4 ms·

Only insofar that they are anti-establishment and the media uses them for ragebait, and they troll the media. Trump is a rent seeker celebrity. Elon is one of

by memish 4y ago

Only insofar that they are anti-establishment and the media uses them for ragebait, and they troll the media. Trump is a rent seeker celebrity. Elon is one of the most productive humans. They are radically different but both break people's brains because they are supposed to be pro-establishment refined elites. Instead they are uncouth and align more with the working poors and dissidents. That's the biggest sin and it's what drives TDS and EDS respectively.

berkes 4y ago
> Elon is the most productive human That's an impossible to prove statement. And it reeks of fanboysim all over. It makes your entire argument look very biased as well.
- memish 4y ago
  If he's not, he's certainly close. The point is he produces more than he consumes and does so at high scale. You can measure the impact of Tesla and SpaceX with the number of cars and rockets produced. Payload to orbit and so on. That would not have happened if he hadn't spent most of his time and money there for the past 20 years. Who would you say is the most productive?
  - JumpinJack_Cash 4y ago
    > That would not have happened if he hadn't spent most of his time and money there for the past 20 years. It would have happened just like that, only the person doing the signing off (because that's what CEO do, they sign off stuff built by others) on those projects would have been called say "Mlon Eusk" a Swedish entrepreneur who moved to California, and right now you'd be worshipping him instead. It's the same for everything, if Albert Einstein didn't come up with relativity it would have been Elbert Ainstain . It's really bizzarre how any knowledge of statistics goes out of the window when disucussing people, celebrities and historical figures. I guess it's a protection mechanism of the human brain so each and everyone of us can still believe that everyone could be a Powerball winner as long as they work hard enough or want it bad enough, whereas in reality it's just the luck of the draw, only the draw is only visible by people who manage to override that protection mechanism in their brain and look at reality as it is.
    - memish 4y ago
      You don't luck into the theory of relativity or into building a rocket company. Both took serious effort way beyond the norm combined with a higher than average IQ and determination, those parts you can attribute to luck of birth. They shouldn't be worshiped. No, but encouraged and recognized, yes. Einstein could have just done his 9-5 at the patent office. Elon could be hanging out on a yacht.
      - JumpinJack_Cash 4y ago
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias And specifically: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias#Highly_competitive_careers https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias#Highly_compe...
      - Apocryphon 4y ago
        I don't think those are achievements you attain through luck, but any field involves many studying it. Jules Henri Poincaré and Hendrik Lorentz were so involved with the effort that some have accused Einstein of plagiarizing their work. While that is certainly of dubious claim, it illustrates that he was far from alone in his field. https://www.straightdope.com/21343699/was-einstein-a-plagiarist https://www.straightdope.com/21343699/was-einstein-a-plagiar... As far as building a rocket company goes, yes, SpaceX has certainly achieved much, not least with reusable rockets. But again, Musk is hardly the only one in that space. Richard Branson has been at it since 2004, for instance, and at this point it's very trendy. Even Steve Wozniak started one.
  - berkes 4y ago
    If output is your KPI, you should certainly define it precisely. If purely net worth, Musk isn't the 'most productive' because he simply isn't the richest person in the world, and has been loosing billions in months. But I presume you have a different 'productivity' in mind than just worth. If it's purely numbers of products, someone from the Tata family is probably producing way more cars, rockets and social media platforms. Or else someone in Ali group. Or someone at Aramco, idk. Tesla sells way, way, way fewer (electrical) vehicles than most other large car manufacturers indivually do. If it's relatively to where they started, Musk comes from a (very) wealthy South African family. He certainly increased his wealth incredibly, but I'm certain you'll find a Nigerian, Bangladeshi or even European person who, relatively, increased their wealth much more. Simply by being born with a debt, or nothing, and becoming reasonably rich, will make such a KPI higher.
andrepd 4y ago
>Elon is the most productive human I need to take a break from this website.
- Archipelagia 4y ago
  OP didn't say "the", they said "one of the". Don't manipulate. Not a fan of Musk myself, but yeah, he actually seems to be an extremely productive person. Whether this productivity is applied in the right place is another discussion.
  - jacquesm 4y ago
    You missed the ninja edit, it said 'the' initially.

