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I’m trying to understand the threat vector here. Elonjet is in the air transmitting ADSB. From what I remember it’s a Gulfstream that flies higher and faster t

I’m trying to understand the threat vector here. Elonjet is in the air transmitting ADSB. From what I remember it’s a Gulfstream that flies higher and faster than anything commercial. A would-be attacker using this data wouldn’t be able to get anywhere elonjet is destined for before elonjet. Elon almost certainly has armored vehicles that can protect against any small arms fire and entire teams of security at each source and destination that almost certainly secret service-esque secure the area in advance. He also likely has security that secures the plane at rest. So he arrives at the source/destination and likely goes directly to a secured hangar for the movement between armored road vehicles and the plane. What are we worried about here, someone with an RPG, Stinger, or maybe a .50 cal in some advantaged position? Someone planting an IED on the route, runway, etc? Any sophisticated and determined actor who would be able to deploy such means could definitely get the location data with or without a Twitter bot. Meanwhile he’s regularly at Twitter HQ, Tesla, his favorite restaurants, his kids go to schools, etc. People walk around in the open… Elonjet is almost certainly the strongest and most secure aspect of his and his family’s life. If some murderous wacko (or group) wanted to go after him or his family there are much “easier” ways to harm, kidnap, etc. This almost certainly has to be about wealth and power exceptionalism that essentially says “I didn’t buy a Gulfstream AND Twitter so people can track MY jet on MY platform".

Someone 4y ago
> A would-be attacker using this data wouldn’t be able to get anywhere elonjet is destined for before elonjet. If he flies random routes, that’s true, but I doubt he does. You could figure out where he flies regularly, move there, and prepare your ambush. Having real-time data adds that you can tie it to your alarm clock, and better time your final preparations. You wouldn’t have to suspiciously camp out for hours at an airport, for example, getting tired and risking discovery. Now, is that significant? Maybe, if he’s paranoid enough to put a lot of variation in his flight patterns, but I doubt it. Also, as you say, “Any sophisticated and determined actor who would be able to deploy such means could definitely get the location data with or without a Twitter bot.”
- kkielhofner 4y ago
  Every person (no matter how wealthy or powerful) has routines in all aspects of life and you're right that elonjet flies somewhat predictable routes. All of my points about the security of any routine aspect of elonjet movement applies to Elon and his family outside of elonjet. Again, restaurants, external meetings, offices of his various companies, etc. For his family it's likely even more predictable - schools, playdates with friends, extracurricular activities, etc. I am genuinely trying to understand the "security risk" argument for this move. At the risk of the internet classic "I have a friend..." I do have a retired Army Special Forces (Green Beret) friend who's former "co-workers" I've met do high profile executive protection and have described what their work looks like because it's obviously fascinating - that's where I got this general "security playbook" from. They literally adapt head of state, diplomat, etc active warzone-level security measures for their services. It's been mentioned by guests on the Joe Rogan podcast that even at his level he's surrounded by former elite-level military security at all times. Comments like "Wow, when I got to the studio today I wasn't expecting there to be Navy SEALs everywhere". I still believe, all things considered, that elonjet almost certainly has to be the most secure aspect of movement for Elon and his family.
- salawat 4y ago
  ...Flight plans are public record, and must be filed ahead of time. I'm not aware of the acceptability of deviating from them; IFR I believe may be verboten, but VFR you might have leeway. Besides which, taking the "scenic route" while flying completely defeats the point of flying being the most direct way to get from point A to point B. Hence the front loading of the airport security model. You do as little "in air" security as possible, because that crap is horrifyingly expensive because physics.
  - kkielhofner 4y ago
    I've personally flown on private IFR flights where the flight plan was filed something like 10 minutes (or even less) before departure (or amended several times, etc). It doesn't seem like a good way to go about knowing where someone is. Everything regarding elonjet only applies to the aircraft and it's likely he loans out his aircraft to other execs/employees at his companies, miscellaneous friends and family, etc. So even if you somehow developed some methodical and resource-intensive master plan to attack the aircraft or movement associated with it you wouldn't have any guarantee you'd get your intended target. A missile defense system was announced for Gulfstream aircraft at a cost of about $3.5m[0], which for a ~$65m aircraft isn't really that expensive... [0] - https://www.aerospaceonline.com/doc/farnborough-gulfstream-offers-missile-defense-0001 https://www.aerospaceonline.com/doc/farnborough-gulfstream-o...
respectthetos 4y ago
Can I track the real-time location of well-known LGBT activists? The rules should be simple and the same for everyone. - Have free speech, so you can argue for OR against any idea (abortion, immigration, LGBT, cryptos, whatever); - Harassment, abuse, threats, doxxing, etc. are not tolerated against anyone. Basically, target ideas but not individuals. It's a simple rule, really.
- willcipriano 4y ago
  > Can I track the real-time location of well-known LGBT activists? Before the narrative changed with this incident, you would have been accused of stochastic terrorism.
- unionpivo 4y ago
  If you own Twitter and they use your app. You can track them every time they open your app. Which for a lot of people is often.
throwntoday 4y ago
[flagged]

