6 ms·

The term normally used is 'manhwa'. Webtoons can be from any place (and there are many Chinese ones too), manhwa is the Korean word for comics (so it can be ph

The term normally used is 'manhwa'. Webtoons can be from any place (and there are many Chinese ones too), manhwa is the Korean word for comics (so it can be physical or digital). Though slightly different, the words do get used interchangeably. Manhwa are very mobile friendly, the language is simple, and most notably they are colorful, which attracts audiences and makes it quite accessible. Compare it to some of the more dense manga you might read where sometimes a panel requires a lot of pinching and zooming. For sure though, as the article points out, there are a lot of amazing and intriguing stories in manga, which have better story density compared to the thinner, spread out stories in manhwa which are catering to an audience that just wants to keep scrolling. The artstyle too, I don't think we're going to see anything close to Junji Ito or Berserk style work in webtoon format anytime soon. But anyway this trend of manhwa's popularity has been noticeable for several years now. The top entries on manga 'aggregator' sites have been manhwa as well.

poglet 4y ago
> sometimes a panel requires a lot of pinching and zooming. The iPad (12.9") is what got me into comics and manga, the screen size is almost perfect so it's a very pleasant experience.
- terrorOf 4y ago
  It is not a form factor everyone takes everywhere. Webtoon can be read comfortably anywhere anytime with mobile phone pretty much everyone has in the hand or in the pocket. That is huger difference.
  - bowsamic 4y ago
    I think in Japan most manga is still read on paper
- Tijdreiziger 4y ago
  Do you read 2 pages at a time in landscape mode? I like reading manga on my 11” iPad (in portrait mode), but IIUC this is actually significantly larger than print manga.
  - kitsunesoba 4y ago
    On my 12.9" I read one page at a time in portrait. The size is nice since it lets me see the details and small text well without holding the tablet close to my face or zooming. The 11" model is a very good size for manga reading and allows for this too, though. 11" is my preferred size actually, but I went for the 12.9" instead to be able to better test apps on that model — an app designed for 11" only will have a lot of wasted space running on a 12.9". The miniLED backlighting is nice too, wish that 11" had that.
falcolas 4y ago
Well said, and I agree with every point. I love Solo Leveling, and it’s very much action based like Berserk, but it will never reach the same depths of emotion Berserk can elicit. Caveat emptor: I’ve worked on both manhwa and manga as a scanlation (unofficial translations) proofreader.
- worthless-trash 4y ago
  Thank you for your work.
  - falcolas 4y ago
    It's fun (well, when you're working on one you enjoy), and there's plenty of need. If you're on Mangadex, just look for the requests teams are making as part of their headers or footers in scanlated chapters. It's how I found my way in. Proofreaders in scanlation are basically touching up the translations to make them read well in English (tenses and idioms that don't always translate well), as well as checking for consistency between chapters in tone and spelling.
- franciscop 4y ago
  True, but one of the things I loved of Solo Leveling (it's finished, right?) is that some times the colors are AMAZING, like there were some panels where I would just stop and get lost in the art for a bit, while that rarely happened to me with black and white manga. Even when it DID happen with manga, it's literally missing an order of magnitude, so IMHO peak manga B&W can barely compare with peak full-color art (and I'm not even saying Solo Leveling is top-level color art, what I'm saying is that it's "very good" and with that it beats "top level" B&W any day IMHO).
  - falcolas 4y ago
    I cant disagree that color art has dimensions to it that black and white (and halftones) can’t quite reach. But to say that color alone makes it better than greyscale… No, I can not agree with that. A matter of taste? Perhaps. But there is some absurdly beautiful art in Manga too. Starkness, working within constraints, has its own beauty. And, as an aside, full color manga is becoming a thing too. More and more full color webtoon style comics are coming from Japan; from mangaka.
et-al 4y ago
Manhwa, mànhuà, manga... 漫画. Ultimately, it's all in line with the rise of South Korea. 1980s : Japan :: 2010s : S. Korea
userbinator 4y ago
It's worth noting that manga, manwha, manhua, are slightly different ways to pronounce what are essentially the same characters which mean "comics" across those respective languages: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E6%BC%AB%E7%95%AB https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E6%BC%AB%E7%95%AB
- numpad0 4y ago
  I think that's because Korean and Chinese usages are loanword from Japanese manga. Japanese version of Wikipedia traces etymology back to 17th-18th century pseudo-Chinese word, later extended to include Western comics which became the roots of modern day manga.
syntheweave 4y ago
Manhwa have definitely had more of a strict formula to them than most other contemporary comics, at least the ones I've viewed. Most of the stories seem to be copy-pastes of a "weak guy becomes tough guy" power fantasy, with characterizations falling along class and gender stereotypes. Illustrations are likewise industrial in nature, using the same posable doll figures to churn out basic talking head + fighting panels. I can't recall one that did good establishing shots or worked the vertical layout for interesting composition. That said, I still read the stuff on occasion. It's still comics, and not far in the adherence to formula.
- GuB-42 4y ago
  Isn't the "weak guy becomes tough guy" power fantasy make the majority of the manga market, at least in the west? Manga and anime is very diverse, and yet, only the "shounen" style seems to represented, and that's not even the full spectrum of what shounen has to offer. I don't know much about manhwa, maybe there is more depth to what we are served, or maybe it is just that they just focused on what is commercially successful.
