5 ms·

HTC Unlocks Bootloader For All of Its Devices

150 points by aurelianito 15y ago

namtrac 15y ago
Not "All" but the newest line-up devices.
mrj 15y ago
Uhm, except they're only unlocking devices "launched after September 2011." That's overlooking a massive population of users who'd like to unlock their device because HTC has stopped supporting them. This, so far, is BS.
- darrenkopp 15y ago
  All devices launched September 2011 and forward. I agree that they are missing a lot of previous devices, but there are already tools out there to unlock the bootloader on those devices. If I were to make a guess, I would say the September 2011 mark is all devices that are using the current bootloader locking method, and so they are just supporting that instead of going through and making other programs for all previous versions.
  - miahi 15y ago
    There are no simple unlock tools for some of the S-ON phones launched before September 2011 (with HBOOT 2.0). HBOOT can be downgraded[1], but it's quite complicated. [1] http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1318919 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1318919
- 51Cards 15y ago
  There is this line as well: "We continue to work on models launched prior to September 2011, please check back often for the status of older devices." My guess is the newest devices have an updated bootloader that they CAN unlock easily. I am betting they may even be stymied by the security they put in place on older devices. This series of events makes sense to me: Spring 2011 - announce we're going to allow unlocking Summer 2011 - update bootloader to be easily unlockable Sept 2011 - start releasing updated loader on devices Dec 2011 - final certification that this is all going to work OK and release to the public 2012 - figure out how to get around our own security on older devices
  - koenigdavidmj 15y ago
    > 2012 - figure out how to get around our own security via OTA update on older devices. ??? - Convince carriers to actually take that update
    - 51Cards 15y ago
      Quite possibly.
  - notatoad 15y ago
    considering that the custom rom crowd has figured out how to get around the security already, i find it hard to believe that HTC can't do it.
    - 51Cards 15y ago
      I suspect the key difference might be that HTC doesn't want to release the following type of instructions: "Tap settings, Tap Applications, Tap Development, Enable USB Debugging, now install this software on your PC, connect your phone via USB, be sure to un-mount your SD card first... etc. etc." I think they would prefer to release a one shot install fix and that to my knowledge hasn't been figured out yet. In the end it may just not be worth the effort for them to do on older devices as well.
drivebyacct2 15y ago
The reaction I heard to this is that it does not bring S-OFF to these devices. Is this true? I've never quite understood this aspect of HTC devices.
- sandycheeks 15y ago
  I think this is where they state that in the article. "Please note that unlocking your bootloader does not mean that you will be able to unlock the SIM lock. Unlocking your SIM lock is at the discretion of your operator/carrier and is not part of the bootloader unlocking scope." Is what they call SIM lock the same as S-OFF/S-ON? I always heard it called 'Security-ON/OFF'. With S-ON you can still get temp root access (until you reboot) but can not run different ROMs as it prevents access to memory locations that need to be edited to do that. To get S-OFF on my Evo Shift(Sprint), I had to downgrade it from Android 2.3 and use an old hack specifically because it was the only publicly known way to get S-OFF. There may be better way out now. Unlocking the bootloader was easy. I could do that with temp root on 2.3. Getting S-OFF was the tricky part for me.
  - iscrewyou 15y ago
    S-Off gives you a permanent root with your rom. It also means you can change recoveries, hboot and all kinds of other system files and areas. It has nothing to do with Sim Lock or Unlock.
  - sandycheeks 15y ago
    Had a little time to dig around and found Sim Lock is different from s-off/on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIM_lock http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIM_lock It appears S-OFF/ON is also set by the operator/carrier and not the manufacturer. I'd love to see a definitive source about S-OFF/ON and how it is implemented. Especially, for the Sprint/HTC combination.
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
- drivebyacct2 15y ago
  No offense, but the answers here were either wrong or incomplete so I decided to look it up. For those who want the gist of the situation: An unlocked bootloader allows for the booting of kernels that are not signed by HTC (and probably jointly the carriers). S-OFF disables write protection on the /system and /boot partitions. It is part of the NVRAM of the radio and is patched during HBOOT, which I believe is HTC specific. sources: http://alpharev.nl/ http://alpharev.nl/
quanticle 15y ago
This is a canny business decision by HTC. The main problem with Android device manufacturers has been lack of continuing software support. Making an unlockable bootloader allows HTC to free itself from an long-term support commitment while simultaneously silencing the very critics that were pushing for that commitment in the first place.
- rauar 15y ago
  Or it's just a fishy tactic to increase the number of deniable warranty claims by making "unlocking" officially available to non-technical users.
  - deleted 15y ago
    [deleted]
- w1ntermute 15y ago
  I don't see the problem. The only people who really care about software updates (in the absence of show-stopping bugs) are those that are willing to install custom ROMs. We have a healthy compromise here that keeps both the carriers and the nerds happy. I think we need to temper our expectations with respect to the mobile device industry. We might see smartphones as mini-computers, but the companies that make them do not, and neither does the vast majority of their target audience.
  - nitrogen 15y ago
    Anyone installing apps on their phone will probably expect software updates. If their phone they bought a year ago won't work with the latest versions of their favorite Android Market games, due to requiring a newer version of Android, they'll notice.
