12 ms·

Neovim Conf 2022

189 points by davidkunz 4y ago

greggarious 4y ago
Is neovim what was MacVim or are those two separate things? Nice photo for the keynote speaker BTW - very cyberpunk -- thanks for the help keeping emacs down ;-)
- davidkunz 4y ago
  Neovim is a continuation of Vim, you can find more info here: https://neovim.io/charter/ https://neovim.io/charter/ Edit: This doesn't mean Vim is discontinued.
  - halostatue 4y ago
    s/continuation/hard fork/ Neovim is a hard fork, not a continuation. Vim is still being developed by Bram and other contributors, and has a lot of the same functionality now with different API surfaces. Questionable choices by both development groups (but, IMO, mostly from the initial arrogance of the neovim developers) are increasing the gap to the point where, in a couple of years, I do not expect there to be meaningful compatibility between them. A lot of people don’t like Vimscript, but I personally find the Lua integrations which neovim has to be harder to use because the language isn’t built around the editor, it requires bridging, and there’s a definite impedance mismatch involved. For me, without an equivalent of `gvim`/`MacVim`, neovim is a non-starter. The OS-level integration is important, and none of the various neovim GUIs that exist are nearly as good as the original `gvim` for X or Windows or MacVim for macOS.
    - israrkhan 4y ago
      I find lots of arguments about who was actually more arrogant. But lets look at it from objective perspective. Looking at neovim[1] vs vim[2] contribution Bram is top contributor for vim. 16,211 commit right now. Second top most contributor has 194 commits only. Neovim top contributor has 2285 commits, followed by 21,66 commits for second. It looks to me that neovim is more open to community contribution. Then look at commit graph over period of time. It looks like Neovim is more actively developed. There development activity level around vim also increased in 2016. Perhaps that was the time when bram realized that he need to do more with vim, to compete with neovim. I myself was a longtime vim user, who switched to neovim 2 years ago, and am happy with it. [1] https://github.com/vim/vim/graphs/contributors https://github.com/vim/vim/graphs/contributors [2] https://github.com/vim/vim/graphs/contributors https://github.com/vim/vim/graphs/contributors
    - kurtreed 4y ago
      What did you find arrogant about the neovim developers?
      - halostatue 4y ago
        Pretty much everything, including the ongoing lie that Neovim is a "continuation" of Vim. I replied in a different comment (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33922783 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33922783) about the async patches, which is where the whole things started. Because the patches weren’t accepted as is, they hard forked. That requires an incredible amount of arrogance. Neovim is not better than Vim. It is (increasingly) different. They have made different choices, some of which are interesting, some of which are baffling, and most of which are just different, although I consider the removal of GUI support to be about as arrogant as the gemini protocol stuff. There is a pernicious strain of software developer that thinks that they know better on everything and that GUIs are bad. I felt that way in 1992 or so, despite having been exposed in 1990 to X, because it was easy to pick on Windows 3.1 and (then) Mac users. I got over it because there are things which are better, easier, and faster with GUIs than without. Not everything needs a GUI, but if you want people to use your software, leaving it in the terminal is unlikely to be a long-term success strategy.
        soperj 4y ago
        > Because the patches weren’t accepted as is, they hard forked. They weren't accepted for years, and if you're being honest, they never were going to be accepted. I'm guessing you thought Bram was also arrogant for forking vi?
        halostatue 4y ago
        You’re right. They weren’t going to be accepted, because they didn’t work the way that Bram thought they should and the people who pushed them would not change them to fit Bram’s goals. As package maintainer myself, if I get a PR/patchset the implements something in a way with which I disagree, I will not accept the changes. If I don’t care enough about the changes, then I probably won’t implement them either. Or I might do so later when I have time. On the history of things, please be more precise. Bram did not fork vi. He worked from the Stevie code, which only ran on the Atari ST, so that he could use it on Amiga. It quickly expanded to other systems (I believe I encountered it after trying other DOS-based vi-like editors). That expansion eventually made it into the relative juggernaut it is today.
    - shmerl 4y ago
      I'm glad for neovim addressing issues that vim ignored for years. The fact that vim picked some of those features is competitive pressure.
    - sodapopcan 4y ago
      Hard agree on lua v. viml. Viml really isn't that bad. I'm certainly not claiming it doesn't have its warts and shouldn't keep improving, but it's a DSL for a text editor... And as you point out, you still need to know a bunch of viml that you have to wrap in Lua calls. At the same time, I haven't actually given vim scripting in Lua a fair shot, so I'd be happy if anyone could shed some light on why they might think it's better.
    - wirrbel 4y ago
      > but, IMO, mostly from the initial arrogance of the neovim developers Vim really was in a sad state prior to the fork which turned out to be a wake up call to Bram it seems.
