4 ms·

Tinfoil hat on: the dude is a foreign asset and now has to pay dividends. Tinfoil hat off: all the admiration and money he received turned him into whatever it

Tinfoil hat on: the dude is a foreign asset and now has to pay dividends. Tinfoil hat off: all the admiration and money he received turned him into whatever it is that we are seeing today.

dmonitor 4y ago
if elon were a foreign asset, he’d be playing WAY safer with all this shit. he’s probably just doing this because he wants to.
AnimalMuppet 4y ago
Admiration and money don't really change people. It more exposes them.
- franciscop 4y ago
  Why not? I can definitely see it changing people, e.g. a simple example making them more paranoid.
  - DonHopkins 4y ago
    Which makes me even more impressed that Weird Al and Steve Martin are still nice guys. ...Too bad about Dave Chappelle, though. He's on his way to pulling a Gallagher.
  - JackeJR 4y ago
    I think this is maybe in reference to LBJ's lifelong biographer Robert Caro where he states that "power does not corrupt, power reveals". In it he asserts that what one does with power after obtaining it reveals what the person is. It was there all along, power simply makes it show up prominently.
    - franciscop 4y ago
      Yes I understand but I am challenging that with my question (besides "power" in the abstract is very different vs "being constantly recognized/followed"). Certainly being followed, attacked and assaulted in public constantly for being famous can bring trauma, and trauma can change a person, usually for the worse.
  - ilyt 4y ago
    Well, there are multiple facets to it. Suddenly having money and having random relatives and old acquaintances show up in your life asking for it might make someone disillusioned about what they thought about the people. But it won't make genuinely nice person into an asshole that kicks kittens, the money just acts as enabler for stuff they might've been afraid to do before coz of consequences. Like for example pretending to be nice to get promotion at work vs unleashing assholery once there is nobody there to kick you down for your behaviour
- fastball 4y ago
  I'd file this statement alongside the age-old "alcohol doesn't change people it just exposes them" – sounds plausible, but very poorly evidenced.
threeseed 4y ago
It doesn't need to be as conspiratorial as Musk being a foreign asset. If Twitter took loans from interests either connected to or sympathetic to foreign governments e.g. Saudi Arabia, Russia then simply trying to keep them onboard could be enough to influence his decisions.
- shusaku 4y ago
  Ah yes, famously aligned Saudi Arabia and Russia. And anyways, neither of them care about someone tracking his private jet.
  - threeseed 4y ago
    They are both very much aligned on preferring Trump to Biden. Or in having a Twitter that has more lax rules around what they can say.
FormerBandmate 4y ago
He's still giving Ukraine Starlink for free. He'd be an utterly horrible Russian asset
- selcuka 4y ago
  > He's still giving Ukraine Starlink for free Paid for (at least partially) by the U.S. government [1]. You can't easily say "no" to your own government even if you are a foreign asset. [1] https://www.independent.co.uk/tech/spacex-ukraine-elon-musk-starlink-government-b2055491.html https://www.independent.co.uk/tech/spacex-ukraine-elon-musk-...
- mannerheim 4y ago
  GP didn't say which foreign asset. The Saudis are major shareholders in Twitter, although personally I doubt they're telling Musk what to do so much as being content to let him run it into the ground; it's a win for them whether Twitter under Musk succeeds or fails.
- niyikiza 4y ago
  I don't actually even remotely believe that he is a foreign government asset, but I don't think that's a good argument: giving Starlink to Ukraine is exactly one of the things that a Russian asset would do.
- yks 4y ago
  All Ukrainians I know are paying for Starlinks and the fee have been recently increased.
mushbino 4y ago
Nearly all of the value of his companies comes form government grants and loans. He also has large security state contracts with SpaceX and Starlink. He's a US govt asset, which is worse, imo.
- fastball 4y ago
  Umm, pretty sure most of the value of Tesla (his main source of wealth) comes from all their cars, tech, and manufacturing capacity.
  - wahnfrieden 4y ago
    it is not entirely private enterprise - government emissions credits are lucrative
  - jeffbee 4y ago
    Tesla got carried over the chasm by hundreds of millions of dollars in DOE-backed loans, their product is subsidized by state and federal price supports, and all of their profits are due to air pollution swaps, another government subsidy. Good for Tesla for being aligned with the government, I guess. This is to say nothing of Elon's small-potatoes stealing from local governments via Boring.
  - lokar 4y ago
    A lot of (early?) Tesla revenue was other auto makers forced to buy credits from them
    - fastball 4y ago
      Ok, but the vast majority of revenue was not generated from selling credits over the entire lifetime of the company, which is what matters when we are talking about Tesla's present-day value (and therefore the source of Musk's wealth).
  - dexterdog 4y ago
    Most of the value comes from the ponzi scheme that is their stock. Nothing they have in assets, physical or otherwise, ever justified the price of the stock even at half of what it is today.
scaramanga 4y ago
Right... or those are both ludicrous rationalisations for someone who was always a gaping asshole. Many of us managed to never have been fooled by him. If anything turned him into who he is, it would be his childhood. When he writes the xmas card to his half sister / niece, it must be difficult deciding how to fill out the card.
emodendroket 4y ago
He’s just sincerely gotten into right-wing conspiracism and also gotten the power to ban anyone who criticizes him.