by memish 4y ago

berkes 4y ago

> Elon is the most productive human That's an impossible to prove statement. And it reeks of fanboysim all over. It makes your entire argument look very biased as well.

memish 4y ago
If he's not, he's certainly close. The point is he produces more than he consumes and does so at high scale. You can measure the impact of Tesla and SpaceX with the number of cars and rockets produced. Payload to orbit and so on. That would not have happened if he hadn't spent most of his time and money there for the past 20 years. Who would you say is the most productive?
- JumpinJack_Cash 4y ago
  > That would not have happened if he hadn't spent most of his time and money there for the past 20 years. It would have happened just like that, only the person doing the signing off (because that's what CEO do, they sign off stuff built by others) on those projects would have been called say "Mlon Eusk" a Swedish entrepreneur who moved to California, and right now you'd be worshipping him instead. It's the same for everything, if Albert Einstein didn't come up with relativity it would have been Elbert Ainstain . It's really bizzarre how any knowledge of statistics goes out of the window when disucussing people, celebrities and historical figures. I guess it's a protection mechanism of the human brain so each and everyone of us can still believe that everyone could be a Powerball winner as long as they work hard enough or want it bad enough, whereas in reality it's just the luck of the draw, only the draw is only visible by people who manage to override that protection mechanism in their brain and look at reality as it is.
  - memish 4y ago
    You don't luck into the theory of relativity or into building a rocket company. Both took serious effort way beyond the norm combined with a higher than average IQ and determination, those parts you can attribute to luck of birth. They shouldn't be worshiped. No, but encouraged and recognized, yes. Einstein could have just done his 9-5 at the patent office. Elon could be hanging out on a yacht.
    - JumpinJack_Cash 4y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias And specifically: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias#Highly_competitive_careers https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias#Highly_compe...
    - Apocryphon 4y ago
      I don't think those are achievements you attain through luck, but any field involves many studying it. Jules Henri Poincaré and Hendrik Lorentz were so involved with the effort that some have accused Einstein of plagiarizing their work. While that is certainly of dubious claim, it illustrates that he was far from alone in his field. https://www.straightdope.com/21343699/was-einstein-a-plagiarist https://www.straightdope.com/21343699/was-einstein-a-plagiar... As far as building a rocket company goes, yes, SpaceX has certainly achieved much, not least with reusable rockets. But again, Musk is hardly the only one in that space. Richard Branson has been at it since 2004, for instance, and at this point it's very trendy. Even Steve Wozniak started one.
- berkes 4y ago
  If output is your KPI, you should certainly define it precisely. If purely net worth, Musk isn't the 'most productive' because he simply isn't the richest person in the world, and has been loosing billions in months. But I presume you have a different 'productivity' in mind than just worth. If it's purely numbers of products, someone from the Tata family is probably producing way more cars, rockets and social media platforms. Or else someone in Ali group. Or someone at Aramco, idk. Tesla sells way, way, way fewer (electrical) vehicles than most other large car manufacturers indivually do. If it's relatively to where they started, Musk comes from a (very) wealthy South African family. He certainly increased his wealth incredibly, but I'm certain you'll find a Nigerian, Bangladeshi or even European person who, relatively, increased their wealth much more. Simply by being born with a debt, or nothing, and becoming reasonably rich, will make such a KPI higher.

andrepd 4y ago

>Elon is the most productive human I need to take a break from this website.

Archipelagia 4y ago
OP didn't say "the", they said "one of the". Don't manipulate. Not a fan of Musk myself, but yeah, he actually seems to be an extremely productive person. Whether this productivity is applied in the right place is another discussion.
- jacquesm 4y ago
  You missed the ninja edit, it said 'the' initially.