4 ms·

See, I totally agree that you shouldn't require identification for most services. But, for things like banking, car registration, etc... we require strong ID'i

See, I totally agree that you shouldn't require identification for most services. But, for things like banking, car registration, etc... we require strong ID'ing, and it behooves society to make it secure. I still think municipalities should own their own data rather than have it stored at a central federal level, but we need municipalities to rely on something better than a serially-issued social insurance/security number which I have stored in a million databases that can pop at any second. It's easy to dream of the future dystopia and ignore the one we live in now, where identity theft is trivial.

shortstuffsushi 4y ago
Worth calling out imo, in our current world you have recourse and an ability to "recover" from identity theft (to some extent). If the government controls your identity and revokes some piece, what can you do?
- jszymborski 4y ago
  What stops them from doing that today? What stops a government from not renewing your driver's license or passport or not issuing a SIN/SSN or leaking your SIN/SSN? How about just denying you federal services _after_ providing ID? How about putting you on a watch list? Governments have been using IDs to deny services to oppressed peoples since IDs existed, but I think the options that leaves you with is to fight for a free and democratic government or not have IDs.
  - shortstuffsushi 4y ago
    I don't disagree that there are ways the government can deny you service now, just mean wrt a non-government example like identity theft, you at least have some path forward.
logifail 4y ago
> car registration, etc... we require strong ID'ing Can you elaborate on what you mean by "strong"? I've been involved in precisely three car purchases over the last 20 years, and I don't recall what was involved in the way of ID checks. Have the feeling that at most some government-issued ID may have been pulled out of a wallet, presented ... and glanced at. The dealer handled the registration in every case. Oh, and in all three of those purchases we drove a (brand new) vehicle away from the dealer having paid not even a deposit and clutching a paper invoice(!) with the verbal instruction to pay it "straight away". Guess we seemed trustworthy :)
- jszymborski 4y ago
  I guess I should have phrased it as "we _should_ require strong ID'ing". Absolutely agree that currently you can get away with faxed signatures, photocopies of IDs, and all manner of incredibly "weak" ID'ing.
  - catiopatio 4y ago
    > "we _should_ require strong ID'ing". Why? I’d much rather live in a world where privacy is prioritized over making life easier for the police.

shortstuffsushi 4y ago

Worth calling out imo, in our current world you have recourse and an ability to "recover" from identity theft (to some extent). If the government controls your identity and revokes some piece, what can you do?

jszymborski 4y ago
What stops them from doing that today? What stops a government from not renewing your driver's license or passport or not issuing a SIN/SSN or leaking your SIN/SSN? How about just denying you federal services _after_ providing ID? How about putting you on a watch list? Governments have been using IDs to deny services to oppressed peoples since IDs existed, but I think the options that leaves you with is to fight for a free and democratic government or not have IDs.
- shortstuffsushi 4y ago
  I don't disagree that there are ways the government can deny you service now, just mean wrt a non-government example like identity theft, you at least have some path forward.

logifail 4y ago

> car registration, etc... we require strong ID'ing Can you elaborate on what you mean by "strong"? I've been involved in precisely three car purchases over the last 20 years, and I don't recall what was involved in the way of ID checks. Have the feeling that at most some government-issued ID may have been pulled out of a wallet, presented ... and glanced at. The dealer handled the registration in every case. Oh, and in all three of those purchases we drove a (brand new) vehicle away from the dealer having paid not even a deposit and clutching a paper invoice(!) with the verbal instruction to pay it "straight away". Guess we seemed trustworthy :)

jszymborski 4y ago
I guess I should have phrased it as "we _should_ require strong ID'ing". Absolutely agree that currently you can get away with faxed signatures, photocopies of IDs, and all manner of incredibly "weak" ID'ing.
- catiopatio 4y ago
  > "we _should_ require strong ID'ing". Why? I’d much rather live in a world where privacy is prioritized over making life easier for the police.