4 ms·

That's signaling, like wearing expensive clothes. Countersignaling means dressing like a bum in high-class circles and getting accepted anyway. https://en.wiki

That's signaling, like wearing expensive clothes. Countersignaling means dressing like a bum in high-class circles and getting accepted anyway. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signalling_(economics) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signalling_(economics)

082349872349872 4y ago
Maybe I'd been overthinking it? I had been considering "I have a high-paying job" as signalling, and "My pay doesn't really cover the essentials, but I do it for our country, don't you know" as counter-. Edit: and otoh I would consider "Boss is in shorts, t-shirt and sandals" as just plain signalling, because I grew up in a world (my favourite anecdote was working with a Hawai'ian VC who would classify meetings as "socks" or "no socks") where in any given business situation, those who have the gold dress down and those who pitch for it dress up.
- ltbarcly3 4y ago
  You are under thinking it. Signalling is showing you have something high status (money, nice clothes, etc), countersignalling is refusing to show something to prove you don't need to.
- YurgenJurgensen 4y ago
  Presumably the signal is actually "I'm independently wealthy, so I can afford to take this job that loses me money".
- abecedarius 4y ago
  I think we agree about the phenomena, it's just that the word "signaling" has a false lucidity -- it has an everyday meaning and a related technical meaning that's easy to overlook. The technical meaning is about an equilibrium in a game where "talk is cheap", so that your message would be discounted by observers unless some cost (not necessarily in money) is tied to it. With countersignaling there's an extra level to the game where your message has the form "I have this quality over and above merely affording the first-level cost" -- now the cost you're paying is the risk of being taken for riff-raff. Those with more of that quality, whatever it is, have to be better at pulling that gambit off, for it to work as a countersignal.
  - 082349872349872 4y ago
    Thanks for the clarification! Sprezzatura might be the quality? conjugation: "They are riffraff. You are sloppy. I am sprezzatura incarnate."
    - abecedarius 4y ago
      I think that's a good example, yeah.
somrand0 4y ago
thanks for the succinct definition. essentially, more status game plays

082349872349872 4y ago

Maybe I'd been overthinking it? I had been considering "I have a high-paying job" as signalling, and "My pay doesn't really cover the essentials, but I do it for our country, don't you know" as counter-. Edit: and otoh I would consider "Boss is in shorts, t-shirt and sandals" as just plain signalling, because I grew up in a world (my favourite anecdote was working with a Hawai'ian VC who would classify meetings as "socks" or "no socks") where in any given business situation, those who have the gold dress down and those who pitch for it dress up.

ltbarcly3 4y ago
You are under thinking it. Signalling is showing you have something high status (money, nice clothes, etc), countersignalling is refusing to show something to prove you don't need to.
YurgenJurgensen 4y ago
Presumably the signal is actually "I'm independently wealthy, so I can afford to take this job that loses me money".
abecedarius 4y ago
I think we agree about the phenomena, it's just that the word "signaling" has a false lucidity -- it has an everyday meaning and a related technical meaning that's easy to overlook. The technical meaning is about an equilibrium in a game where "talk is cheap", so that your message would be discounted by observers unless some cost (not necessarily in money) is tied to it. With countersignaling there's an extra level to the game where your message has the form "I have this quality over and above merely affording the first-level cost" -- now the cost you're paying is the risk of being taken for riff-raff. Those with more of that quality, whatever it is, have to be better at pulling that gambit off, for it to work as a countersignal.
- 082349872349872 4y ago
  Thanks for the clarification! Sprezzatura might be the quality? conjugation: "They are riffraff. You are sloppy. I am sprezzatura incarnate."
  - abecedarius 4y ago
    I think that's a good example, yeah.

somrand0 4y ago

thanks for the succinct definition. essentially, more status game plays