5 ms·

Why is it that some people react so strongly to the concept of therapy? Must be in need of therapy

by imdsm 4y ago

comfypotato 4y ago
Posting because this response chain is at risk of devolving into hostility. Take a deep breath both of you and move on. (Please be sensitive with responses. It would be a shame if HN’s automated NLP moved this cute app off the front page because the comments became inflammatory.)
lynx23 4y ago
Ignoring your personal attack, I think there is a difference in how people see therapy based on where they are from. The US seems to do a lot of therapy-is-good propaganda in the last 20 years. In Europe, this propaganda hasn't arrived fully yet, although we feel it already.
- comfypotato 4y ago
  @imdsm, please read my other comment on your parent before responding to this. I personally had a nice morning because of this pleasant app. I wish for others to have a similarly nice day, and an antagonistic response from you would risk HN's NLP automatically removing it from the front page.
  - ad404b8a372f2b9 4y ago
    I don't think it's within the spirit of HN to repeatedly tell people to censor themselves to appease some ranking algorithm. What's the source on that NLP stuff on HN, never heard of it, I'm curious to read more.
    - comfypotato 4y ago
      The spirit of kindness is in the guidelines: "Be kind. Don't be snarky. Have curious conversation; don't cross-examine. Please don't fulminate. Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community." [1] I didn't ask people to censor themselves, just to be nice. I've also acknowledged that I'm no mediator, moderator, or arbiter. I just had a great time with the app and feel compelled to help others like me get access to it. Am I doing something that is prohibited in the guidelines? "Flame-War Detector" discusses the NLP a bit. [2] Also, it's implied by the second answer in the FAQ. [3] [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html [2] https://github.com/minimaxir/hacker-news-undocumented#flame-war-detector https://github.com/minimaxir/hacker-news-undocumented#flame-... [3] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html
      - ad404b8a372f2b9 4y ago
        I'm not speaking of the guidelines, I'm speaking of the quality of the discussion. It reads like spam, in my opinion, to post the same off-topic response to every mildly argumentative comment on this post in order to preserve the post's ranking, especially since some of those responses come across as passive aggressive. And it is somewhat paradoxical to enforce toxic, seemingly insincere positivity in a post about mental health. Thank you for the Github links, that's an interesting ranking mechanism.
        comfypotato 4y ago
        Definitely not insincere (I have no basis on which to judge toxicity). As a result of your communication, I've stopped spamming said comments. It's just a well-done and very helpful app. It's current position at the top of the front page shows that I'm not alone in this sentiment. Again, I only wanted for others in need of the boost to their day to get access to the link. As I mentioned (in another comment where someone else agrees with you that my positivity is unhelpful), the app isn't needed by everyone. It's not rocket science to understand that a recent/timestamp-young post on the front page is more sensitive to algorithmic downranking. I just did what I could to defend a positive sentiment in the comment section for long enough that the link could establish itself. It's all in the spirit of promoting well-being among the users of HN. I appreciate your feedback (though I'm a little bit confused as to why you view my actions in a negative light). Does the success of my endeavor to establish the post on the front page of HN not show that my motivation aligns with the attitude around here? (Perhaps it has nothing to do with me, I acknowledge that (but doubt it.)) Your welcome for the GitHub links. That whole repo fascinates me.
        rep_lodsb 4y ago
        >It's just a well-done and very helpful app. In your opinion. >It's current position at the top of the front page shows that I'm not alone in this sentiment. To a more cynical person it also suggests that one group of posters is very highly motivated to push this topic. And may even be doing so in an organized effort, rather than as individuals posting their genuine opinions. >It's all in the spirit of promoting well-being among the users of HN. "Have you heard the good news of our Lord and Saviour?"
- theCrowing 4y ago
  Propaganda? You believe that mental health care is politically driven?
  - lynx23 4y ago
    No. I believe every profession needs to do some PR for their services such that everyone wanting to work in that profession actually gets to find a job. So the more therapists there are, the more "propaganda" you need such that they actually can find customers. And listening to casual conversations in US soaps, it is rather obvious from a bystander perspective that therapy-is-something-you-want is an agenda that is being pushed since at least 20 years.
