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Unfortunately, Germany's currently problems are self-inflicted and were entirely predictable. They were encouraged to build LNG terminals and reduce their reli

Unfortunately, Germany's currently problems are self-inflicted and were entirely predictable. They were encouraged to build LNG terminals and reduce their reliance on Russian gas back in 2014: Following the 2014 February coup in Ukraine and Crimea's reunification with Russia, the administration of Barack Obama, the 44th President of the United States, called upon the EU member states to cut their reliance on Russian gas, citing "security" reasons. Speaking at the March 2014 EU-US Summit in Brussels, Obama urged the US' European allies to hurry up with the conclusion of the controversial Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership (TTIP), offering US liquefied natural gas (LNG) in exchange. https://sputniknews.com/20180331/obama-trump-lng-europe-china-1063093406.html https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-eu-summit-idUSBREA2P0W220140326

vertis 4y ago
I'm really unclear why you linked such a biased news source. But for clarity: The Revolution of dignity has absolutely no signs of a coup. It resulted in presidential and parlimentary elections. Crimea was illegally annexed by Russia.
- 411111111111111 4y ago
  As a German i agree with your point, but also agree with the point of the grandparent. It was predictable and the people responsible for Germany's heavy reliance on Russian gas unsurprisingly are getting paid through intermediaries by Russia. There have been an abundance of coverage on it, even from state media... but nothing ever changes. Heck, the current head of the government was/is involved in the biggest financially scandal of Germany's history and got away with it by "forgetting" everything.
  - vertis 4y ago
    Yes agreed. Just couldn't go past the source. I'm not German, but have clients in Munich and have been learning German (i.e more than a remote armchair view). Have considered moving to Germany. This last year has disappointed me. I really thought Germany was one of the most rational actors in Europe and globally. Nowhere is perfect, and I don't expect it, but the way Germany has dithered about sending tanks (and other things) just saddens.
- heartbeats 4y ago
  > The Revolution of dignity has absolutely no signs of a coup. It resulted in presidential and parlimentary elections. This is a non-sequitur; the transfer of power was extra-constitutional, so it can't be ruled out by this fact alone. > Crimea was illegally annexed by Russia. This is a circular argument. It was illegal insofar as it violated Ukrainian law, sure, but whether Ukrainian law should apply in Crimea in the first place is literally the whole point of contention!
  - vertis 4y ago
    1. The revolution of diginity was a series of protests. No-one took over the airwaves and killed the existing government. "On 21 February an agreement was signed between Yanukovych and leaders of the parliamentary opposition, witnessed by representatives from European Union and Russia. which promised return to the 2004 constitution, early elections and withdrawal of security forces from the center of the capital."[0]. 2. Crimea was assigned to Ukraine in 1991. It's part of Ukraine's internationally recognised borders. It's illegal according to international law. It was taken by force[1] without the will of the people. Any referendums under occupation are illegal and invalid (also according to international law)[2]. You can't vote with a gun to your head. [0]: https://www.bbc.com/russian/rolling_news/2014/02/140221_rn_yanukovich_preliminary_elections https://www.bbc.com/russian/rolling_news/2014/02/140221_rn_y... [1]: https://time.com/19097/putin-crimea-russia-ukraine-aksyonov/ https://time.com/19097/putin-crimea-russia-ukraine-aksyonov/ [2]:https://www.gov.uk/government/news/the-crimean-referendum https://www.gov.uk/government/news/the-crimean-referendum
    - heartbeats 4y ago
      1. That's not the definition of a coup or a revolution. What happened was an extra-constitutional transition of power, which is a technical term of art, and this is the case regardless of whether its final ends were good or evil. 2. This is a circular argument. It's contrary to domestic law insofar as Crimea is Ukrainian, it's contrary to international law insofar as Crimea is occupied, which it is insofar as the people don't want to be Russian, which they don't insofar as the referendum was illegitimate, which it is insofar as Crimea is Ukrainian. You don't get anywhere with this, it's just sophistry no matter what side you're on. You have to make different arguments. What can we really say about Crimeans' wishes? In particular: why do you mention "the will of the people", if your political position is that it should not be up to the people of Crimea? Do you believe in the general idea of referenda? If not, why?
jasmer 4y ago
I will call your '2014 Obama' and raise you a '1981 Ronald Reagan'. The Americans have been trying to push Germany away from Russia literally for decades. [1] https://www.vocaleurope.eu/how-russian-pipelines-heat-up-tensions-from-reagans-battle-over-yamal-to-the-european-row-on-nord-stream-2/ https://www.vocaleurope.eu/how-russian-pipelines-heat-up-ten...
- landemva 4y ago
  And Germans snickered when Trump said the same in 2018. https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2018/09/25/trump-accused-germany-becoming-totally-dependent-russian-energy-un-germans-just-smirked https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2018/09/25/trump-accuse...
  - jasmer 4y ago
    Indeed - but that's also an example of how someone who has destroyed their credibility can't be effective. Nobody in the world is going to take Trump seriously for good reason, because he doesn't have any integrity even if you parse down a lot of what he is saying and remove the chicanery much of it is reasonable, it's not going to go anywhere. That said, it likely didn't matter the Euros were not going to listen anyhow.

vertis 4y ago

I'm really unclear why you linked such a biased news source. But for clarity: The Revolution of dignity has absolutely no signs of a coup. It resulted in presidential and parlimentary elections. Crimea was illegally annexed by Russia.

