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Do people really believe we can innovate our way through climate change?

ZeroGravitas 4y ago
Yes, in fact I think we probably already have. There's still some politicss to overcome, but if the cheapest source of energy is low carbon then the problem is mostly solved in the big picture. As long as we don't hit too many tipping points we should be okay.
- hocuspocus 4y ago
  You're making pretty extraordinary claims here. While low carbon electricity might be the cheapest source of energy on spot markets, that's a really tiny part of the picture. We still need to figure out large scale storage and electrify everything, those aren't solved problems. But let's assume we solve them. Do we have enough metallic resources on Earth that we can extract cheaply? Do we have enough cheap fossil fuels left to actually do that? Historically there's no energy transition: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/global-energy-substitution?country=~OWID_WRL https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/global-energy-substitutio... New sources of energy have made the world consume more of the old ones, not less. Same thing with technological innovation and gains in energy efficiency.
dqpb 4y ago
Are you suggesting there is a solution without innovation, or that there is no solution at all?
- carabiner 4y ago
  Public policy >> tech solutions. You might get a few people to replace their water heaters if you come up with one more efficient, but that's nothing compared to federally funded nuclear plants.
  - janalsncm 4y ago
    Innovation in nuclear has made it politically viable in the first place. If we still had to use 1970s nuclear tech it would be a hard sell. In any case, I’m always skeptical of “we can’t do X without doing Y” arguments because they’re usually about making the perfect the enemy of the good rather than X actually being precluded by not having Y.
  - dqpb 4y ago
    > Public policy >> tech solutions You can't heat your home with public policy
    - fragmede 4y ago
      You can if you print them out first.
CabSauce 4y ago
The real question is did we start too late to curb climate change? We'll innovate to mitigate its damages either way.
dev_daftly 4y ago
Do people really believe the climate was ever going to stop changing?
kokanee 4y ago
Interesting position. Are you suggesting that the solution will not involve innovation, or that climate change is unsolvable? As an employee at a climate tech company, I think the primary roadblock is simply investing resources (money and time) in the various solutions available to us. A ton of innovation is happening along the way (e.g. first ever net positive fusion ignition yesterday) but even without much innovation, we could solve the problems by directing our resources at them. In other words, I think climate change is very solvable and that innovation along the way is constant and inevitable. I'm not saying that we will definitely make the necessary investments to succeed, which I think might be your point? But as this post demonstrates, the rate of investment is improving significantly.
orangecat 4y ago
Yes. And even if it's not certain, it has a much greater chance of success than trying to impose worldwide consumption limits.
ngoilapites 4y ago
The gap here might be on combining social innovation with tech, which alone will not succeed.

Yes, in fact I think we probably already have. There's still some politicss to overcome, but if the cheapest source of energy is low carbon then the problem is mostly solved in the big picture. As long as we don't hit too many tipping points we should be okay.

hocuspocus 4y ago
You're making pretty extraordinary claims here. While low carbon electricity might be the cheapest source of energy on spot markets, that's a really tiny part of the picture. We still need to figure out large scale storage and electrify everything, those aren't solved problems. But let's assume we solve them. Do we have enough metallic resources on Earth that we can extract cheaply? Do we have enough cheap fossil fuels left to actually do that? Historically there's no energy transition: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/global-energy-substitution?country=~OWID_WRL https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/global-energy-substitutio... New sources of energy have made the world consume more of the old ones, not less. Same thing with technological innovation and gains in energy efficiency.

dqpb 4y ago

Are you suggesting there is a solution without innovation, or that there is no solution at all?

carabiner 4y ago
Public policy >> tech solutions. You might get a few people to replace their water heaters if you come up with one more efficient, but that's nothing compared to federally funded nuclear plants.
- janalsncm 4y ago
  Innovation in nuclear has made it politically viable in the first place. If we still had to use 1970s nuclear tech it would be a hard sell. In any case, I’m always skeptical of “we can’t do X without doing Y” arguments because they’re usually about making the perfect the enemy of the good rather than X actually being precluded by not having Y.
- dqpb 4y ago
  > Public policy >> tech solutions You can't heat your home with public policy
  - fragmede 4y ago
    You can if you print them out first.

CabSauce 4y ago

The real question is did we start too late to curb climate change? We'll innovate to mitigate its damages either way.

dev_daftly 4y ago

Do people really believe the climate was ever going to stop changing?

kokanee 4y ago

Interesting position. Are you suggesting that the solution will not involve innovation, or that climate change is unsolvable? As an employee at a climate tech company, I think the primary roadblock is simply investing resources (money and time) in the various solutions available to us. A ton of innovation is happening along the way (e.g. first ever net positive fusion ignition yesterday) but even without much innovation, we could solve the problems by directing our resources at them. In other words, I think climate change is very solvable and that innovation along the way is constant and inevitable. I'm not saying that we will definitely make the necessary investments to succeed, which I think might be your point? But as this post demonstrates, the rate of investment is improving significantly.

orangecat 4y ago

Yes. And even if it's not certain, it has a much greater chance of success than trying to impose worldwide consumption limits.

ngoilapites 4y ago

The gap here might be on combining social innovation with tech, which alone will not succeed.