4 ms·

I understand this is a poem that is focused on artistic expression and not scientific accuracy, but I find the line about “carbon in our souls” to be out of pla

by gretch 4y ago

I understand this is a poem that is focused on artistic expression and not scientific accuracy, but I find the line about “carbon in our souls” to be out of place. I guess the rest of the poem is incidentally correct (when not abstract)

ok_dad 4y ago
One who is a materialist could argue that your "soul" comes from the stuff you're made out of, so your "soul" probably has carbon it somewhere.
dr_dshiv 4y ago
Sure, the word “soul” comes from the proto Germanic “saiwiz” (for sea or ocean). But not because “you are like a drop in the ocean,” but because “you are like an ocean in a drop.” The idea of soul can be objectionable when it is based on an immortal being or on a vitalist life-force (like “anima” of the Latin). But it seems fine when it is based on the psyche (like the “Psuche” of the Greek). I embrace taboo words like soul because they 1. are common 2. are useful for referring to things that seem pretty important (like avoiding soulless companies or products or buildings) and 3. are challenging to my normal (scientific) understanding of the world. Still, I’d be more comfortable if the poem referred to the “carbon of our souls” rather than “carbon in our souls.” Hmm…
guelo 4y ago
You could define soul as the fuel engine for life, which is basically burning carbon. As long as that furnace is functioning you're alive == you have a soul.
alchemyromcom 4y ago
>Carbon in our souls I think it might be an allusion to alchemy. Basically, the alchemists believed that ash (what was left after burning something) was the soul of all things...And-- this is where my complete lack of understanding about science shows-- I'm pretty sure Ash has lots of carbon? It's, you know, poetic. Many have claimed that poems are the "language of paradox" so it's okay for it to be a little non-literal. My interpretation of it, though, is that the soul is something impure that you must burn away, or maybe that the soul is polluted by our own words and behavior. It's definitely not meant to be scientifically accurate.
- kragen 4y ago
  ash has no carbon carbon's oxides are all gaseous at standard temperature and pressure
  - lliamander 4y ago
    Not quite. Plenty of carbon is release as carbon oxides, but calcium carbonate is also a major component of ash (or at least wood ash).
    - kragen 4y ago
      good point little carbon, then, not none
  - elihu 4y ago
    Going by what wikipedia says, wood ash can have carbon. If I understand correctly, how much depends largely on how hot it burned. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wood_ash#Elemental_analysis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wood_ash#Elemental_analysis

by gretch 4y ago

ok_dad 4y ago

One who is a materialist could argue that your "soul" comes from the stuff you're made out of, so your "soul" probably has carbon it somewhere.

dr_dshiv 4y ago

Sure, the word “soul” comes from the proto Germanic “saiwiz” (for sea or ocean). But not because “you are like a drop in the ocean,” but because “you are like an ocean in a drop.” The idea of soul can be objectionable when it is based on an immortal being or on a vitalist life-force (like “anima” of the Latin). But it seems fine when it is based on the psyche (like the “Psuche” of the Greek). I embrace taboo words like soul because they 1. are common 2. are useful for referring to things that seem pretty important (like avoiding soulless companies or products or buildings) and 3. are challenging to my normal (scientific) understanding of the world. Still, I’d be more comfortable if the poem referred to the “carbon of our souls” rather than “carbon in our souls.” Hmm…

guelo 4y ago

You could define soul as the fuel engine for life, which is basically burning carbon. As long as that furnace is functioning you're alive == you have a soul.

alchemyromcom 4y ago

>Carbon in our souls I think it might be an allusion to alchemy. Basically, the alchemists believed that ash (what was left after burning something) was the soul of all things...And-- this is where my complete lack of understanding about science shows-- I'm pretty sure Ash has lots of carbon? It's, you know, poetic. Many have claimed that poems are the "language of paradox" so it's okay for it to be a little non-literal. My interpretation of it, though, is that the soul is something impure that you must burn away, or maybe that the soul is polluted by our own words and behavior. It's definitely not meant to be scientifically accurate.

kragen 4y ago
ash has no carbon carbon's oxides are all gaseous at standard temperature and pressure
- lliamander 4y ago
  Not quite. Plenty of carbon is release as carbon oxides, but calcium carbonate is also a major component of ash (or at least wood ash).
  - kragen 4y ago
    good point little carbon, then, not none
- elihu 4y ago
  Going by what wikipedia says, wood ash can have carbon. If I understand correctly, how much depends largely on how hot it burned. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wood_ash#Elemental_analysis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wood_ash#Elemental_analysis