  - SllX 4y ago
    > Isn't the "weak guy becomes tough guy" power fantasy make the majority of the manga market, at least in the west? Shōnen is probably the bigger market, but it’s worth noting that the key to the “style” is that it’s the term for the target market: young boys. There is usually a power accumulation fantasy, but more accurately these are typically coming-of-age stories. So: Shōnen: Young Boys Shōjo: Young Girls Seinen: Young Men Josei: Ladies (there is also a separate category for “Young Ladies”) As you can see, these are less genre terms and more demographic terms.
  - gotbeans 4y ago
    Additionally in manhuas, some non so usual topice are overreepresented, like a _lot_ of shonnen manhuas about business character success/CEO kind of stuff.
    - astrange 4y ago
MichaelZuo 4y ago
The medium is the message.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
kixiQu 4y ago
I must disagree. It's accurate that the word "webtoon" can refer to Chinese webtoons as well – but "webtoon" is what is used to refer to digital publication + the style of panel layout designed to be swiped vertically on a screen. "Manhwa" predate and extend beyond this (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goong_(manhwa) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goong_(manhwa) and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full_House_(manhwa) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full_House_(manhwa) are two that got big and were adapted to hell and back) being the general term for Korean comics – which, in the print era, had the typical print layout. I think it's worthwhile to be precise in these conversations because there are Japanese webtoons as well these days, which would properly constitute "manga" as well, and if we're mixing up all the "comics" words from different languages with the trends in their formats, it's going to be a pain to discuss.
- t3rra 4y ago
  True. In Korea, we never say Japanese comics, manga, but just say Japanese manhwa. It is only a generic term for comics/cartoons.
- politelemon 4y ago
  Yes as I've said they are different, but get used interchangeably. You can try your best to be precise in the conversations but there is too much incorrect momentum behind the wrong words sadly! It's like calling things fonts when you actually mean typeface. Or GPS when you actually mean GNSS.
  - kixiQu 4y ago
    I mean, one thing said was "Manhwa are very mobile friendly, the language is simple, and most notably they are colorful" which is true of "webtoons", not of "manhwa". I don't agree that there's too much incorrect momentum behind the words; what I see in fan/piracy circles tends to be pretty clear about it.
ravel-bar-foo 4y ago
> The term normally used is 'manhwa'. I don't know about English usage, but in Korean these are different concepts. "Manhwa" (만화, maan-hwaa) means "comics", usually in print. The Korean word for an online comic is "webtoon" (웹툰, ooeb-toon). This is the usage, for example, on Naver: NAVER 웹툰 is the title of https://comic.naver.com https://comic.naver.com. Of course the webtoons borrow a lot from manhwa style, but one buys/rents manhwa at a store and reads webtoons on the subway. So they are different concepts and "webtoon" is the proper Korean term for this phenomenon.
- t3rra 4y ago
  Still people can say "reading manhwa" when they read webtoon. Webtoon is still manhwa. I also say I read 만화 to my friend who read on Naver and Daum, who also often say 만화
- ahmadmijot 4y ago
  For (at least within scanlation scene) english usage: Manga is comic originated from Japan Manhwa is comic originated from Korea Manhua is comic originated from China
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - Ruthalas 4y ago
    This is also what I have seen in other online communities that aggregate such works.
  - orthoxerox 4y ago
    "Tank is an armored vehicle originated in the UK, char d'assaut is an armored vehicle originated in France, Panzer is an armored vehicle originated in Germany." It's fine to call them all "tanks" and it's fine to call all East Asian comics "comics" or even "manga".
    - anotherman554 4y ago
astonex 4y ago
In Korea, Manhwa tends to refer to printed comics like Manga, whilst Webtoon refers to online digital comics.
- t3rra 4y ago
  Still in Korea, people often say "read manhwa" on (webtoon platform). Webtoon is just a digital version of manhwa but not separate thing.
CiceroCiceronis 4y ago
I was talking to a friend the other day about how it feels like manhua/longstrip webtoon comics has yet to experience its creative peak. Looking back at the history of manga, it is possible to see how new innovations have played with and manipulated standard ideas of paneling and framing to produce fascinating and artistic work. A seemingly constrained format (small-size black-and-white comic book) becomes a canvas for extraordinary creative expression. Longstrip comics are not worse than manga, of course, but it feels like creators have yet to explore the edges of the format. What can a longstrip do that a traditional book can’t? How can the limitations of the format be turned into strengths? I wonder if this will come to pass, and how long it will take.
- bnjms 4y ago
  Have you seen this story (must be non-mobile)? http://comic.naver.com/webtoon/detail.nhn?titleId=350217&no=31 http://comic.naver.com/webtoon/detail.nhn?titleId=350217&no=... If you’re mobile the scrolling breaks. Otherwise it’s an interesting example of the medium.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
sudomatic 4y ago
Oh, I see. I didn't realize that the term "manhwa" was specifically used for Korean comics. I always just thought it was a general term for any type of webcomic. It's interesting to hear about the differences between manga and manhwa. It sounds like manhwa are more accessible and mobile-friendly, but that manga has a higher story density and more complex art styles. I suppose it's all a matter of personal preference.
lvl102 4y ago
You don’t have to comment if you don’t actually know. What you just said is quite wrong.

