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Is doctor pay much higher in the US than the EU? I had always assumed that healthcare had crazy high costs in the US because they have a middleman who is motiv

Is doctor pay much higher in the US than the EU? I had always assumed that healthcare had crazy high costs in the US because they have a middleman who is motivated to refuse payment as much as possible (insurance companies) so healthcare providers have to inflate costs to try and stay even.

idontpost 4y ago
martinald 4y ago
Average doctor salary is $300k in the US. Top doctors can make over a million/yr. This is at least 3x what most doctors can expect in western europe.
- freedom2099 4y ago
  Yes… but doctors in Europe don’t have to pay for expensive health insurances XD
  - sofixa 4y ago
    And don't start with half a million or whatever 6 figure sum student loan debts to reimburse.
    - freedom2099 4y ago
      Right… they got their education almost for free
  - KptMarchewa 4y ago
    And no malpractice insurance.
    - freedom2099 4y ago
      Also true
astrange 4y ago
It's much higher, there are fewer healthcare providers of all kinds, and Americans use more expensive healthcare services. It's not more expensive because insurance companies are charging you, their costs are passed through from providers. Also, out-of-pocket healthcare spending as % GDP is lower in the US than in the UK. Expensive healthcare in $ doesn't matter when you're paid so much more. https://twitter.com/quantian1/status/1602097888385015811 https://twitter.com/quantian1/status/1602097888385015811
- TheOtherHobbes 4y ago
  I'm not sure what "out of pocket" is supposed to mean in this context. The UK's NHS has standardised fees paid at relatively standard rates out of taxes. Most care is free at point of service. Prescriptions aren't free, but it's possible to cap the annual amount spent on meds at a very low level. (Last time I looked it was somewhere around £100.) Meanwhile the US has hundreds of thousands of medical bankruptcies every year. https://balancingeverything.com/medical-bankruptcies-statistics https://balancingeverything.com/medical-bankruptcies-statist... Health care is more expensive because most insurance doesn't contribute much to out-of-network costs, and if you have an accident in the middle of nowhere you won't get directed to the nearest in-network facility. Even if you're in-network copays, exclusions, and other scams can turn a medical emergency into a financial catastrophe. It's a completely outrageous, exploitative, inhumane system.
  - astrange 4y ago
    https://data.oecd.org/healthres/health-spending.htm https://data.oecd.org/healthres/health-spending.htm I imagine it covers dentists, specialists, traveling out of country or private coverage because it's faster. I know for a fact my healthcare spending would be higher in Australia than it is in the US despite it having free healthcare. (As in, I’ve paid it.)
  - 0xBDB 4y ago
    "Out of pocket" means what you pay versus what your insurance company pays. By law, the most that can be per year is $18,200 per family in 2023 [1], though it is much lower for almost any employer health plan. My family is very healthy and so I get the crappiest coverage my employer offers for nearly free for my family (because the employer gets a tax break) and mine is $10,000. The limit resets on January 1 and insurance companies can try to weasel on what's covered, though they rarely win those appeals, but on the flip side, most medical expenses are negotiable in that kind of case. The bottom line is that our healthcare system serves several percent of the population (but not the very bottom tier, who have medicaid and public hospitals) incredibly badly and for everyone else is normally just annoying. It's possible for an American software developer with reasonable spending habits to have a medical emergency turn into a financial catastrophe, but it would be really hard. A lot of Europeans seem to believe that their healthcare costs make up for the salary differential. This is not a reasonable belief even before factoring in taxes and cost of living in most cities. [1] https://www.healthcare.gov/glossary/out-of-pocket-maximum-limit/ https://www.healthcare.gov/glossary/out-of-pocket-maximum-li...
jandrewrogers 4y ago
Doctors in the US make FAANG engineer money.

idontpost 4y ago

martinald 4y ago

Average doctor salary is $300k in the US. Top doctors can make over a million/yr. This is at least 3x what most doctors can expect in western europe.

freedom2099 4y ago
Yes… but doctors in Europe don’t have to pay for expensive health insurances XD
- sofixa 4y ago
  And don't start with half a million or whatever 6 figure sum student loan debts to reimburse.
  - freedom2099 4y ago
    Right… they got their education almost for free
- KptMarchewa 4y ago
  And no malpractice insurance.
  - freedom2099 4y ago
    Also true

astrange 4y ago

It's much higher, there are fewer healthcare providers of all kinds, and Americans use more expensive healthcare services. It's not more expensive because insurance companies are charging you, their costs are passed through from providers. Also, out-of-pocket healthcare spending as % GDP is lower in the US than in the UK. Expensive healthcare in $ doesn't matter when you're paid so much more. https://twitter.com/quantian1/status/1602097888385015811 https://twitter.com/quantian1/status/1602097888385015811

TheOtherHobbes 4y ago
I'm not sure what "out of pocket" is supposed to mean in this context. The UK's NHS has standardised fees paid at relatively standard rates out of taxes. Most care is free at point of service. Prescriptions aren't free, but it's possible to cap the annual amount spent on meds at a very low level. (Last time I looked it was somewhere around £100.) Meanwhile the US has hundreds of thousands of medical bankruptcies every year. https://balancingeverything.com/medical-bankruptcies-statistics https://balancingeverything.com/medical-bankruptcies-statist... Health care is more expensive because most insurance doesn't contribute much to out-of-network costs, and if you have an accident in the middle of nowhere you won't get directed to the nearest in-network facility. Even if you're in-network copays, exclusions, and other scams can turn a medical emergency into a financial catastrophe. It's a completely outrageous, exploitative, inhumane system.
- astrange 4y ago
  https://data.oecd.org/healthres/health-spending.htm https://data.oecd.org/healthres/health-spending.htm I imagine it covers dentists, specialists, traveling out of country or private coverage because it's faster. I know for a fact my healthcare spending would be higher in Australia than it is in the US despite it having free healthcare. (As in, I’ve paid it.)
- 0xBDB 4y ago
  "Out of pocket" means what you pay versus what your insurance company pays. By law, the most that can be per year is $18,200 per family in 2023 [1], though it is much lower for almost any employer health plan. My family is very healthy and so I get the crappiest coverage my employer offers for nearly free for my family (because the employer gets a tax break) and mine is $10,000. The limit resets on January 1 and insurance companies can try to weasel on what's covered, though they rarely win those appeals, but on the flip side, most medical expenses are negotiable in that kind of case. The bottom line is that our healthcare system serves several percent of the population (but not the very bottom tier, who have medicaid and public hospitals) incredibly badly and for everyone else is normally just annoying. It's possible for an American software developer with reasonable spending habits to have a medical emergency turn into a financial catastrophe, but it would be really hard. A lot of Europeans seem to believe that their healthcare costs make up for the salary differential. This is not a reasonable belief even before factoring in taxes and cost of living in most cities. [1] https://www.healthcare.gov/glossary/out-of-pocket-maximum-limit/ https://www.healthcare.gov/glossary/out-of-pocket-maximum-li...

jandrewrogers 4y ago

Doctors in the US make FAANG engineer money.