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[Full disclosure: I have contributed to Hackety Hack! (http://hackety-hack.com/ http://hackety-hack.com/) in the past, an analogous product.] I wish Kidsruby d

[Full disclosure: I have contributed to Hackety Hack! (http://hackety-hack.com/ http://hackety-hack.com/) in the past, an analogous product.] I wish Kidsruby didn't feel like a really poorly directed effort. That website is about as unfriendly as it could be. For example: I'm a new programmer - where do I get started? Does the app teach me? Does the website teach me? Can anyone help me if I have questions? How do I "make games" or "hack my homework"? I'd bet kids don't care about the news, the Twitter feed, or how many Likes this has on Facebook, so why is that the first thing they see? (And why is it included on most pages? Is there no more useful information to add?) How do I even get to the "about" page besides a poorly named link on the homepage? -- These are probably issues that can be solved by a designer and some careful thought, but I think it takes more than a cartoon header to be "kid friendly". Obviously the website isn't the core product, but with so few examples and lessons, I feel like it needs to offer more direction, guidance and instruction. Not everyone learns best in a sandbox.

deadprogram 15y ago
Thanks for your feedback. Have you installed 1.0 and played with it yet? We've tried to address the first time user a bit better. If you have specific instructional material you think should be added, we would be delighted to receive a pull request. Thanks again for the feedback, we do appreciate it.
- ddagradi 15y ago
  Just did an install. A 260MB download is just silly. And it's not even the application, it's an installer. Once it's done dropping copies of qt, Ruby and git somewhere on my system I can finally get started. Please, please make a better package than that. First launch gets better. Friendly "Start Here" button that explains the interface. And then it links to Hackety Hack, which is awesome, because _why's lessons are awesome. Could the code examples be formatted any worse though? All white text on a black background, with white borders and an incorrect line height? Yuck. (It's much better in the non-_why lessons, where code is formatted pre-tag style, but still not colored.). Including RubyWarrior and Gosu is a fantastic idea. Great packages! But then there's inconsistencies. The glossary defines 3 terms, and then fails to define 7 more. The app seems confused, telling me all of the following: "This is KidsRuby" "This is Hackety Hack" "This is Ruby4Kids" The tabs differentiating between "Output" and "Turtle" are an interesting concept. I'm of a mixed opinion there, but I see what you're getting at. I'd probably have argued against that as one tab or the other is potentially useless at all times. Really, I have the same criticism to level at this as Hackety Hack (and I imagine that is no small coincidence): it's a good idea wrapped in a terrible experience. It's not that it needs to be dumbed down for children, but it does need stronger guidance. It fails by giving too many opportunities for alienation and/or working just badly enough that users will get frustrated and give up. The fact that it doesn't behave like a native app makes it that much harder to apply existing knowledge.
- extension 15y ago
  Feedback for the MacOS version: - It asks for admin privileges with no explanation. - Then it spends a loooong time installing, again with no explanation of what it's doing or how long it will take. - It's installing things I already have (ruby and git) and I don't know if it is clobbering them. - It adds a folder to the Applications menu with one useful entry (KidsRuby.app) and a bunch of internal files. There is something called kidsirb.sh which opens Xcode. - There is barely any learning material inside the app. I don't see how I would actually learn the language from this. Sure, if I'm resourceful I could probably find that material elsewhere, but then what is the point of using this over vanilla IRB? Not a lot.
tomatohs 15y ago
For reference, here are the instructions for installing github on Windows. The audience here can very possibly be doing their first school programming assignment with git. http://help.github.com/win-set-up-git/ http://help.github.com/win-set-up-git/ Your site should try to provide a very linear guide for new users.

deadprogram 15y ago

Thanks for your feedback. Have you installed 1.0 and played with it yet? We've tried to address the first time user a bit better. If you have specific instructional material you think should be added, we would be delighted to receive a pull request. Thanks again for the feedback, we do appreciate it.

ddagradi 15y ago
Just did an install. A 260MB download is just silly. And it's not even the application, it's an installer. Once it's done dropping copies of qt, Ruby and git somewhere on my system I can finally get started. Please, please make a better package than that. First launch gets better. Friendly "Start Here" button that explains the interface. And then it links to Hackety Hack, which is awesome, because _why's lessons are awesome. Could the code examples be formatted any worse though? All white text on a black background, with white borders and an incorrect line height? Yuck. (It's much better in the non-_why lessons, where code is formatted pre-tag style, but still not colored.). Including RubyWarrior and Gosu is a fantastic idea. Great packages! But then there's inconsistencies. The glossary defines 3 terms, and then fails to define 7 more. The app seems confused, telling me all of the following: "This is KidsRuby" "This is Hackety Hack" "This is Ruby4Kids" The tabs differentiating between "Output" and "Turtle" are an interesting concept. I'm of a mixed opinion there, but I see what you're getting at. I'd probably have argued against that as one tab or the other is potentially useless at all times. Really, I have the same criticism to level at this as Hackety Hack (and I imagine that is no small coincidence): it's a good idea wrapped in a terrible experience. It's not that it needs to be dumbed down for children, but it does need stronger guidance. It fails by giving too many opportunities for alienation and/or working just badly enough that users will get frustrated and give up. The fact that it doesn't behave like a native app makes it that much harder to apply existing knowledge.
extension 15y ago
Feedback for the MacOS version: - It asks for admin privileges with no explanation. - Then it spends a loooong time installing, again with no explanation of what it's doing or how long it will take. - It's installing things I already have (ruby and git) and I don't know if it is clobbering them. - It adds a folder to the Applications menu with one useful entry (KidsRuby.app) and a bunch of internal files. There is something called kidsirb.sh which opens Xcode. - There is barely any learning material inside the app. I don't see how I would actually learn the language from this. Sure, if I'm resourceful I could probably find that material elsewhere, but then what is the point of using this over vanilla IRB? Not a lot.

tomatohs 15y ago

For reference, here are the instructions for installing github on Windows. The audience here can very possibly be doing their first school programming assignment with git. http://help.github.com/win-set-up-git/ http://help.github.com/win-set-up-git/ Your site should try to provide a very linear guide for new users.