    - fpgeek 15y ago
      I don't know that end users would end up noticing. I certainly haven't (with the exception of trying to use a G1 after a Froyo device). When I got the Froyo to Gingerbread upgrade on my G2 there were many improvements, but nothing I noticed that affected third-party apps. Even many of my favorite apps that use Honeycomb features (e.g. Plume, Kindle, Google Music, Firefox, etc.) seamlessly support older devices. Google has been pretty good about putting out compatibility libraries for major new APIs (e.g. Fragments) and there's a lot of support for checking the presence or absence of various features / APIs / etc. These days, there's even support in the Android Market for having different versions of the same app for different OS versions. Supporting a range of OS versions is certainly work, but I'm not sure how much more work it is beyond supporting a wide variety of form factors, different hardware features, etc. In any case, the good developers seem to be able to handle it.
jorgecastillo 15y ago
I was giving up on Android, if HTC keeps this policy in the future, I'll be giving up only on other brands. What is the point of having a smartphone (pocket computer?), if you can't make it work like you want.
- Terretta 15y ago
  > What is the point of having a smartphone (pocket computer?), if you can't make it work like you want? Ask yourself the same thing about a car. Or a toaster. The point for most people is to have it work as designed and not have to think about it.
  - freehunter 15y ago
    Yet, like with cars, there exists a sizable community of people who want to put on bigger wheels/tires, a new turbo, a new stereo system, taller suspension, etc. A locked bootloader is the same as having a hood that can only be opened with the dealer's key.
    - Terretta 15y ago
      I don't know a single person that wants to look under their hood any more (though living in greater NYC area, I realize this is not representative of most communities). When I was in high school (mid 80s), everyone did. But even the grease monkeys aren't interested any more. It's kind of like late 80's ricers versus today's German cars. I myself auto-crossed a Honda CRXsi. Today I'm just as into performance, but have other things to do with my time. I can honestly say I have not ever seen the engine of my car which Car & Driver recently named the Best Handling Car in America. It's a Boxster, and ... there is no hood to open. I'm okay with that. That "sizable community" is dwindling fast, as computing becomes an appliance technology. Your opinion is disproportionately represented here because HN is much more like the late night parking lot full of ricers in San Bernardino than it's like an arbitrary quarter mile of LA's I-10 rush hour traffic. // Note: iphone-dev's redsn0w[1] has an untethered jailbreak for iOS 5.0.1 on everything but the iPhone 4s and iPad 2. And saurik's Cydia[2] is doing just fine, with plenty of souped up suspensions or new stereo systems if you want to get your hands dirty. 1. http://blog.iphone-dev.org/?0b08b320 http://blog.iphone-dev.org/?0b08b320 2. http://cydia.saurik.com/ http://cydia.saurik.com/
Terretta 15y ago
> HTC is committed to listening to users and delivering customer satisfaction [but] the behavior of your device might be altered including specific absorption rate (SAR) values. Translation: Look, you guys asked for this, so we're giving it to you, but it's probably going to fry your brain. Enjoy.
- ConstantineXVI 15y ago
  They have to say that, in the event some idiot screws with their radio and actually does fry their brain out.
  - wnight 15y ago
    What do they have to say concerning sharpening the phone to a fine point and stabbing yourself with it? Or coating it in honey and choking while trying to swallow it? Or lighting it on fire for warmth but having it set your clothes on fire when you put it in your pocket?
    - ConstantineXVI 15y ago
      The FCC doesn't really care if you can stab yourself with your phone. They do require that phones stay below a certain level of radiation output (which given root access, it's possible to muck with), thus a disclaimer is necessary to make it clear the user's the one screwing up the radio, not HTC's unlocker.
    - FooBarWidget 15y ago
      In a Common Law system such as the one used in the US, law is interpreted to the letter and if something is not mentioned in a contract then it's considered undefined, no matter whether it's reasonable. So even though we can argue that sharpening the phone and stabbing yourself is a foolish thing to do, the law system pretty much requires them to explicitly mention these things or they may be held liable in court. This is also the reason why American contracts are so fscking long compared to most European contracts which follow Civil Law.
iscrewyou 15y ago
Ordered a thunderbolt yesterday and it isn't one of the unlockable devices. Glad XDA exists.
- fpgeek 15y ago
  Did you actually look at the supported devices list on htcdev.com? Or any of the other recent coverage like this: http://lifehacker.com/5871759/htcs-official-bootloader-tool-now-unlocks-more-htc-phones-new-and-old http://lifehacker.com/5871759/htcs-official-bootloader-tool-... Ironically, that article references an XDA report that the official unlock tool works on the Thunderbolt (shortly before HTC announced it).
dkd903 15y ago
No support for HTC Wildfire yet :(
StavrosK 15y ago
Where's the news here? That page has existed for months now, is there something new I don't see?
vsviridov 15y ago
Hey Motorola, get on board, damn it...
listening 15y ago
All these devices should boot to a simple, standard, (extendable) FORTH bootloader. By all means, bundle some pre-packaged code to do all manner of silly things, but also allow users to run whatever code they want on the devices. Why is this such a difficult concept to accept? Nothing has changed since the 1980's in this regard. Consumers still are paying for the hardware, in this case the mobile device. They cannot manufacture the cheap electronics and encasings themselves. However they can replace bootloaders and firmware with free alternatives. Some can can write this code themselves. And sometimes they want to share their efforts with other enthusiasts in the public domain. Nothing has changed since the 1980's - it's still their right to do so.