Someone 4y ago

> A would-be attacker using this data wouldn’t be able to get anywhere elonjet is destined for before elonjet. If he flies random routes, that’s true, but I doubt he does. You could figure out where he flies regularly, move there, and prepare your ambush. Having real-time data adds that you can tie it to your alarm clock, and better time your final preparations. You wouldn’t have to suspiciously camp out for hours at an airport, for example, getting tired and risking discovery. Now, is that significant? Maybe, if he’s paranoid enough to put a lot of variation in his flight patterns, but I doubt it. Also, as you say, “Any sophisticated and determined actor who would be able to deploy such means could definitely get the location data with or without a Twitter bot.”

kkielhofner 4y ago
Every person (no matter how wealthy or powerful) has routines in all aspects of life and you're right that elonjet flies somewhat predictable routes. All of my points about the security of any routine aspect of elonjet movement applies to Elon and his family outside of elonjet. Again, restaurants, external meetings, offices of his various companies, etc. For his family it's likely even more predictable - schools, playdates with friends, extracurricular activities, etc. I am genuinely trying to understand the "security risk" argument for this move. At the risk of the internet classic "I have a friend..." I do have a retired Army Special Forces (Green Beret) friend who's former "co-workers" I've met do high profile executive protection and have described what their work looks like because it's obviously fascinating - that's where I got this general "security playbook" from. They literally adapt head of state, diplomat, etc active warzone-level security measures for their services. It's been mentioned by guests on the Joe Rogan podcast that even at his level he's surrounded by former elite-level military security at all times. Comments like "Wow, when I got to the studio today I wasn't expecting there to be Navy SEALs everywhere". I still believe, all things considered, that elonjet almost certainly has to be the most secure aspect of movement for Elon and his family.
salawat 4y ago
...Flight plans are public record, and must be filed ahead of time. I'm not aware of the acceptability of deviating from them; IFR I believe may be verboten, but VFR you might have leeway. Besides which, taking the "scenic route" while flying completely defeats the point of flying being the most direct way to get from point A to point B. Hence the front loading of the airport security model. You do as little "in air" security as possible, because that crap is horrifyingly expensive because physics.
- kkielhofner 4y ago
  I've personally flown on private IFR flights where the flight plan was filed something like 10 minutes (or even less) before departure (or amended several times, etc). It doesn't seem like a good way to go about knowing where someone is. Everything regarding elonjet only applies to the aircraft and it's likely he loans out his aircraft to other execs/employees at his companies, miscellaneous friends and family, etc. So even if you somehow developed some methodical and resource-intensive master plan to attack the aircraft or movement associated with it you wouldn't have any guarantee you'd get your intended target. A missile defense system was announced for Gulfstream aircraft at a cost of about $3.5m[0], which for a ~$65m aircraft isn't really that expensive... [0] - https://www.aerospaceonline.com/doc/farnborough-gulfstream-offers-missile-defense-0001 https://www.aerospaceonline.com/doc/farnborough-gulfstream-o...

respectthetos 4y ago

Can I track the real-time location of well-known LGBT activists? The rules should be simple and the same for everyone. - Have free speech, so you can argue for OR against any idea (abortion, immigration, LGBT, cryptos, whatever); - Harassment, abuse, threats, doxxing, etc. are not tolerated against anyone. Basically, target ideas but not individuals. It's a simple rule, really.

willcipriano 4y ago
> Can I track the real-time location of well-known LGBT activists? Before the narrative changed with this incident, you would have been accused of stochastic terrorism.
unionpivo 4y ago
If you own Twitter and they use your app. You can track them every time they open your app. Which for a lot of people is often.

throwntoday 4y ago

[flagged]