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Many of his main points are vacuous at best. "Adding insult to injury, it’s an extremely simple and ugly unlock-gesture, just the sweep of a mono-color bar from

by tghw 15y ago

Many of his main points are vacuous at best. "Adding insult to injury, it’s an extremely simple and ugly unlock-gesture, just the sweep of a mono-color bar from right to left." Since when is a function being simple a problem? And he's comparing it to a Windows phone, where the entire interface is based on "mono-color" tiles. The Fire is a $200 tablet, and aside from a misplaced On/Off button (not sure how that got passed QA), the hardware you get for $200 is incredible. The software could use some work, there's no doubt about that. But here's the thing: They can improve the software. I don't love my Fire, but you can hardly say it is "downright terrible", especially when you consider the price tag.

phillco 15y ago
> They can improve the software. But not their first impressions. I've heard this argument before (hell, even The Lean Startup advocates shipping a broken, backwards v1.0), but it's usually paired with meekness: grow slowly, so that by the time you reach a wide audience your quality is awesome and nobody's the wiser. Instead, Amazon's pushing the Fire 1.0 with everything they've got. Shame, because Amazon probably could have pulled off the meekness strategy really well, too -- launch the Fire in December 2011 to a small number of hand-picked (Prime?) beta users, iterate, and launch the real thing in 2012.
kristofferR 15y ago
My mother or any other normal non-geeky people in my family doesn't care whether the problem lies in software or hardware. They care about the experience. The Kindle Fire experience is terrible right now. That terrible experience is what they'll remember and associate the brand with.
- tghw 15y ago
  "Terrible" is hyperbole at best. And while they may not care, my point is, Amazon can (and, I hope, will) improve it. All of these complaints about a $200 tablet remind me of Louis CK's bit on airplanes and cellphones, "Everything's amazing, and nobody's happy."
  - angstrom 15y ago
    You have a right to bitch if you're told you'll be flying a DC-10 and they seat you in a single engine Cessna.
    - dfxm12 15y ago
      Where did you get the idea that the the Fire is a top of the line type device? The Cessna costs a fraction of the price of the DC-10. The Fire is a fraction of the cost of an iPad... Even if you have no idea how to compare tech specs, or if you are brain-dead to marketing tactics, anyone should be able to look at the price tag and think to themselves, Well, the Fire costs a lot less than the competition. It's probably not going to have all the bells and whistles, but it is going to get the job done.
      - angstrom 15y ago
        Honestly, I didn't even include the iPad in the analogy. I would say the iPad is the 767. The Nook Tablet is borderline DC-10. Of course, I'm looking at these devices with a rooting perspective as well. The screen quality, RAM, and extra storage space giving the Nook the edge. I have no desire to listen to music on a tablet, so I really only care about web browsing and video. The e-ink devices are still superior for regular text IMO. Unfortunately, since the publishers adopted the agency pricing model, these devices won't decrease in cost as quickly as they would have under regular retail pricing that would've allowed the razor blade model to defer the costs.
  - __float 15y ago
    I really do have to agree. I got a Kindle Fire and I love it. I haven't really noticed any "terrible" aspects. It's not perfect but my experience has been good far more often than it has been bad.
  - beatle 15y ago
    You keep mentioning the price. The price is not an excuse to ship a crappy product. The iPod Touch starts at $200 and it's a great product.