  - microsoftdoes 4y ago
    “Continuation” is a nasty lie when the original is by no means discontinued or dormant.
    - israrkhan 4y ago
      If you look at vim commit history, it was pretty much stagnant for a long period of time, and then activity picked up in 2016, when it finally got competition from neovim. IMO governance model for vim, is not much receptive to community contribution, while neovim is more open. Looking at commit history and contributors graph on github seems to validate this.
    - turndown 4y ago
      You’re right, at one point nvim was a continuation, but no more. For example nvim significantly cleaned up and reorganized and rewrote vim’s C code, they added complex new features like Lua config, floating windows, better plugin support. Vim copied many features they released independently… maybe vim is the continuation here now? I think one of my favorite things about vim the continuation is that after sitting on a terrible config language for >2 decades somehow when nvim released Lua support all of the sudden vim was working on a new incompatible version of vimscript.
      - halostatue 4y ago
        This is also a sanitized version of the truth. Neovim was never a continuation. Bram has never stopped developing Vim. As I understand it, the people behind Neovim developed some async patches which were not accepted by Bram for various reasons, and there was an ongoing discussion. Rather than reworking them to something that Bram thought was acceptable, they performed a hard fork. In the process of hard forking, they removed everything that they considered unimportant. This included gvim, support for older OSes, etc. Vim has not, to the best of my knowledge, copied any features back from neovim, although it does now (shortly after Neovim forked) have async features (written with an API and user surface that Bram prefers) and various other features that may be similar. Please note that Vim has had Lua, Ruby, Python, Perl, and other scripting language support for a very long time. The main difference is that rather than being compiled as an add-on and using bridging, neovim has added a Lua engine into the core (increasing complexity that way) and creating a DX-poor bridge for common vim configuration things so that startup scripts can be written in Lua. Yes, Bram started working on Vimscript9 late, but your characterization of the history also is (unintentionally?) dishonest in that Vimscript has had extensive expansion and updates through time. Neovim is not and has never been a continuation of the Vim project, despite their press. It has always been a hard fork that is getting increasingly incompatible with the source project, and I personally find it less usable than Vim because there’s not a single good GUI for it (there are several which may eventually become promising, and there are several which have taken bizarre directions like Oni2 did).
- mikestew 4y ago
  To directly answer your question, MacVim is a GUI wrapper around plain ol' vim. AFAICT, MacVim has no relation to neovim.
  - ARandomerDude 4y ago
    Great comment, I’ll add there’s a MacVim-like GUI wrapper but for Neovim called VimR that i really like. https://github.com/qvacua/vimr https://github.com/qvacua/vimr
    - predmijat 4y ago
      There's also Neovide which is written in Rust, which makes it, well, blazingly fast. https://github.com/neovide/neovide https://github.com/neovide/neovide
      - halostatue 4y ago
        Neovide is fast, but does not have any macOS-level integration. While it’s nice that it’s not electron like so many other neovim GUIs, it does not work well on macOS.
        greggarious 4y ago
        Ugh, no offense but I'll skip neovide then -- I hate stuff that does the crap GIMP does where it doesn't blend in with the rest of macOS
    - halostatue 4y ago
      Can't stand it, myself. Of the various Neovim macOS UIs, this is the one that is perhaps closest to MacVim, but the UI choices about having the drawers present all the time and other pieces make it both less reliable and less usable than MacVim itself. That's the main problem with most of the neovim GUIs—they get opinionated about what a Vim GUI should be. First, foremost, and always, it must be vim in a GUI window. Second, it must have native OS keybindings and integration (clipboard, menu, etc.). Finally, it should be able to have possible extensions that work well with existing plug-ins. (I use Fern for my file tree. I don’t need a built-in file tree that is always visible.) They must, at the core, always be vim. This is why I think that Oni2 was a mistake and why it’s one of the few software packages I regret paying. I don’t want vim motion keys with VSCode extensions. I want a Vim GUI.
- EToS 4y ago
  VIM = OG NVIM = A fully compatible re-write with focus on better scripting (lua), performance etc GUIs = Alternative for using VIM/NVIM inside a terminal, with better optimisation for performance, smooth scrolling, animations etc (e.g MacVim, Neovide etc)
  - stingraycharles 4y ago
    I didn’t know that Neovim was a complete rewrite, thanks for sharing. The fact that I didn’t know while actively using nvim is a testament to the quality of compatibility they deliver.
