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We have it, but I don’t trust companies not to fuck it up. I don’t want to allow the 5 or 10 companies I pay monthly fees to to each have the keys to withdraw m

We have it, but I don’t trust companies not to fuck it up. I don’t want to allow the 5 or 10 companies I pay monthly fees to to each have the keys to withdraw money from my account. I mean we’ve seen what happens with tech companies like PayPal and how they screw you over. I’m not letting the local electric company have that kind of access to my account! One billing error, hack, or hidden surprise fee, and I could be wiped out.

TheHappyOddish 4y ago
It's wild this is a concern for you, when this is extremely normal for billions of people.
- thewebcount 4y ago
  There are only ~350 million in the US. The others are elsewhere and don’t suffer the same weird banking issues we do. That said, I still pay electronically, I just do it manually. I go to my banking site and enter the amount on my bill, which I’ve checked to make sure it’s accurate.
Nursie 4y ago
One billing error, hack or surprise fee and you’re one phone call from having it reversed under the terms of the direct debit guarantee. In the countries I’ve lived in.
- thewebcount 4y ago
  I’m in the US for what that’s worth. What you’ve posited assumes you can get someone on the phone which is no small task these days. Also, keep in mind that something like 60% of Americans are a single surprise $500 expense away from going into debt[0]. (Luckily I’m not one of them.) But generally, it takes weeks to months to get your money back if something like this happens, and that assumes everything goes well, which it rarely does. [0] https://www.forbes.com/sites/maggiemcgrath/2016/01/06/63-of-americans-dont-have-enough-savings-to-cover-a-500-emergency/?sh=729440cf4e0d https://www.forbes.com/sites/maggiemcgrath/2016/01/06/63-of-...
  - Nursie 4y ago
    Yeah that does sound like a nightmare. The UK direct-debit guarantee includes the provision that you must get a full and immediate refund on error, to prevent this sort of thing, and while I'm sure it doesn't always work as smoothly as you'd want, they are very commonly used and not a great source of complaints. https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/businesses/complaints-deal/banking-and-payments/direct-debits https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/businesses/complaints... That said, fuckups do still happen! https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/dec/07/kent-family-charged-80k-in-error-after-edf-sent-1m-electricity-bill https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/dec/07/kent-family...
lbschenkel 4y ago
In Sweden we have direct debit (autogiro), but we also have e-invoice (e-faktura), which I prefer and think it's the best of both worlds: the invoice and the charge are sent electronically to your bank (usually ~3 weeks in advance), and you approve with one click -- scheduling a transfer of that amount on the due date. That gives you the chance to verify if everything is correct before you pay, and does not give the company any permission to withdraw funds from your account. This is what I usually do: (1) check my bank 1 week before the end of each month, (2) eyeball the amounts for all e-invoices, (3) approve everything with a single click.

TheHappyOddish 4y ago

It's wild this is a concern for you, when this is extremely normal for billions of people.

thewebcount 4y ago
There are only ~350 million in the US. The others are elsewhere and don’t suffer the same weird banking issues we do. That said, I still pay electronically, I just do it manually. I go to my banking site and enter the amount on my bill, which I’ve checked to make sure it’s accurate.

Nursie 4y ago

One billing error, hack or surprise fee and you’re one phone call from having it reversed under the terms of the direct debit guarantee. In the countries I’ve lived in.

thewebcount 4y ago
I’m in the US for what that’s worth. What you’ve posited assumes you can get someone on the phone which is no small task these days. Also, keep in mind that something like 60% of Americans are a single surprise $500 expense away from going into debt[0]. (Luckily I’m not one of them.) But generally, it takes weeks to months to get your money back if something like this happens, and that assumes everything goes well, which it rarely does. [0] https://www.forbes.com/sites/maggiemcgrath/2016/01/06/63-of-americans-dont-have-enough-savings-to-cover-a-500-emergency/?sh=729440cf4e0d https://www.forbes.com/sites/maggiemcgrath/2016/01/06/63-of-...
- Nursie 4y ago
  Yeah that does sound like a nightmare. The UK direct-debit guarantee includes the provision that you must get a full and immediate refund on error, to prevent this sort of thing, and while I'm sure it doesn't always work as smoothly as you'd want, they are very commonly used and not a great source of complaints. https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/businesses/complaints-deal/banking-and-payments/direct-debits https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/businesses/complaints... That said, fuckups do still happen! https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/dec/07/kent-family-charged-80k-in-error-after-edf-sent-1m-electricity-bill https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/dec/07/kent-family...

lbschenkel 4y ago

In Sweden we have direct debit (autogiro), but we also have e-invoice (e-faktura), which I prefer and think it's the best of both worlds: the invoice and the charge are sent electronically to your bank (usually ~3 weeks in advance), and you approve with one click -- scheduling a transfer of that amount on the due date. That gives you the chance to verify if everything is correct before you pay, and does not give the company any permission to withdraw funds from your account. This is what I usually do: (1) check my bank 1 week before the end of each month, (2) eyeball the amounts for all e-invoices, (3) approve everything with a single click.