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> "The UK’s main adversaries today — China, Russia, Iran and North Korea — are repressive societies with few women in positions of power." (I know this is from

by the_af 4y ago

> "The UK’s main adversaries today — China, Russia, Iran and North Korea — are repressive societies with few women in positions of power." (I know this is from TFA, not written by you) At least Russia and North Korea have women in positions of power, so it seems disingenuous to lump them together with Iran, at the very least. I'm unsure about China now, but there used to be very influential Chinese women. Also, Russia mastered the art of using women in intelligence (and sure, honeytraps), particularly because the West also tends to overlook them. Or are we going to pretend it's only our enemies that do this, as if the battle for equality was already won on our side?

elteto 4y ago
NK? Where do you see women represented in positions of power? Honest question. Kim Il Sung (or his son? memory is hazy) had a special all-female army unit that was his literal harem. I don’t think they value women very much, outside perhaps of nepotism.
- the_af 4y ago
  Kim Yo-jong, Kim Jong-un's sister, is a woman in power in North Korea [1] (yes, probably because she is his sister, but she's no figurehead, and how else does one rise to power in North Korea anyway?) and is deemed by some analysts as a possible successor to her brother. This doesn't make it a rule, but it shows there are women with power in North Korea. Because it's such an opaque country to outside observers, who knows how many more are there? Keep in mind the world didn't even know of her existence until relatively recently (about 2014). I don't think something like this -- a woman being considered to run the country -- would be even thinkable in Iran. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Yo-jong https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Yo-jong
  - conviencefee999 4y ago
    Ironically there's a female only division in North Korea's army though it's claimed that they are comfort woman from South Korean sources that doesn't really seem accurate. Especially considering the statements made about being solely for Kim Jong Un and the fact that the same sources also go on to state how he exclusively only dates European models, which is also ironic when you consider he seems to be in love with his with who is also Korean. In which she is obese so it's hard to consider him choosing her for her appearance.
    - boomboomsubban 4y ago
      I believe the term "comfort women" only refers to the women forced into sexual slavery by the Japanese Imperial Army, the term is a direct translation of a Japanese word. It's possible North Korea had a division made up of former comfort womem at some point, but I've never heard of it and the youngest members left would be in their 80's now.
martopix 4y ago
Fair point, but in defence of the author, I think there's a huge difference between having some women in positions of power and the attitude that people have towards women in daily life. I can totally imagine a society in which certain women from privileged background can rise to power (if, regarding north korea, you're talking about Kim Jong Un's sister, that's a great example), and yet the assumption most people have when they meet a woman is definitely not that she is someone powerful or to be wary of. Also, what spies have is not 'power'. I wonder for example how many women there are in the high ranks of the army, even for the countries you listed and many others.
- the_af 4y ago
  Yes, I was thinking of Kim Jong-un's sister. Agreed that spies do not have "power" in that sense; I was just echoing the words of TFA and showing counterexamples. Most armies of the world are sexist in any case, why single out the current adversaries of the West? Western armies are traditionally sexist as well. Yes, now there are some high ranking officers and even generals in some of the most modern Western armies -- meaning the general rule is still that sexism is rampant. > yet the assumption most people have when they meet a woman is definitely not that she is someone powerful or to be wary of Yes, but this seems to be the rule in many countries which are traditionally aligned with the West.
  - martopix 4y ago
    Yes, in this sense I agree.

by the_af 4y ago

elteto 4y ago

NK? Where do you see women represented in positions of power? Honest question. Kim Il Sung (or his son? memory is hazy) had a special all-female army unit that was his literal harem. I don’t think they value women very much, outside perhaps of nepotism.

the_af 4y ago
Kim Yo-jong, Kim Jong-un's sister, is a woman in power in North Korea [1] (yes, probably because she is his sister, but she's no figurehead, and how else does one rise to power in North Korea anyway?) and is deemed by some analysts as a possible successor to her brother. This doesn't make it a rule, but it shows there are women with power in North Korea. Because it's such an opaque country to outside observers, who knows how many more are there? Keep in mind the world didn't even know of her existence until relatively recently (about 2014). I don't think something like this -- a woman being considered to run the country -- would be even thinkable in Iran. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Yo-jong https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Yo-jong
- conviencefee999 4y ago
  Ironically there's a female only division in North Korea's army though it's claimed that they are comfort woman from South Korean sources that doesn't really seem accurate. Especially considering the statements made about being solely for Kim Jong Un and the fact that the same sources also go on to state how he exclusively only dates European models, which is also ironic when you consider he seems to be in love with his with who is also Korean. In which she is obese so it's hard to consider him choosing her for her appearance.
  - boomboomsubban 4y ago
    I believe the term "comfort women" only refers to the women forced into sexual slavery by the Japanese Imperial Army, the term is a direct translation of a Japanese word. It's possible North Korea had a division made up of former comfort womem at some point, but I've never heard of it and the youngest members left would be in their 80's now.

martopix 4y ago

Fair point, but in defence of the author, I think there's a huge difference between having some women in positions of power and the attitude that people have towards women in daily life. I can totally imagine a society in which certain women from privileged background can rise to power (if, regarding north korea, you're talking about Kim Jong Un's sister, that's a great example), and yet the assumption most people have when they meet a woman is definitely not that she is someone powerful or to be wary of. Also, what spies have is not 'power'. I wonder for example how many women there are in the high ranks of the army, even for the countries you listed and many others.

the_af 4y ago
Yes, I was thinking of Kim Jong-un's sister. Agreed that spies do not have "power" in that sense; I was just echoing the words of TFA and showing counterexamples. Most armies of the world are sexist in any case, why single out the current adversaries of the West? Western armies are traditionally sexist as well. Yes, now there are some high ranking officers and even generals in some of the most modern Western armies -- meaning the general rule is still that sexism is rampant. > yet the assumption most people have when they meet a woman is definitely not that she is someone powerful or to be wary of Yes, but this seems to be the rule in many countries which are traditionally aligned with the West.
- martopix 4y ago
  Yes, in this sense I agree.