150 points by aurelianito 15y ago

Not "All" but the newest line-up devices.

mrj 15y ago

Uhm, except they're only unlocking devices "launched after September 2011." That's overlooking a massive population of users who'd like to unlock their device because HTC has stopped supporting them. This, so far, is BS.

darrenkopp 15y ago
All devices launched September 2011 and forward. I agree that they are missing a lot of previous devices, but there are already tools out there to unlock the bootloader on those devices. If I were to make a guess, I would say the September 2011 mark is all devices that are using the current bootloader locking method, and so they are just supporting that instead of going through and making other programs for all previous versions.
- miahi 15y ago
  There are no simple unlock tools for some of the S-ON phones launched before September 2011 (with HBOOT 2.0). HBOOT can be downgraded[1], but it's quite complicated. [1] http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1318919 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1318919
51Cards 15y ago
There is this line as well: "We continue to work on models launched prior to September 2011, please check back often for the status of older devices." My guess is the newest devices have an updated bootloader that they CAN unlock easily. I am betting they may even be stymied by the security they put in place on older devices. This series of events makes sense to me: Spring 2011 - announce we're going to allow unlocking Summer 2011 - update bootloader to be easily unlockable Sept 2011 - start releasing updated loader on devices Dec 2011 - final certification that this is all going to work OK and release to the public 2012 - figure out how to get around our own security on older devices
- koenigdavidmj 15y ago
  > 2012 - figure out how to get around our own security via OTA update on older devices. ??? - Convince carriers to actually take that update
  - 51Cards 15y ago
    Quite possibly.
- notatoad 15y ago
  considering that the custom rom crowd has figured out how to get around the security already, i find it hard to believe that HTC can't do it.
  - 51Cards 15y ago
    I suspect the key difference might be that HTC doesn't want to release the following type of instructions: "Tap settings, Tap Applications, Tap Development, Enable USB Debugging, now install this software on your PC, connect your phone via USB, be sure to un-mount your SD card first... etc. etc." I think they would prefer to release a one shot install fix and that to my knowledge hasn't been figured out yet. In the end it may just not be worth the effort for them to do on older devices as well.