    - theCrowing 4y ago
      Why use the word propaganda? Makes your comment really stand out as flame bait.
      - comfypotato 4y ago
        Ay! @lynx23 at risk of annoying you with another request to keep with the positive tone of the post... Please entertain this honest question with a reasonable response. I'm no mediator, arbiter, or moderator. I'm just enjoying this app a lot and don't want other folks to reduce themselves to negativity. Sorry for sticking my nose in your business.
        lynx23 4y ago
        OK dang, I will do my best to only spread joy-joy feelings!
        deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
      - lynx23 4y ago
        I personally dont make much of a destinction between PR, Ads and Propaganda. Especially since 2020. I am sorry if I triggered you. Did not mean to.
narrator 4y ago
Most therapy is CBT based, which you can figure out how to do in an afternoon. After that, therapy is basically just expensive rent-a-friend. Internal Family Systems is a better therapy technique, IMHO, however it requires a therapist with special training and takes more time for a patient to figure out.
- circlefavshape 4y ago
  Rent-a-friend, but where the friend won't spare your feelings or flatter you or tell you white lies to make you feel better. Or get sick of listening to you whine It really helped me deal with a difficult time in my life. YMMV I guess
subjectsigma 4y ago
Why are people so fucking excited about therapy? I was recently at a party where someone announced to the whole group they were depressed and had just started therapy. Everyone was clapping like they won the lottery. Utterly bizarre and upsetting. "Hey everyone, you all thought I was fine but I've actually been deeply unhappy and struggling! I'm now going to pay a stranger with a dubious educational background $300/hr as part of a long and arduous process that sometimes takes years and has mixed results. Isn't that great?" If she had announced she was starting chemo people would be weeping. Instead she announced she has another chronic, difficult, expensive, and occasionally fatal health issue and everyone is super jazzed about it??? I'm amazed more people don't have strong negative reactions to therapy
- lynx23 4y ago
  That pretty much sums up my point. Thanks for writing this, and sorry for the downvotes. That is HN. Just accept it, and create a new throwaway...
- comfypotato 4y ago
  In the US at least, there are typically routes to affordable therapy. Sliding scales, university-sponsorship, employer-sponsorship, and government-sponsorship for severe mental illness. Using myself as an (admittedly very specific, not universal) example: my employer is paying my tuition, and the university has a free program. Most therapists in the 200,000-person city in which I grew up have a sliding scale that goes down to $60.00 per hour, and that's only if you're paying entirely out of pocket.
  - circlefavshape 4y ago
    Another data point - therapy costs EUR60 per hour in the village (in Ireland) where I live
  - subjectsigma 4y ago
    > I'm sorry that you've found yourself with such an unrealistic idea of therapy. I love coming back to this site. It's absolutely incredible how many different ways people can find to say "Fuck you!" The Internet is endlessly creative. Edit: it's not so bad after all
rep_lodsb 4y ago
Because most people posting positively about it sound like they are in a cult, very emotional language, insistent use of certain terminology, etc. It also seems to be clustered together with other currently "fashionable" opinions, and if you speak out against them you are mass-downvoted within seconds of posting your comment. comfypotato's comments in particular read like something out of Demolition Man. Be well citizen, and have joy-joy feelings!
- comfypotato 4y ago
  The offensively-joyful tone is probably a result of my medication. (Sorry, not sorry.)
  - rep_lodsb 4y ago
    You really come across as brainwashed to me. If this is what therapy and medication does to one's mind, I don't want any of it. (Sorry, not sorry.) To be less personal about it, it's also a general pattern I have noticed, not just with your posts.
    - comfypotato 4y ago
      You're not wrong. It's a cost-benefits analysis conclusion for me. For example: taking my own life was in the cards before medication and therapy. The current status quo is much better; not just for the reason in the previous sentence. I now work through the problems in my life in the order in which they cause more problems, and it benefits me in lots of little ways. It's relevant to the discussion that I think the notion that everyone needs therapy and medication is absurd. I continue to see a therapist as a barrier put into place to make sure I don't move in a negative direction regarding the more serious personal issues (and take appropriate/healthy actions when a significant problem arises).