- Kadrith 15y ago
  How so? I ask because I received a Kindle Fire for Christmas from my parents because I had been debating whether to buy one. So far I have used it for reading books and some light web browsing. The experience has been good so far, although I have not attempted to stress the device or perform an action it was not designed for. Every person I know, who has actually used a Kindle Fire, has had nothing but positive comments; most of them are non-technical.
  - Kadrith 15y ago
    A little late on the thread but I wanted to add this for anyone reading in the future. My sister purchased an iPad 2 about a month before Christmas; I talked her out of a Galaxy Tab. She has since returned the iPad 2 and gotten a Kindle Fire. Her main reason was that the iPad was too big for her to carry around constantly and the Fire fits in all of her purses. Since she would use the device while waiting or at random times, it was more important to have the device with her than sitting at home.
zmanji 15y ago
I'm not going to purchase a device because the software might improve in the future. I'm going to purchase a device that has functional software from day 1. Otherwise every day that I have to use the terrible software until it is improved is another cost that I have to pay.
budu3 15y ago
> it’s an extremely simple and ugly unlock-gesture, just the sweep of a mono-color bar from right to left I often wondered why a tablet would need such an unlock gesture. It makes sense on a cellphone because you don't want to accidentally unlock while your phone is in your pocket but can't we come up with a different gesture for the tablet form factor?
- ljf 15y ago
  Protect against claims of pocket purchases? To stop media playing in your bag and draining the battery. Screens can work again skin though thin cotton trouser pockets.
davidw 15y ago
I love my Kindle, but the Fire is... ok. Part of what irritates me about it is that with some software fixes it could be a lot more. Having the Google apps for instance, would be a huge improvement. Hardware wise, a microphone would have made it into a convenient device for making Skype type calls. My guess is that the next generation will be a lot better.
lloeki 15y ago
> "Adding insult to injury, it’s an extremely simple and ugly unlock-gesture, just the sweep of a mono-color bar from right to left." Since when is a function being simple a problem? The author is not arguing against the simplicity of the unlock gesture itself, he's arguing that the simplicity of the gesture makes its screwed-up-ness absolutely inexcusable. Or so I read it.
phaus 15y ago
I think you missed his point about the unlock animation. His complaint wasn't primarily that it was too simple. He was complaining that in spite of the animation's minimalistic design, it still lags. Personally it didn't bother me, but it is kind of silly that even the unlock animation causes choppiness on the Fire.
rayiner 15y ago
> But here's the thing: They can improve the software. Here is the other thing: the software is the only thing that matters. I can forgive an awkwardly placed on/of button, I hit it a couple of times a day. Lost touch events and the like, are an absolute deal breaker. I would never buy a car that regularly ignored throttle input or turns of the steering wheel, why would I buy a touch-interface device that regularly ignores touch events?
- tghw 15y ago
  Again, more hyperbole. If your car does not respond to inputs, you crash, resulting in property damage, injury, and possibly death. When your tablet does not respond to a tap, you tap it again and it works. At worst, you've suffered some minor frustration. Never mind that for about a half a day's work you have a handheld computer that 15 years ago was only available to the characters of Star Trek.
brown9-2 15y ago
Isn't this gesture identical to the iPhone's, with the directions reversed?

