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Super cool and fascinating. I don’t know why, but I don’t like that the headline frames it as a “privacy risk”. Are we really concerned about privacy when play

Super cool and fascinating. I don’t know why, but I don’t like that the headline frames it as a “privacy risk”. Are we really concerned about privacy when playing chess? I think the world probably needs to accept there’s no such thing as “anonymous behavior”. Behavior itself is individualized. Therefore if behavior can be observed the probability that it is anonymous rapidly approaches zero with time and observations. The only way to be verifiably anonymous is to not be observed. This means if you are a person at risk of harm if your identity is unmasked that you can’t rely on supposedly anonymous behavior. Bummer.

JadeNB 4y ago
> I don’t know why, but I don’t like that the headline frames it as a “privacy risk”. Are we really concerned about privacy when playing chess? To the extent that headlines matter, I'd way rather that people worry about the privacy risks of de-anonymizing technology long before it's at the point where it's a practical issue. If we only worry about it when it becomes an actual issue already being, or about to be, applied to unambiguously privacy-invading matters, then, well, that's the way we've already done it and it's too late now—why didn't you bring it up earlier? I'd also prefer to avoid the "what do you have to hide?" issue. Maybe someone, for whatever reason, does have something to hide; if they intentionally play chess anonymously, presumably they intend to do so. It shouldn't be up to me to decide whether or not their need, or even just desire, for privacy is legitimate. (Of course, it's already too late—and has been since, at the very latest, the AOL incident—to worry about the onset of such de-anonymization, but it's always (or only almost always?) better to face inevitable future problems now, rather than waiting for that future.)
wolverine876 4y ago
Why is it important to some people to shout down other people's anonymity and desire for it? What's it to you? It's only hopeless if we give up - do that if you like, but why is it important to you that other people give up?
- rsj_hn 4y ago
  The authoritarian impulse is fundamentally about controlling the behavior of others, whereas the impulse for liberty is to control your own behavior. As we continue to drift towards authoritarianism, there are many people cheering this on, revealing their true affinities. You see this with people exuberant for restrictions of cash transactions, joyous at censorship and control over communications media, exuberance over other types of social policing, etc.
  - wolverine876 4y ago
    Oui! Nobody talks about or applies what used to be fundamental American values: Freedom, all persons are created equal, every person as good as another, anyone can achieve anything. It seems like an obvious opportunity for a politician or even just a commentator, to pick up that baton. It's a well-paved path, everything is already written or you, and people really need some optimism and idealism right now.
- forrestthewoods 4y ago
  > Why is it important to some people to shout down other people's anonymity and desire for it? What's it to you? It's only hopeless if we give up - do that if you like, but why is it important to you that other people give up? Who said anything about desire. I have no desire to unmask people. To me it seems increasingly likely that observability and anonymity are mutually exclusive. I think it is hopeless because there's nothing you can do to stop someone from analyzing observations. We just never realized how much identifying information was contained in seemingly innocuous observations.

JadeNB 4y ago

> I don’t know why, but I don’t like that the headline frames it as a “privacy risk”. Are we really concerned about privacy when playing chess? To the extent that headlines matter, I'd way rather that people worry about the privacy risks of de-anonymizing technology long before it's at the point where it's a practical issue. If we only worry about it when it becomes an actual issue already being, or about to be, applied to unambiguously privacy-invading matters, then, well, that's the way we've already done it and it's too late now—why didn't you bring it up earlier? I'd also prefer to avoid the "what do you have to hide?" issue. Maybe someone, for whatever reason, does have something to hide; if they intentionally play chess anonymously, presumably they intend to do so. It shouldn't be up to me to decide whether or not their need, or even just desire, for privacy is legitimate. (Of course, it's already too late—and has been since, at the very latest, the AOL incident—to worry about the onset of such de-anonymization, but it's always (or only almost always?) better to face inevitable future problems now, rather than waiting for that future.)

wolverine876 4y ago

Why is it important to some people to shout down other people's anonymity and desire for it? What's it to you? It's only hopeless if we give up - do that if you like, but why is it important to you that other people give up?

rsj_hn 4y ago
The authoritarian impulse is fundamentally about controlling the behavior of others, whereas the impulse for liberty is to control your own behavior. As we continue to drift towards authoritarianism, there are many people cheering this on, revealing their true affinities. You see this with people exuberant for restrictions of cash transactions, joyous at censorship and control over communications media, exuberance over other types of social policing, etc.
- wolverine876 4y ago
  Oui! Nobody talks about or applies what used to be fundamental American values: Freedom, all persons are created equal, every person as good as another, anyone can achieve anything. It seems like an obvious opportunity for a politician or even just a commentator, to pick up that baton. It's a well-paved path, everything is already written or you, and people really need some optimism and idealism right now.
forrestthewoods 4y ago
> Why is it important to some people to shout down other people's anonymity and desire for it? What's it to you? It's only hopeless if we give up - do that if you like, but why is it important to you that other people give up? Who said anything about desire. I have no desire to unmask people. To me it seems increasingly likely that observability and anonymity are mutually exclusive. I think it is hopeless because there's nothing you can do to stop someone from analyzing observations. We just never realized how much identifying information was contained in seemingly innocuous observations.