Tinfoil hat on: the dude is a foreign asset and now has to pay dividends. Tinfoil hat off: all the admiration and money he received turned him into whatever it is that we are seeing today.

dmonitor 4y ago

if elon were a foreign asset, he’d be playing WAY safer with all this shit. he’s probably just doing this because he wants to.

AnimalMuppet 4y ago

Admiration and money don't really change people. It more exposes them.

franciscop 4y ago
Why not? I can definitely see it changing people, e.g. a simple example making them more paranoid.
- DonHopkins 4y ago
  Which makes me even more impressed that Weird Al and Steve Martin are still nice guys. ...Too bad about Dave Chappelle, though. He's on his way to pulling a Gallagher.
- JackeJR 4y ago
  I think this is maybe in reference to LBJ's lifelong biographer Robert Caro where he states that "power does not corrupt, power reveals". In it he asserts that what one does with power after obtaining it reveals what the person is. It was there all along, power simply makes it show up prominently.
  - franciscop 4y ago
    Yes I understand but I am challenging that with my question (besides "power" in the abstract is very different vs "being constantly recognized/followed"). Certainly being followed, attacked and assaulted in public constantly for being famous can bring trauma, and trauma can change a person, usually for the worse.
- ilyt 4y ago
  Well, there are multiple facets to it. Suddenly having money and having random relatives and old acquaintances show up in your life asking for it might make someone disillusioned about what they thought about the people. But it won't make genuinely nice person into an asshole that kicks kittens, the money just acts as enabler for stuff they might've been afraid to do before coz of consequences. Like for example pretending to be nice to get promotion at work vs unleashing assholery once there is nobody there to kick you down for your behaviour
fastball 4y ago
I'd file this statement alongside the age-old "alcohol doesn't change people it just exposes them" – sounds plausible, but very poorly evidenced.

threeseed 4y ago

It doesn't need to be as conspiratorial as Musk being a foreign asset. If Twitter took loans from interests either connected to or sympathetic to foreign governments e.g. Saudi Arabia, Russia then simply trying to keep them onboard could be enough to influence his decisions.

shusaku 4y ago
Ah yes, famously aligned Saudi Arabia and Russia. And anyways, neither of them care about someone tracking his private jet.
- threeseed 4y ago
  They are both very much aligned on preferring Trump to Biden. Or in having a Twitter that has more lax rules around what they can say.

FormerBandmate 4y ago

He's still giving Ukraine Starlink for free. He'd be an utterly horrible Russian asset

selcuka 4y ago
> He's still giving Ukraine Starlink for free Paid for (at least partially) by the U.S. government [1]. You can't easily say "no" to your own government even if you are a foreign asset. [1] https://www.independent.co.uk/tech/spacex-ukraine-elon-musk-starlink-government-b2055491.html https://www.independent.co.uk/tech/spacex-ukraine-elon-musk-...
mannerheim 4y ago
GP didn't say which foreign asset. The Saudis are major shareholders in Twitter, although personally I doubt they're telling Musk what to do so much as being content to let him run it into the ground; it's a win for them whether Twitter under Musk succeeds or fails.
niyikiza 4y ago
I don't actually even remotely believe that he is a foreign government asset, but I don't think that's a good argument: giving Starlink to Ukraine is exactly one of the things that a Russian asset would do.
yks 4y ago
All Ukrainians I know are paying for Starlinks and the fee have been recently increased.

mushbino 4y ago

Nearly all of the value of his companies comes form government grants and loans. He also has large security state contracts with SpaceX and Starlink. He's a US govt asset, which is worse, imo.

fastball 4y ago
Umm, pretty sure most of the value of Tesla (his main source of wealth) comes from all their cars, tech, and manufacturing capacity.
- wahnfrieden 4y ago
  it is not entirely private enterprise - government emissions credits are lucrative
- jeffbee 4y ago
  Tesla got carried over the chasm by hundreds of millions of dollars in DOE-backed loans, their product is subsidized by state and federal price supports, and all of their profits are due to air pollution swaps, another government subsidy. Good for Tesla for being aligned with the government, I guess. This is to say nothing of Elon's small-potatoes stealing from local governments via Boring.
- lokar 4y ago
  A lot of (early?) Tesla revenue was other auto makers forced to buy credits from them
  - fastball 4y ago
    Ok, but the vast majority of revenue was not generated from selling credits over the entire lifetime of the company, which is what matters when we are talking about Tesla's present-day value (and therefore the source of Musk's wealth).
- dexterdog 4y ago
  Most of the value comes from the ponzi scheme that is their stock. Nothing they have in assets, physical or otherwise, ever justified the price of the stock even at half of what it is today.

scaramanga 4y ago

Right... or those are both ludicrous rationalisations for someone who was always a gaping asshole. Many of us managed to never have been fooled by him. If anything turned him into who he is, it would be his childhood. When he writes the xmas card to his half sister / niece, it must be difficult deciding how to fill out the card.

emodendroket 4y ago

He’s just sincerely gotten into right-wing conspiracism and also gotten the power to ban anyone who criticizes him.