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Rich people never want to acknowledge their luck, because it doesn't fit the "self-made" narrative. edit: to please the pedants, I should have said "many rich

• corndoge 4y ago
  Cynical but doesn't match my experience, plenty of rich people acknowledge luck
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  • jrm4 4y ago
    I bet there's a selection thing going on there. Most people, not being rich, aren't around rich people -- and so the rich people they "see" are exactly the type to not acknowledge luck, Trump perhaps being an extreme here.
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• PopAlongKid 4y ago
  The "luck" of many wealthy people is that they were born to wealthy parents (Walton family, Gates, etc).
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  • steveBK123 4y ago
    Yes, this is generally underestimated. The closer I've worked with this class the more it becomes apparent in quiet anecdotes that don't always make the official bios or wikis. Most self-made billionaires came from at least millionaire families. Generally hard working, smart guys with a lot of skill & luck, but they start at a level we can only dream that maybe our children or grandchildren can start from. I once worked for a billionaire investor who told us how he got started investing when his father offered him the choice at 13 years old: have his birthday party at one of the most famous & expensive hotels in NYC, or take the cash value of that to invest in stocks. The dollar figure seemed to be something like the equivalent of $50k in 2020 dollars. Much like orange man who got "a small loan of $1M from his father", I am sure the $50k given to a 13 year old was not the first or the last paternal investment. Another firm managing ~$10B there was a guy who unbelievably made it to the C-suite in his 20s. It was never clear exactly what the connection was, but he was some sort of family friend of the founder and worked for him as a teen. He was also related to a big bank CEO.
    • boeingUH60 4y ago
      > Another firm managing ~$10B there was a guy who unbelievably made it to the C-suite in his 20s. It was never clear exactly what the connection was, but he was some sort of family friend of the founder and worked for him as a teen. He was also related to a big bank CEO. Sounds like Matthew Grimes, lol https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-07-28/from-intern-to-co-defendant-barrack-protege-faces-loyalty-test https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-07-28/from-inte...
      • steveBK123 4y ago
        Actually a totally different guy, tells you how common the scenario is...
  • subradios 4y ago
    Most of the richest people today were born solidly middle or upper middle class. Nassim Taleb again, after mere comfortability ita a long road of blackjack and 100 hour workweeks.
• BuyMyBitcoins 4y ago
  The nuanced take is that luck is something that can be “made” through putting oneself in situations conducive to getting lucky through exposure, networking, and repeated attempts / not giving up. You might be able to get successful people to admit that they were in the right place at the right time, but they’ll almost always qualify that with how much effort they put in to be in that situation.
  • fabianhjr 4y ago
    > repeated attempts / not giving up Being able to afford that wouldn't be lucky, it would imply some sort of per-existing wealth or at least a solid support network.
    • BuyMyBitcoins 4y ago
      That’s true, and the extent of how necessary that existing wealth and support network is depends on the kind of venture. For starting a business, absolutely. But there are other kinds of success that aren’t as entrepreneurial. I was presenting it primarily through the lens of a mindset that is undaunted by failure and having the motivation to avoid giving up prematurely. Successful writers and entertainers often share stories about how they were rejected dozens and dozens of times before finally getting noticed. I have friends who wanted to change careers by moving to a different industry and they must have submitted hundreds of job applications before they managed to get their junior level role.
    • shukantpal 4y ago
      Or that could be earned
    • danaris 4y ago
      ...Which you have in the first place by being lucky in your birth.
  • atmavatar 4y ago
    If you want to catch a MLB game ball, you have to a) attend a game, b) pay attention to every ball hit, c) practice actually catching a ball, and (for some) bring a glove. If you're particularly savvy, you can even purchase tickets for seats in an area to where balls are commonly hit, and if you're determined, you can go to lots of games. However, you're only getting that ball if it's hit in your direction. You can attend hundreds of games and still never have one hit close enough to catch. While missing one or more preparation steps (e.g., attending a game) may rule out the possibility of catching a game ball, for every person who does catch one, there are dozens if not hundreds of people who prepare at least as much and still never do.
• manigandham 4y ago
  Many rich people do acknowledge it, because another way to say it is odds or opportunities. And you can absolutely increase the likelihood of getting "lucky" through work.
• 2devnull 4y ago
  “You know, some people got no choice, and they can never find a voice, to talk with that they can even call their own. So the first thing that they see, that allows them the right to be, why they follow it, you know, it’s called bad luck.” Lou Reed
• tasty_freeze 4y ago
  There are plenty of 1%-ers who work hard and they ascribe their success to their hard work and intelligence. But it ignores that there are many people who work harder, are more intelligent, or both, who don't get to those heights. That is the luck aspect. If one is on top of the heap, it is convenient to believe in meritocracy, doubly so. On the one hand, it makes the person feel they earned what they have, and second it means the poor are also getting what they deserve and so there is no need to artificially prop them up. "Those people" should have worked harder.
  • nightski 4y ago
    It's also because working "hard" isn't enough. You have to put your effort where it matters. That is so often overlooked.
    • idlehand 4y ago
      Working hard implies the labor theory of value, which is that all work is interchangeable. While that might have been closer to the truth during the first industrial revolution, the variability in the value of labor has never been higher than today. It's comforting to think that those that have achieved the best outcomes in life have simply sacrificed time spent on other things, and spent more time on work. There might be some truth in that, but often they have had better opportunities, due to both circumstance and luck, that they also have made better use of than average.
