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> who call themselves In which sense? Because 'queer' means "eccentric" - many would describe as that. For that matter, people call themselves "gay" for "joyou

by mdp2021 4y ago

> who call themselves In which sense? Because 'queer' means "eccentric" - many would describe as that. For that matter, people call themselves "gay" for "joyous". Incidentally: the queer use of 'queer' predates that of 'gay' (just a piece of trivia).

yuuu 4y ago
> For that matter, people call themselves "gay" for "joyous". Uh... I don't think people do that anymore.
- mdp2021 4y ago
  They do, and some will absolutely do (to some it is important to "assess" language) - it really depends on what you mean with "people" (of course I meant a subset). What happened there is, in the succession of editings I left that 'people' there in a way that happened to be ambiguous. I made a composition error out of inattention.
  - yuuu 4y ago
    The subset you're talking about is the union of extremely non-native English speakers and native English speakers over 120 years old.
    - mdp2021 4y ago
      No. It is not a matter of being «native». It may be your mothertongue of not: it is an approach transversal to all (this class of) languages. It is the set of those people who intend to speak English, though surely not the language in use among the English. "Currently typical" English does not mean "good" English. Edit: On the contrary, «native English speakers» are the one who will follow that: they are the ones supposed to have absorbed more English (and relevant) literature. I have just checked and I see the terms employed correctly in Joyce, in Wilde, in Chandler, in Hammett, in Paul Johnson, in Niall Ferguson, in Woody Allen, in Spike Milligan. As absolutely expected: there is the gathering of the Assessors.
mgrthrow 4y ago
Of course queer as "unusual" predates "queer" as gay. :D It's a reclaimed slur. It was a negative label applied to people who ultimately decided to make that negative label a part of their identity.
- mdp2021 4y ago
  [Removed chunk because of misunderstanding] [...] To my info, the first use of 'queer' for "homosexual" is from 1922, and the term was used for "eccentric" for the last five centuries. ('gay' for homosexual was reported as widespread "communitarian" use in medical texts in the 1940's - the use for "promiscuous" is at least four centuries old. In some territories, 'gay girl' still means "prostitute".) Edit: I misread your post. Of course, "of course" ""queer" for homosexual" can easily be a "reclaimed slur". There should be no surprise about it. And your use of 'gay' in «"queer" as gay» is "queer". That is not ""queer" as gay", it is "queer" as "unaligned in sexual orientation", and not necessarily "gay". Just nitpicking on language though.
nicoburns 4y ago
> In which sense? Generally in a political sense (related to the gay sense). Someone who does not accept heterosexuality as a norm or default way of being, even though it may something that they personally prefer.

yuuu 4y ago

> For that matter, people call themselves "gay" for "joyous". Uh... I don't think people do that anymore.

mdp2021 4y ago
They do, and some will absolutely do (to some it is important to "assess" language) - it really depends on what you mean with "people" (of course I meant a subset). What happened there is, in the succession of editings I left that 'people' there in a way that happened to be ambiguous. I made a composition error out of inattention.
- yuuu 4y ago
  The subset you're talking about is the union of extremely non-native English speakers and native English speakers over 120 years old.
  - mdp2021 4y ago
    No. It is not a matter of being «native». It may be your mothertongue of not: it is an approach transversal to all (this class of) languages. It is the set of those people who intend to speak English, though surely not the language in use among the English. "Currently typical" English does not mean "good" English. Edit: On the contrary, «native English speakers» are the one who will follow that: they are the ones supposed to have absorbed more English (and relevant) literature. I have just checked and I see the terms employed correctly in Joyce, in Wilde, in Chandler, in Hammett, in Paul Johnson, in Niall Ferguson, in Woody Allen, in Spike Milligan. As absolutely expected: there is the gathering of the Assessors.

mgrthrow 4y ago

Of course queer as "unusual" predates "queer" as gay. :D It's a reclaimed slur. It was a negative label applied to people who ultimately decided to make that negative label a part of their identity.

mdp2021 4y ago
[Removed chunk because of misunderstanding] [...] To my info, the first use of 'queer' for "homosexual" is from 1922, and the term was used for "eccentric" for the last five centuries. ('gay' for homosexual was reported as widespread "communitarian" use in medical texts in the 1940's - the use for "promiscuous" is at least four centuries old. In some territories, 'gay girl' still means "prostitute".) Edit: I misread your post. Of course, "of course" ""queer" for homosexual" can easily be a "reclaimed slur". There should be no surprise about it. And your use of 'gay' in «"queer" as gay» is "queer". That is not ""queer" as gay", it is "queer" as "unaligned in sexual orientation", and not necessarily "gay". Just nitpicking on language though.

nicoburns 4y ago

> In which sense? Generally in a political sense (related to the gay sense). Someone who does not accept heterosexuality as a norm or default way of being, even though it may something that they personally prefer.