim VW with diesel and automatic transmission because the torque will kill the transmission.

ddalex 4y ago
> no one will trim VW with diesel and automatic transmission Passat 2.0 TDI SCR 7-speed is a diesel automatic transmission that is offered as standard. What are you talking about?
simonebrunozzi 4y ago
> no one will trim VW with diesel and automatic transmission Majority of diesel cars in Germany, AFAIK, are sold with automatic transmission.
jackmott 4y ago
EVs don’t normally have a transmission to break. just reduction gears which are beefy.
dsfyu404ed 4y ago
They know how much torque they're dealing with so they'll just spec heavier components to deal with it. > no one will trim VW with diesel and automatic transmission because the torque will kill the transmission That's just because it's a crap transmission or it's tuned to be crap.