Why is it that some people react so strongly to the concept of therapy? Must be in need of therapy

by imdsm 4y ago

Why is it that some people react so strongly to the concept of therapy? Must be in need of therapy

Posting because this response chain is at risk of devolving into hostility. Take a deep breath both of you and move on. (Please be sensitive with responses. It would be a shame if HN’s automated NLP moved this cute app off the front page because the comments became inflammatory.)

lynx23 4y ago

Ignoring your personal attack, I think there is a difference in how people see therapy based on where they are from. The US seems to do a lot of therapy-is-good propaganda in the last 20 years. In Europe, this propaganda hasn't arrived fully yet, although we feel it already.

comfypotato 4y ago
@imdsm, please read my other comment on your parent before responding to this. I personally had a nice morning because of this pleasant app. I wish for others to have a similarly nice day, and an antagonistic response from you would risk HN's NLP automatically removing it from the front page.
- ad404b8a372f2b9 4y ago
  I don't think it's within the spirit of HN to repeatedly tell people to censor themselves to appease some ranking algorithm. What's the source on that NLP stuff on HN, never heard of it, I'm curious to read more.
  - comfypotato 4y ago
    The spirit of kindness is in the guidelines: "Be kind. Don't be snarky. Have curious conversation; don't cross-examine. Please don't fulminate. Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community." [1] I didn't ask people to censor themselves, just to be nice. I've also acknowledged that I'm no mediator, moderator, or arbiter. I just had a great time with the app and feel compelled to help others like me get access to it. Am I doing something that is prohibited in the guidelines? "Flame-War Detector" discusses the NLP a bit. [2] Also, it's implied by the second answer in the FAQ. [3] [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html [2] https://github.com/minimaxir/hacker-news-undocumented#flame-war-detector https://github.com/minimaxir/hacker-news-undocumented#flame-... [3] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html
    - ad404b8a372f2b9 4y ago
      I'm not speaking of the guidelines, I'm speaking of the quality of the discussion. It reads like spam, in my opinion, to post the same off-topic response to every mildly argumentative comment on this post in order to preserve the post's ranking, especially since some of those responses come across as passive aggressive. And it is somewhat paradoxical to enforce toxic, seemingly insincere positivity in a post about mental health. Thank you for the Github links, that's an interesting ranking mechanism.
      - comfypotato 4y ago
        Definitely not insincere (I have no basis on which to judge toxicity). As a result of your communication, I've stopped spamming said comments. It's just a well-done and very helpful app. It's current position at the top of the front page shows that I'm not alone in this sentiment. Again, I only wanted for others in need of the boost to their day to get access to the link. As I mentioned (in another comment where someone else agrees with you that my positivity is unhelpful), the app isn't needed by everyone. It's not rocket science to understand that a recent/timestamp-young post on the front page is more sensitive to algorithmic downranking. I just did what I could to defend a positive sentiment in the comment section for long enough that the link could establish itself. It's all in the spirit of promoting well-being among the users of HN. I appreciate your feedback (though I'm a little bit confused as to why you view my actions in a negative light). Does the success of my endeavor to establish the post on the front page of HN not show that my motivation aligns with the attitude around here? (Perhaps it has nothing to do with me, I acknowledge that (but doubt it.)) Your welcome for the GitHub links. That whole repo fascinates me.
        rep_lodsb 4y ago
        >It's just a well-done and very helpful app. In your opinion. >It's current position at the top of the front page shows that I'm not alone in this sentiment. To a more cynical person it also suggests that one group of posters is very highly motivated to push this topic. And may even be doing so in an organized effort, rather than as individuals posting their genuine opinions. >It's all in the spirit of promoting well-being among the users of HN. "Have you heard the good news of our Lord and Saviour?"
theCrowing 4y ago
Propaganda? You believe that mental health care is politically driven?
- lynx23 4y ago
  No. I believe every profession needs to do some PR for their services such that everyone wanting to work in that profession actually gets to find a job. So the more therapists there are, the more "propaganda" you need such that they actually can find customers. And listening to casual conversations in US soaps, it is rather obvious from a bystander perspective that therapy-is-something-you-want is an agenda that is being pushed since at least 20 years.
  - theCrowing 4y ago
    Why use the word propaganda? Makes your comment really stand out as flame bait.
    - comfypotato 4y ago
      Ay! @lynx23 at risk of annoying you with another request to keep with the positive tone of the post... Please entertain this honest question with a reasonable response. I'm no mediator, arbiter, or moderator. I'm just enjoying this app a lot and don't want other folks to reduce themselves to negativity. Sorry for sticking my nose in your business.
      - lynx23 4y ago
        OK dang, I will do my best to only spread joy-joy feelings!
        deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
    - lynx23 4y ago
      I personally dont make much of a destinction between PR, Ads and Propaganda. Especially since 2020. I am sorry if I triggered you. Did not mean to.