poglet 4y ago

> sometimes a panel requires a lot of pinching and zooming. The iPad (12.9") is what got me into comics and manga, the screen size is almost perfect so it's a very pleasant experience.

terrorOf 4y ago
It is not a form factor everyone takes everywhere. Webtoon can be read comfortably anywhere anytime with mobile phone pretty much everyone has in the hand or in the pocket. That is huger difference.
- bowsamic 4y ago
  I think in Japan most manga is still read on paper
Tijdreiziger 4y ago
Do you read 2 pages at a time in landscape mode? I like reading manga on my 11” iPad (in portrait mode), but IIUC this is actually significantly larger than print manga.
- kitsunesoba 4y ago
  On my 12.9" I read one page at a time in portrait. The size is nice since it lets me see the details and small text well without holding the tablet close to my face or zooming. The 11" model is a very good size for manga reading and allows for this too, though. 11" is my preferred size actually, but I went for the 12.9" instead to be able to better test apps on that model — an app designed for 11" only will have a lot of wasted space running on a 12.9". The miniLED backlighting is nice too, wish that 11" had that.

falcolas 4y ago

Well said, and I agree with every point. I love Solo Leveling, and it’s very much action based like Berserk, but it will never reach the same depths of emotion Berserk can elicit. Caveat emptor: I’ve worked on both manhwa and manga as a scanlation (unofficial translations) proofreader.