drivebyacct2 15y ago

The reaction I heard to this is that it does not bring S-OFF to these devices. Is this true? I've never quite understood this aspect of HTC devices.

sandycheeks 15y ago
I think this is where they state that in the article. "Please note that unlocking your bootloader does not mean that you will be able to unlock the SIM lock. Unlocking your SIM lock is at the discretion of your operator/carrier and is not part of the bootloader unlocking scope." Is what they call SIM lock the same as S-OFF/S-ON? I always heard it called 'Security-ON/OFF'. With S-ON you can still get temp root access (until you reboot) but can not run different ROMs as it prevents access to memory locations that need to be edited to do that. To get S-OFF on my Evo Shift(Sprint), I had to downgrade it from Android 2.3 and use an old hack specifically because it was the only publicly known way to get S-OFF. There may be better way out now. Unlocking the bootloader was easy. I could do that with temp root on 2.3. Getting S-OFF was the tricky part for me.
- iscrewyou 15y ago
  S-Off gives you a permanent root with your rom. It also means you can change recoveries, hboot and all kinds of other system files and areas. It has nothing to do with Sim Lock or Unlock.
- sandycheeks 15y ago
  Had a little time to dig around and found Sim Lock is different from s-off/on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIM_lock http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIM_lock It appears S-OFF/ON is also set by the operator/carrier and not the manufacturer. I'd love to see a definitive source about S-OFF/ON and how it is implemented. Especially, for the Sprint/HTC combination.
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
drivebyacct2 15y ago
No offense, but the answers here were either wrong or incomplete so I decided to look it up. For those who want the gist of the situation: An unlocked bootloader allows for the booting of kernels that are not signed by HTC (and probably jointly the carriers). S-OFF disables write protection on the /system and /boot partitions. It is part of the NVRAM of the radio and is patched during HBOOT, which I believe is HTC specific. sources: http://alpharev.nl/ http://alpharev.nl/

quanticle 15y ago

This is a canny business decision by HTC. The main problem with Android device manufacturers has been lack of continuing software support. Making an unlockable bootloader allows HTC to free itself from an long-term support commitment while simultaneously silencing the very critics that were pushing for that commitment in the first place.

rauar 15y ago
Or it's just a fishy tactic to increase the number of deniable warranty claims by making "unlocking" officially available to non-technical users.
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
w1ntermute 15y ago
I don't see the problem. The only people who really care about software updates (in the absence of show-stopping bugs) are those that are willing to install custom ROMs. We have a healthy compromise here that keeps both the carriers and the nerds happy. I think we need to temper our expectations with respect to the mobile device industry. We might see smartphones as mini-computers, but the companies that make them do not, and neither does the vast majority of their target audience.
- nitrogen 15y ago
  Anyone installing apps on their phone will probably expect software updates. If their phone they bought a year ago won't work with the latest versions of their favorite Android Market games, due to requiring a newer version of Android, they'll notice.
  - fpgeek 15y ago
    I don't know that end users would end up noticing. I certainly haven't (with the exception of trying to use a G1 after a Froyo device). When I got the Froyo to Gingerbread upgrade on my G2 there were many improvements, but nothing I noticed that affected third-party apps. Even many of my favorite apps that use Honeycomb features (e.g. Plume, Kindle, Google Music, Firefox, etc.) seamlessly support older devices. Google has been pretty good about putting out compatibility libraries for major new APIs (e.g. Fragments) and there's a lot of support for checking the presence or absence of various features / APIs / etc. These days, there's even support in the Android Market for having different versions of the same app for different OS versions. Supporting a range of OS versions is certainly work, but I'm not sure how much more work it is beyond supporting a wide variety of form factors, different hardware features, etc. In any case, the good developers seem to be able to handle it.

jorgecastillo 15y ago

I was giving up on Android, if HTC keeps this policy in the future, I'll be giving up only on other brands. What is the point of having a smartphone (pocket computer?), if you can't make it work like you want.

