4 ms·

When I said LoL events get 200k views, do you understand that was correct? Because, in context, I meant, "at least that much and often more," not the opposite?

When I said LoL events get 200k views, do you understand that was correct? Because, in context, I meant, "at least that much and often more," not the opposite? If you had understood my comment, you wouldn't have had to look anything up - you would've known that LoL events do indeed get more than 200k views without checking. Right? That requires considering the context and interpreting ambiguous comments charitably, as suggested in the HN Guidelines: "Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith." When you misinterpreted my comment and triumphantly declared me wrong and accused me of bad faith, well, that's the opposite of that. Anyone can misunderstand something, it happens, but you need to be willing to say, "Either that guy's crazy or I'm missing something" and default to the latter rather than the former, like I did about the NFL thing. Also it might be worth taking a step back and considering the topic, and whether such a combative tone is appropriate for it. And while you're at it, do you even disagree with the point of my comments, as opposed to the numbers? If so, I missed the part where you said so.

Kranar 4y ago
Imagine we were talking about the population of countries, and you made the assertion that "4 million people live in Canada" and then when I point out that "No, 40 million people live in Canada" you get into a hissy fit about how I misunderstood you, I don't understand context, I'm being combative and not charitable. That's how silly you sound right now. You made up a number and pulled it out of nowhere in order to make your argument seem more legitimate than it was, and when I pointed out that you are wrong by an entire order of magnitude along with a source you could use to better inform yourself, instead of just acknowledging you were wrong, you decided to double down on your ignorance. Now instead of discussing the actual topic at hand, you want to derail the conversation into one about etiquette, politeness, HN Guidelines and how unpleasant this conversation is for you despite the fact that no one is forcing you into it. You certainly don't need to publicly admit you're wrong, I don't care one way or another what you personally think... but you also shouldn't attempt so desperately to save face either.
- ineptech 4y ago
  I'm sorry dude, I definitely meant at least 200k, not no more than 200k. Source: I am the world's leading expert in what I meant. I honestly can't see how that can be misunderstood, either. You said SC2 gets 25k views, and I said, "The reason LoL gets 100-200k is..." and then went on to talk about how much better funded LoL is. How can you read that any other way than, "The reason LoL gets so many more viewers than SC2 is..." ? > ...by an entire order of magnitude... I chose such a low number, ironically, to avoid a conversation like this one. When you're suggesting that a number is high (as I was), it makes sense to choose a lower bound because it makes your claim stronger. Suppose I had said that LoL events get 5M - then you could've replied, "Nuh uh, here's an event that only got 1M views!" If I had said 1M, you could've said, "Well here's one that only got 500k!" I chose the lowest number I could that would still support my point (which, again was that LoL gets a lot more viewers than SC2), to be more confident no one could argue with it. If you respond, could you please clarify what you think my argument was? You said I made up a number to make my argument more legitimate. What argument? What could I have been arguing that would've been strengthened by suggesting LoL's viewership is lower than it really is?
  - Kranar 4y ago
    >I chose such a low number, ironically, to avoid a conversation like this one. Don't invent numbers or facts to mislead people into thinking you know more about this topic than you do. If you don't want to discuss specific numbers, then don't state specific numbers, say that "More people do X than Y" without trying to get specific about how many people do either. When you invent facts to justify your position, you mislead people who don't otherwise know any better and misrepresent yourself as being more of a knowledgeable authority on a subject than you really are. This is how misinformation gets spread. Finally, when someone calls you out on incorrect facts, instead of playing the victim card and getting all defensive about it, own up to the mistake and use it as an opportunity to learn something new. As humiliating as it seems right now, I assure you not even one week from now you'll forget all about this bickering between us. The worst thing that can happen is you decide to continue believing incorrect facts all because you were too embarrassed to admit you were wrong about something that can be independently verified. This is how we end up with people believing all kinds of wrong and harmful ideas, because they're just too proud or embarrassed to simply admit they got something wrong. I've said all I care to about this topic, you can have the last word and all the best to in the future.

Kranar 4y ago

Imagine we were talking about the population of countries, and you made the assertion that "4 million people live in Canada" and then when I point out that "No, 40 million people live in Canada" you get into a hissy fit about how I misunderstood you, I don't understand context, I'm being combative and not charitable. That's how silly you sound right now. You made up a number and pulled it out of nowhere in order to make your argument seem more legitimate than it was, and when I pointed out that you are wrong by an entire order of magnitude along with a source you could use to better inform yourself, instead of just acknowledging you were wrong, you decided to double down on your ignorance. Now instead of discussing the actual topic at hand, you want to derail the conversation into one about etiquette, politeness, HN Guidelines and how unpleasant this conversation is for you despite the fact that no one is forcing you into it. You certainly don't need to publicly admit you're wrong, I don't care one way or another what you personally think... but you also shouldn't attempt so desperately to save face either.

ineptech 4y ago
I'm sorry dude, I definitely meant at least 200k, not no more than 200k. Source: I am the world's leading expert in what I meant. I honestly can't see how that can be misunderstood, either. You said SC2 gets 25k views, and I said, "The reason LoL gets 100-200k is..." and then went on to talk about how much better funded LoL is. How can you read that any other way than, "The reason LoL gets so many more viewers than SC2 is..." ? > ...by an entire order of magnitude... I chose such a low number, ironically, to avoid a conversation like this one. When you're suggesting that a number is high (as I was), it makes sense to choose a lower bound because it makes your claim stronger. Suppose I had said that LoL events get 5M - then you could've replied, "Nuh uh, here's an event that only got 1M views!" If I had said 1M, you could've said, "Well here's one that only got 500k!" I chose the lowest number I could that would still support my point (which, again was that LoL gets a lot more viewers than SC2), to be more confident no one could argue with it. If you respond, could you please clarify what you think my argument was? You said I made up a number to make my argument more legitimate. What argument? What could I have been arguing that would've been strengthened by suggesting LoL's viewership is lower than it really is?
- Kranar 4y ago
  >I chose such a low number, ironically, to avoid a conversation like this one. Don't invent numbers or facts to mislead people into thinking you know more about this topic than you do. If you don't want to discuss specific numbers, then don't state specific numbers, say that "More people do X than Y" without trying to get specific about how many people do either. When you invent facts to justify your position, you mislead people who don't otherwise know any better and misrepresent yourself as being more of a knowledgeable authority on a subject than you really are. This is how misinformation gets spread. Finally, when someone calls you out on incorrect facts, instead of playing the victim card and getting all defensive about it, own up to the mistake and use it as an opportunity to learn something new. As humiliating as it seems right now, I assure you not even one week from now you'll forget all about this bickering between us. The worst thing that can happen is you decide to continue believing incorrect facts all because you were too embarrassed to admit you were wrong about something that can be independently verified. This is how we end up with people believing all kinds of wrong and harmful ideas, because they're just too proud or embarrassed to simply admit they got something wrong. I've said all I care to about this topic, you can have the last word and all the best to in the future.