worthless-trash 4y ago
Thank you for your work.
- falcolas 4y ago
  It's fun (well, when you're working on one you enjoy), and there's plenty of need. If you're on Mangadex, just look for the requests teams are making as part of their headers or footers in scanlated chapters. It's how I found my way in. Proofreaders in scanlation are basically touching up the translations to make them read well in English (tenses and idioms that don't always translate well), as well as checking for consistency between chapters in tone and spelling.
franciscop 4y ago
True, but one of the things I loved of Solo Leveling (it's finished, right?) is that some times the colors are AMAZING, like there were some panels where I would just stop and get lost in the art for a bit, while that rarely happened to me with black and white manga. Even when it DID happen with manga, it's literally missing an order of magnitude, so IMHO peak manga B&W can barely compare with peak full-color art (and I'm not even saying Solo Leveling is top-level color art, what I'm saying is that it's "very good" and with that it beats "top level" B&W any day IMHO).
- falcolas 4y ago
  I cant disagree that color art has dimensions to it that black and white (and halftones) can’t quite reach. But to say that color alone makes it better than greyscale… No, I can not agree with that. A matter of taste? Perhaps. But there is some absurdly beautiful art in Manga too. Starkness, working within constraints, has its own beauty. And, as an aside, full color manga is becoming a thing too. More and more full color webtoon style comics are coming from Japan; from mangaka.

et-al 4y ago

Manhwa, mànhuà, manga... 漫画. Ultimately, it's all in line with the rise of South Korea. 1980s : Japan :: 2010s : S. Korea

userbinator 4y ago

It's worth noting that manga, manwha, manhua, are slightly different ways to pronounce what are essentially the same characters which mean "comics" across those respective languages: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E6%BC%AB%E7%95%AB https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E6%BC%AB%E7%95%AB

numpad0 4y ago
I think that's because Korean and Chinese usages are loanword from Japanese manga. Japanese version of Wikipedia traces etymology back to 17th-18th century pseudo-Chinese word, later extended to include Western comics which became the roots of modern day manga.

syntheweave 4y ago

Manhwa have definitely had more of a strict formula to them than most other contemporary comics, at least the ones I've viewed. Most of the stories seem to be copy-pastes of a "weak guy becomes tough guy" power fantasy, with characterizations falling along class and gender stereotypes. Illustrations are likewise industrial in nature, using the same posable doll figures to churn out basic talking head + fighting panels. I can't recall one that did good establishing shots or worked the vertical layout for interesting composition. That said, I still read the stuff on occasion. It's still comics, and not far in the adherence to formula.

GuB-42 4y ago
Isn't the "weak guy becomes tough guy" power fantasy make the majority of the manga market, at least in the west? Manga and anime is very diverse, and yet, only the "shounen" style seems to represented, and that's not even the full spectrum of what shounen has to offer. I don't know much about manhwa, maybe there is more depth to what we are served, or maybe it is just that they just focused on what is commercially successful.
- SllX 4y ago
  > Isn't the "weak guy becomes tough guy" power fantasy make the majority of the manga market, at least in the west? Shōnen is probably the bigger market, but it’s worth noting that the key to the “style” is that it’s the term for the target market: young boys. There is usually a power accumulation fantasy, but more accurately these are typically coming-of-age stories. So: Shōnen: Young Boys Shōjo: Young Girls Seinen: Young Men Josei: Ladies (there is also a separate category for “Young Ladies”) As you can see, these are less genre terms and more demographic terms.
- gotbeans 4y ago
  Additionally in manhuas, some non so usual topice are overreepresented, like a _lot_ of shonnen manhuas about business character success/CEO kind of stuff.
  - astrange 4y ago

MichaelZuo 4y ago

The medium is the message.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

kixiQu 4y ago

I must disagree. It's accurate that the word "webtoon" can refer to Chinese webtoons as well – but "webtoon" is what is used to refer to digital publication + the style of panel layout designed to be swiped vertically on a screen. "Manhwa" predate and extend beyond this (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goong_(manhwa) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goong_(manhwa) and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full_House_(manhwa) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full_House_(manhwa) are two that got big and were adapted to hell and back) being the general term for Korean comics – which, in the print era, had the typical print layout. I think it's worthwhile to be precise in these conversations because there are Japanese webtoons as well these days, which would properly constitute "manga" as well, and if we're mixing up all the "comics" words from different languages with the trends in their formats, it's going to be a pain to discuss.