411111111111111 4y ago
As a German i agree with your point, but also agree with the point of the grandparent. It was predictable and the people responsible for Germany's heavy reliance on Russian gas unsurprisingly are getting paid through intermediaries by Russia. There have been an abundance of coverage on it, even from state media... but nothing ever changes. Heck, the current head of the government was/is involved in the biggest financially scandal of Germany's history and got away with it by "forgetting" everything.
- vertis 4y ago
  Yes agreed. Just couldn't go past the source. I'm not German, but have clients in Munich and have been learning German (i.e more than a remote armchair view). Have considered moving to Germany. This last year has disappointed me. I really thought Germany was one of the most rational actors in Europe and globally. Nowhere is perfect, and I don't expect it, but the way Germany has dithered about sending tanks (and other things) just saddens.
heartbeats 4y ago
> The Revolution of dignity has absolutely no signs of a coup. It resulted in presidential and parlimentary elections. This is a non-sequitur; the transfer of power was extra-constitutional, so it can't be ruled out by this fact alone. > Crimea was illegally annexed by Russia. This is a circular argument. It was illegal insofar as it violated Ukrainian law, sure, but whether Ukrainian law should apply in Crimea in the first place is literally the whole point of contention!
- vertis 4y ago
  1. The revolution of diginity was a series of protests. No-one took over the airwaves and killed the existing government. "On 21 February an agreement was signed between Yanukovych and leaders of the parliamentary opposition, witnessed by representatives from European Union and Russia. which promised return to the 2004 constitution, early elections and withdrawal of security forces from the center of the capital."[0]. 2. Crimea was assigned to Ukraine in 1991. It's part of Ukraine's internationally recognised borders. It's illegal according to international law. It was taken by force[1] without the will of the people. Any referendums under occupation are illegal and invalid (also according to international law)[2]. You can't vote with a gun to your head. [0]: https://www.bbc.com/russian/rolling_news/2014/02/140221_rn_yanukovich_preliminary_elections https://www.bbc.com/russian/rolling_news/2014/02/140221_rn_y... [1]: https://time.com/19097/putin-crimea-russia-ukraine-aksyonov/ https://time.com/19097/putin-crimea-russia-ukraine-aksyonov/ [2]:https://www.gov.uk/government/news/the-crimean-referendum https://www.gov.uk/government/news/the-crimean-referendum
  - heartbeats 4y ago
    1. That's not the definition of a coup or a revolution. What happened was an extra-constitutional transition of power, which is a technical term of art, and this is the case regardless of whether its final ends were good or evil. 2. This is a circular argument. It's contrary to domestic law insofar as Crimea is Ukrainian, it's contrary to international law insofar as Crimea is occupied, which it is insofar as the people don't want to be Russian, which they don't insofar as the referendum was illegitimate, which it is insofar as Crimea is Ukrainian. You don't get anywhere with this, it's just sophistry no matter what side you're on. You have to make different arguments. What can we really say about Crimeans' wishes? In particular: why do you mention "the will of the people", if your political position is that it should not be up to the people of Crimea? Do you believe in the general idea of referenda? If not, why?

jasmer 4y ago

I will call your '2014 Obama' and raise you a '1981 Ronald Reagan'. The Americans have been trying to push Germany away from Russia literally for decades. [1] https://www.vocaleurope.eu/how-russian-pipelines-heat-up-tensions-from-reagans-battle-over-yamal-to-the-european-row-on-nord-stream-2/ https://www.vocaleurope.eu/how-russian-pipelines-heat-up-ten...

landemva 4y ago
And Germans snickered when Trump said the same in 2018. https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2018/09/25/trump-accused-germany-becoming-totally-dependent-russian-energy-un-germans-just-smirked https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2018/09/25/trump-accuse...
- jasmer 4y ago
  Indeed - but that's also an example of how someone who has destroyed their credibility can't be effective. Nobody in the world is going to take Trump seriously for good reason, because he doesn't have any integrity even if you parse down a lot of what he is saying and remove the chicanery much of it is reasonable, it's not going to go anywhere. That said, it likely didn't matter the Euros were not going to listen anyhow.