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      • ddingus 4y ago
        Luck plays a role. A significant one. But so do you! Here's an example from my own life: In the late 80's, heading into the early 90's I was working in manufacturing. Paid poorly, but man! I love that work. Had a great time, worked with people who had real skills and built up a set of my own too. Saw the outsource waves coming hard. They were big and they were going to gut manufacturing. We all talked about it. Few of us really did anything about it. I was one of the ones who did. I started networking. Got out there, started having lunches with people, attending various groups, all sorts of stuff. Fast forward today: I'm running a startup with a partner doing work with metal additive technologies after a 25 year run in CAD / PLM. Back to manufacturing as an reshoring wave is headed our way. For many doing the work the pay is still not great, but more opportunities are out there now than there have been for a long time. My peers from that time period are mostly doing the same work, for almost the same pay ( and if that doesn't speak to some troublesome economic policy, I do not know what does ), or are employed in other fields. A few of us moved up and into another class basically. Lucky? Hell yes! But, had I not done the networking, I know absolutely I would not be in the position I am in today. In a basic sense, this all works a bit like a lottery or raffle. Consider each interaction with others a ticket. The game is going to reward X number of tickets. And Y tickets may be rewarded due to unplanned opportunity happening as a result of a group of people realizing something is an opportunity that they would not have realized apart or in a different context. There are Z tickets total, let's say. People who are active in this way, talking with others, helping others out, seeking help, and doing projects, whatever they can do, get a lot more tickets than most people do. And because of that they seem more lucky because more of them find opportunity than the baseline people not so active do. Now, I have one other thing to say and that is about the "do what you love and money will follow" many people say is really only applicable to well off people who are somehow enabled to do what they love because their basic needs are covered somehow, or put another way, they are just not needy which frees them up to explore what they love. The truth is many of us can do what we love and money will follow, but it's hard work!! What I did was work my job and put 20 percent of my free time into "hobbies" that were skill builders toward "what I love" and that activity coupled with the networking and helping others is what got me a lot of those raffle tickets to better opportunities!! I spent a ton of time doing electronics and programming on my own. A lot of it was retro computer based because I love retro computing. That 8 bit era is so damn much fun! I still love it. But, I also used it as a vehicle to build skills I would need later on, and it all worked out. Working on bigger systems helped too. I didn't put all my time into 8 bitters. I had SGI unix systems purchased off ebay, a couple pretty good Linux machines assembled from parts I got many different ways. And I setup an electronics lab made of second hand gear, some things I made myself, and a few gifts from people or trades I got helping others out too. When opportunity presented itself I knew enough to be able to go for it and knew enough people to get help too. Don't get me wrong. I've been lucky. Others I know will own their own luck too. ( in comfortable conversation ) But, I also maximized my chances. The cost was a bit less free play time than my peers had, but really it was also time I really enjoyed because it was invested in things I love to do and that really interest me. Mostly, I didn't catch as many movies and as many parties. No joke! But, I had many more interesting lunches meeting great people doing all sorts of stuff!! I am nor sure that was a cost as much as it was just living differently. To sum up: Sometimes a person gets noticed, or a co-worker can lend a hand up. This happens sometimes, but not too often. More often a person gets noticed when they are active among other people. This happens more often. Getting noticed is "that person deserves an opportunity", or "I know a guy who can get this done", or, "Did you see her project? It lines right up...." Helping others often results in those others wanting to help us in return! Not always, but pretty often. Doing stuff results in skills, stories one can tell, reasons to talk with others, and a general increase in competency and capability. All that type of activity is what does tend to very seriously increase one's chance of a "luck" event happening! They are also what can very seriously improve one's ability to take advantage of a "luck" event, which is what I call an opportunity, generally speaking. All of what I just said is what one can do when having means, available capital isn't on the table. Wasn't for me. I came from poverty. And there is no shame in poverty. It sucks. Way too many of us are there and it's not OK. There is a policy discussion to have one day soon. And we should have already had that discussion. Like I said, we should have it one day soon. The shame, if there is any at all, boils down to those of us able to help others out not doing it. And in like kind, those of us needing help, some opportunity, not doing things to increase our chances of seeing opportunity and being able to act on it in a meaningful way. *Labor theory of value* I think you are right about work not being interchangeable. It's not been that way in my experience. Some work is. Other work isn't, and people and their basic nature vary widely too. This does imply just working hard isn't enough. I don't agree with that at all! What you do matters. And "working hard" means doing more of the kinds of things needed to improve luck more of the time in my view.
• CM30 4y ago
  Not just rich people, successful people in general hate to acknowledge the role luck played in their success. It's really obvious on communities devoted to becoming successful at a certain hobby or venture, like blogging, video creation, live streaming, SEO/marketing, game development, startups, etc. Those who made it big will talk about it's all skill and how their amazingly strategies and hard work paid off, whereas those who failed will be talking about its all luck based, how their timing was off and how they didn't have the connections needed to succeed. It's called self-serving bias, and it's everywhere in society.
• jl6 4y ago
  “Which contributes more to wealth: luck or hard work? Which contributes more to the area of a rectangle: height or width?”
  • nightski 4y ago
    By framing the problem like this you are making the assumption the variables are independent which is very much not the case. Your work can influence your luck, and even how much effect said luck has.
    • redler 4y ago
      Luck indeed finds you hard at work. But also, if you’re not sitting at the table, you’re on the menu.
      • nightski 4y ago
        That hasn't really been my experience, but ymmv. But it's also why we should fight so much against centralization in the economy even if it brings efficiency gains. Ideally you'd want to have as large of a table as possible.