by tghw 15y ago

phillco 15y ago

> They can improve the software. But not their first impressions. I've heard this argument before (hell, even The Lean Startup advocates shipping a broken, backwards v1.0), but it's usually paired with meekness: grow slowly, so that by the time you reach a wide audience your quality is awesome and nobody's the wiser. Instead, Amazon's pushing the Fire 1.0 with everything they've got. Shame, because Amazon probably could have pulled off the meekness strategy really well, too -- launch the Fire in December 2011 to a small number of hand-picked (Prime?) beta users, iterate, and launch the real thing in 2012.

kristofferR 15y ago

My mother or any other normal non-geeky people in my family doesn't care whether the problem lies in software or hardware. They care about the experience. The Kindle Fire experience is terrible right now. That terrible experience is what they'll remember and associate the brand with.

tghw 15y ago
"Terrible" is hyperbole at best. And while they may not care, my point is, Amazon can (and, I hope, will) improve it. All of these complaints about a $200 tablet remind me of Louis CK's bit on airplanes and cellphones, "Everything's amazing, and nobody's happy."
- angstrom 15y ago
  You have a right to bitch if you're told you'll be flying a DC-10 and they seat you in a single engine Cessna.
  - dfxm12 15y ago
    Where did you get the idea that the the Fire is a top of the line type device? The Cessna costs a fraction of the price of the DC-10. The Fire is a fraction of the cost of an iPad... Even if you have no idea how to compare tech specs, or if you are brain-dead to marketing tactics, anyone should be able to look at the price tag and think to themselves, Well, the Fire costs a lot less than the competition. It's probably not going to have all the bells and whistles, but it is going to get the job done.
    - angstrom 15y ago
      Honestly, I didn't even include the iPad in the analogy. I would say the iPad is the 767. The Nook Tablet is borderline DC-10. Of course, I'm looking at these devices with a rooting perspective as well. The screen quality, RAM, and extra storage space giving the Nook the edge. I have no desire to listen to music on a tablet, so I really only care about web browsing and video. The e-ink devices are still superior for regular text IMO. Unfortunately, since the publishers adopted the agency pricing model, these devices won't decrease in cost as quickly as they would have under regular retail pricing that would've allowed the razor blade model to defer the costs.
- __float 15y ago
  I really do have to agree. I got a Kindle Fire and I love it. I haven't really noticed any "terrible" aspects. It's not perfect but my experience has been good far more often than it has been bad.
- beatle 15y ago
  You keep mentioning the price. The price is not an excuse to ship a crappy product. The iPod Touch starts at $200 and it's a great product.
Kadrith 15y ago
How so? I ask because I received a Kindle Fire for Christmas from my parents because I had been debating whether to buy one. So far I have used it for reading books and some light web browsing. The experience has been good so far, although I have not attempted to stress the device or perform an action it was not designed for. Every person I know, who has actually used a Kindle Fire, has had nothing but positive comments; most of them are non-technical.
- Kadrith 15y ago
  A little late on the thread but I wanted to add this for anyone reading in the future. My sister purchased an iPad 2 about a month before Christmas; I talked her out of a Galaxy Tab. She has since returned the iPad 2 and gotten a Kindle Fire. Her main reason was that the iPad was too big for her to carry around constantly and the Fire fits in all of her purses. Since she would use the device while waiting or at random times, it was more important to have the device with her than sitting at home.

zmanji 15y ago

I'm not going to purchase a device because the software might improve in the future. I'm going to purchase a device that has functional software from day 1. Otherwise every day that I have to use the terrible software until it is improved is another cost that I have to pay.

budu3 15y ago

> it’s an extremely simple and ugly unlock-gesture, just the sweep of a mono-color bar from right to left I often wondered why a tablet would need such an unlock gesture. It makes sense on a cellphone because you don't want to accidentally unlock while your phone is in your pocket but can't we come up with a different gesture for the tablet form factor?

ljf 15y ago
Protect against claims of pocket purchases? To stop media playing in your bag and draining the battery. Screens can work again skin though thin cotton trouser pockets.

davidw 15y ago

I love my Kindle, but the Fire is... ok. Part of what irritates me about it is that with some software fixes it could be a lot more. Having the Google apps for instance, would be a huge improvement. Hardware wise, a microphone would have made it into a convenient device for making Skype type calls. My guess is that the next generation will be a lot better.

lloeki 15y ago

> "Adding insult to injury, it’s an extremely simple and ugly unlock-gesture, just the sweep of a mono-color bar from right to left." Since when is a function being simple a problem? The author is not arguing against the simplicity of the unlock gesture itself, he's arguing that the simplicity of the gesture makes its screwed-up-ness absolutely inexcusable. Or so I read it.

phaus 15y ago

I think you missed his point about the unlock animation. His complaint wasn't primarily that it was too simple. He was complaining that in spite of the animation's minimalistic design, it still lags. Personally it didn't bother me, but it is kind of silly that even the unlock animation causes choppiness on the Fire.

rayiner 15y ago

> But here's the thing: They can improve the software. Here is the other thing: the software is the only thing that matters. I can forgive an awkwardly placed on/of button, I hit it a couple of times a day. Lost touch events and the like, are an absolute deal breaker. I would never buy a car that regularly ignored throttle input or turns of the steering wheel, why would I buy a touch-interface device that regularly ignores touch events?

tghw 15y ago
Again, more hyperbole. If your car does not respond to inputs, you crash, resulting in property damage, injury, and possibly death. When your tablet does not respond to a tap, you tap it again and it works. At worst, you've suffered some minor frustration. Never mind that for about a half a day's work you have a handheld computer that 15 years ago was only available to the characters of Star Trek.

brown9-2 15y ago

Isn't this gesture identical to the iPhone's, with the directions reversed?