t3rra 4y ago
True. In Korea, we never say Japanese comics, manga, but just say Japanese manhwa. It is only a generic term for comics/cartoons.
politelemon 4y ago
Yes as I've said they are different, but get used interchangeably. You can try your best to be precise in the conversations but there is too much incorrect momentum behind the wrong words sadly! It's like calling things fonts when you actually mean typeface. Or GPS when you actually mean GNSS.
- kixiQu 4y ago
  I mean, one thing said was "Manhwa are very mobile friendly, the language is simple, and most notably they are colorful" which is true of "webtoons", not of "manhwa". I don't agree that there's too much incorrect momentum behind the words; what I see in fan/piracy circles tends to be pretty clear about it.

ravel-bar-foo 4y ago

> The term normally used is 'manhwa'. I don't know about English usage, but in Korean these are different concepts. "Manhwa" (만화, maan-hwaa) means "comics", usually in print. The Korean word for an online comic is "webtoon" (웹툰, ooeb-toon). This is the usage, for example, on Naver: NAVER 웹툰 is the title of https://comic.naver.com https://comic.naver.com. Of course the webtoons borrow a lot from manhwa style, but one buys/rents manhwa at a store and reads webtoons on the subway. So they are different concepts and "webtoon" is the proper Korean term for this phenomenon.

t3rra 4y ago
Still people can say "reading manhwa" when they read webtoon. Webtoon is still manhwa. I also say I read 만화 to my friend who read on Naver and Daum, who also often say 만화
ahmadmijot 4y ago
For (at least within scanlation scene) english usage: Manga is comic originated from Japan Manhwa is comic originated from Korea Manhua is comic originated from China
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- Ruthalas 4y ago
  This is also what I have seen in other online communities that aggregate such works.
- orthoxerox 4y ago
  "Tank is an armored vehicle originated in the UK, char d'assaut is an armored vehicle originated in France, Panzer is an armored vehicle originated in Germany." It's fine to call them all "tanks" and it's fine to call all East Asian comics "comics" or even "manga".
  - anotherman554 4y ago

astonex 4y ago

In Korea, Manhwa tends to refer to printed comics like Manga, whilst Webtoon refers to online digital comics.

t3rra 4y ago
Still in Korea, people often say "read manhwa" on (webtoon platform). Webtoon is just a digital version of manhwa but not separate thing.

CiceroCiceronis 4y ago

I was talking to a friend the other day about how it feels like manhua/longstrip webtoon comics has yet to experience its creative peak. Looking back at the history of manga, it is possible to see how new innovations have played with and manipulated standard ideas of paneling and framing to produce fascinating and artistic work. A seemingly constrained format (small-size black-and-white comic book) becomes a canvas for extraordinary creative expression. Longstrip comics are not worse than manga, of course, but it feels like creators have yet to explore the edges of the format. What can a longstrip do that a traditional book can’t? How can the limitations of the format be turned into strengths? I wonder if this will come to pass, and how long it will take.

bnjms 4y ago
Have you seen this story (must be non-mobile)? http://comic.naver.com/webtoon/detail.nhn?titleId=350217&no=31 http://comic.naver.com/webtoon/detail.nhn?titleId=350217&no=... If you’re mobile the scrolling breaks. Otherwise it’s an interesting example of the medium.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

sudomatic 4y ago

Oh, I see. I didn't realize that the term "manhwa" was specifically used for Korean comics. I always just thought it was a general term for any type of webcomic. It's interesting to hear about the differences between manga and manhwa. It sounds like manhwa are more accessible and mobile-friendly, but that manga has a higher story density and more complex art styles. I suppose it's all a matter of personal preference.

lvl102 4y ago

You don’t have to comment if you don’t actually know. What you just said is quite wrong.