Terretta 15y ago
> What is the point of having a smartphone (pocket computer?), if you can't make it work like you want? Ask yourself the same thing about a car. Or a toaster. The point for most people is to have it work as designed and not have to think about it.
- freehunter 15y ago
  Yet, like with cars, there exists a sizable community of people who want to put on bigger wheels/tires, a new turbo, a new stereo system, taller suspension, etc. A locked bootloader is the same as having a hood that can only be opened with the dealer's key.
  - Terretta 15y ago
    I don't know a single person that wants to look under their hood any more (though living in greater NYC area, I realize this is not representative of most communities). When I was in high school (mid 80s), everyone did. But even the grease monkeys aren't interested any more. It's kind of like late 80's ricers versus today's German cars. I myself auto-crossed a Honda CRXsi. Today I'm just as into performance, but have other things to do with my time. I can honestly say I have not ever seen the engine of my car which Car & Driver recently named the Best Handling Car in America. It's a Boxster, and ... there is no hood to open. I'm okay with that. That "sizable community" is dwindling fast, as computing becomes an appliance technology. Your opinion is disproportionately represented here because HN is much more like the late night parking lot full of ricers in San Bernardino than it's like an arbitrary quarter mile of LA's I-10 rush hour traffic. // Note: iphone-dev's redsn0w[1] has an untethered jailbreak for iOS 5.0.1 on everything but the iPhone 4s and iPad 2. And saurik's Cydia[2] is doing just fine, with plenty of souped up suspensions or new stereo systems if you want to get your hands dirty. 1. http://blog.iphone-dev.org/?0b08b320 http://blog.iphone-dev.org/?0b08b320 2. http://cydia.saurik.com/ http://cydia.saurik.com/

Terretta 15y ago

> HTC is committed to listening to users and delivering customer satisfaction [but] the behavior of your device might be altered including specific absorption rate (SAR) values. Translation: Look, you guys asked for this, so we're giving it to you, but it's probably going to fry your brain. Enjoy.

ConstantineXVI 15y ago
They have to say that, in the event some idiot screws with their radio and actually does fry their brain out.
- wnight 15y ago
  What do they have to say concerning sharpening the phone to a fine point and stabbing yourself with it? Or coating it in honey and choking while trying to swallow it? Or lighting it on fire for warmth but having it set your clothes on fire when you put it in your pocket?
  - ConstantineXVI 15y ago
    The FCC doesn't really care if you can stab yourself with your phone. They do require that phones stay below a certain level of radiation output (which given root access, it's possible to muck with), thus a disclaimer is necessary to make it clear the user's the one screwing up the radio, not HTC's unlocker.
  - FooBarWidget 15y ago
    In a Common Law system such as the one used in the US, law is interpreted to the letter and if something is not mentioned in a contract then it's considered undefined, no matter whether it's reasonable. So even though we can argue that sharpening the phone and stabbing yourself is a foolish thing to do, the law system pretty much requires them to explicitly mention these things or they may be held liable in court. This is also the reason why American contracts are so fscking long compared to most European contracts which follow Civil Law.

iscrewyou 15y ago

Ordered a thunderbolt yesterday and it isn't one of the unlockable devices. Glad XDA exists.

fpgeek 15y ago
Did you actually look at the supported devices list on htcdev.com? Or any of the other recent coverage like this: http://lifehacker.com/5871759/htcs-official-bootloader-tool-now-unlocks-more-htc-phones-new-and-old http://lifehacker.com/5871759/htcs-official-bootloader-tool-... Ironically, that article references an XDA report that the official unlock tool works on the Thunderbolt (shortly before HTC announced it).

dkd903 15y ago

No support for HTC Wildfire yet :(

StavrosK 15y ago

Where's the news here? That page has existed for months now, is there something new I don't see?

vsviridov 15y ago

Hey Motorola, get on board, damn it...

listening 15y ago

All these devices should boot to a simple, standard, (extendable) FORTH bootloader. By all means, bundle some pre-packaged code to do all manner of silly things, but also allow users to run whatever code they want on the devices. Why is this such a difficult concept to accept? Nothing has changed since the 1980's in this regard. Consumers still are paying for the hardware, in this case the mobile device. They cannot manufacture the cheap electronics and encasings themselves. However they can replace bootloaders and firmware with free alternatives. Some can can write this code themselves. And sometimes they want to share their efforts with other enthusiasts in the public domain. Nothing has changed since the 1980's - it's still their right to do so.