narrator 4y ago

Most therapy is CBT based, which you can figure out how to do in an afternoon. After that, therapy is basically just expensive rent-a-friend. Internal Family Systems is a better therapy technique, IMHO, however it requires a therapist with special training and takes more time for a patient to figure out.

circlefavshape 4y ago
Rent-a-friend, but where the friend won't spare your feelings or flatter you or tell you white lies to make you feel better. Or get sick of listening to you whine It really helped me deal with a difficult time in my life. YMMV I guess

subjectsigma 4y ago

Why are people so fucking excited about therapy? I was recently at a party where someone announced to the whole group they were depressed and had just started therapy. Everyone was clapping like they won the lottery. Utterly bizarre and upsetting. "Hey everyone, you all thought I was fine but I've actually been deeply unhappy and struggling! I'm now going to pay a stranger with a dubious educational background $300/hr as part of a long and arduous process that sometimes takes years and has mixed results. Isn't that great?" If she had announced she was starting chemo people would be weeping. Instead she announced she has another chronic, difficult, expensive, and occasionally fatal health issue and everyone is super jazzed about it??? I'm amazed more people don't have strong negative reactions to therapy

lynx23 4y ago
That pretty much sums up my point. Thanks for writing this, and sorry for the downvotes. That is HN. Just accept it, and create a new throwaway...
comfypotato 4y ago
In the US at least, there are typically routes to affordable therapy. Sliding scales, university-sponsorship, employer-sponsorship, and government-sponsorship for severe mental illness. Using myself as an (admittedly very specific, not universal) example: my employer is paying my tuition, and the university has a free program. Most therapists in the 200,000-person city in which I grew up have a sliding scale that goes down to $60.00 per hour, and that's only if you're paying entirely out of pocket.
- circlefavshape 4y ago
  Another data point - therapy costs EUR60 per hour in the village (in Ireland) where I live
- subjectsigma 4y ago
  > I'm sorry that you've found yourself with such an unrealistic idea of therapy. I love coming back to this site. It's absolutely incredible how many different ways people can find to say "Fuck you!" The Internet is endlessly creative. Edit: it's not so bad after all

rep_lodsb 4y ago

Because most people posting positively about it sound like they are in a cult, very emotional language, insistent use of certain terminology, etc. It also seems to be clustered together with other currently "fashionable" opinions, and if you speak out against them you are mass-downvoted within seconds of posting your comment. comfypotato's comments in particular read like something out of Demolition Man. Be well citizen, and have joy-joy feelings!

comfypotato 4y ago
The offensively-joyful tone is probably a result of my medication. (Sorry, not sorry.)
- rep_lodsb 4y ago
  You really come across as brainwashed to me. If this is what therapy and medication does to one's mind, I don't want any of it. (Sorry, not sorry.) To be less personal about it, it's also a general pattern I have noticed, not just with your posts.
  - comfypotato 4y ago
    You're not wrong. It's a cost-benefits analysis conclusion for me. For example: taking my own life was in the cards before medication and therapy. The current status quo is much better; not just for the reason in the previous sentence. I now work through the problems in my life in the order in which they cause more problems, and it benefits me in lots of little ways. It's relevant to the discussion that I think the notion that everyone needs therapy and medication is absurd. I continue to see a therapist as a barrier put into place to make sure I don't move in a negative direction regarding the more serious personal issues (and take appropriate/healthy actions when a significant problem arises).