    - EToS 4y ago
      apologies, yes i believe its a fork
    - lc9er 4y ago
      I don't believe it's a full rewrite. From Neovim's Vision statement: "Neovim is a refactor, and sometimes redactor, in the tradition of Vim (which itself derives from Stevie). It is not a rewrite but a continuation and extension of Vim." https://neovim.io/charter/ https://neovim.io/charter/
  - halostatue 4y ago
    The Neovim hard fork is not fully compatible, nor is it always better performing. I also do not find that Lua is better for scripting overall, because there is an impedance mismatch when you need to interact with the editor model. (If you’re doing just programming then, yes, it’s better. But it’s the interface layer which is difficult, and which I find worse than Vimscript or Vimscript9.) MacVim is a macOS packaged version of Vim with (fairly) light customizations of gvim which is part of the vim source bundle. All neovim GUIs are from-scratch constructions because the neovim developers decided that they did not want to support GUIs directly. IMO, this was a mistake, because none of the neovim GUIs that exist work as well or are as well OS integrated as gvim or make for as "easy" packaging as MacVim has.
    - 4y ago
rjzzleep 4y ago
Is there a conference for everything nowadays? I mean with the digital conference it's not really going to happen, but didn't some companies declare bankruptcy because they kept pouring all their money and effort into conferences?
- azemetre 4y ago
  I like niche conferences, especially more-so if you're part of the group! I've been using vim for my entire career and neovim since around v0.2. One of vim/neovim conferences (forgot which one) I was introduce to one of my favorite plugins: harpoon [1]. I would have never learned about this plugin if it wasn't for these types conferences. [1] https://github.com/ThePrimeagen/harpoon https://github.com/ThePrimeagen/harpoon
  - TymekDev 4y ago
    It is the same conference! They have rebranded this year to Neovim conf [0]. The conference however is not exclusive to Neovim content. [0]: https://www.neovimconf.live/rebranding-rationale https://www.neovimconf.live/rebranding-rationale
    - capableweb 4y ago
      That's confusing to say, at best. If it's called VimConf, I could understand including content from anything vim related, even vi or neovim stuff (or from the other forks/variations/bases). But if it's called NeovimConf, I wouldn't expect that to include the entire Vi ecosystem.
      - ehutch79 4y ago
        According to the FAQs they rebranded because all the traditional vim people complained about too much neovim content. Apparently the neovim people are more chill about it.
        rhaway84773 4y ago
EToS 4y ago
Wow, its in 2 hours.. that's Blazingly fast
- n0ot 4y ago
  That's what happens when you use coconut oil
  - burritas 4y ago
    I see you've been around the block a few times
    - fold_left 4y ago
      The name...
tw1984 4y ago
- w0m 4y ago
  Anything that has enough users interested to watch :)
adamsmith143 4y ago
Real coders still program with punch-cards, you kids with your fancy text editors are spoiled.
- greggarious 4y ago
  I know where you can get some if you're Jones-ing for a fix, but it's ambiguous if I can give them to you since no one showed me the will.
- burritas 4y ago
  I get a chuckle out of people looking for an outlet for their device while I'm carefree with my Port-a-Punch.
- rhaway84773 4y ago
  Real programmers program on…the best tools for what they’re trying to do. And for many it’s VIM or EMacs which have stood the test of time for decades without offering any less functionality than any modern editor.
  - nucleogenesis 4y ago
    No. I have been programming for upwards of 8 years and I can tell you with absolute certainty that real coders use punch cards.
casey2 4y ago
sam conf 20xx
MrMan 4y ago
Neovim really taking off you love to see it. I am really enjoying it for programming.
- hwayne 4y ago
  Yeah, being able to write my vim scripts in lua has been a gamechanger for me.
justinhj 4y ago
Nice to see this trending up the page today. Neovim has a great active community and is a very fun application to use and work on.
goodpoint 4y ago
- capableweb 4y ago
  Besides CCC, I'm not sure what kind of infrastructure you could use, if you expect (lets say) 1000+ viewers from around the world. Running it yourself would be a lot, and you'd have to reach out to CCC way before in order to set things up with them to ensure good service. What alternative are you suggesting here?
  - BeetleB 4y ago
    The EmacsConf folks managed to do it.
    - azangru 4y ago
      Were they streaming real-time? I could only find that they are hosting their videos on https://media.emacsconf.org https://media.emacsconf.org (would be interested to know who the host is and how much it costs to host videos in this way).
      - capableweb 4y ago
        Hosting videos is trivial, especially for a relatively low-traffic event like this. Getting a dedicated host with unlimited traffic (like what Hetzner offers), you usually get a 1G uplink or better, should be able to host it no problem. Under 100 USD/month should be doable.
        hwayne 4y ago
        Right now there's 1,400 streamers.
        capableweb 4y ago
        I assumed parents second question was about hosting videos for download, not hosting live streaming.
badosu 4y ago
I wonder if someone tried reaching out to tpope? I think that guys influence on the vim ecosystem is understated.
- recuter 4y ago
  I recognize that sequence of characters.
- jhvkjhk 4y ago
  It seems he doesn't like neovim: https://twitter.com/tpope/status/1511481584674873346 https://twitter.com/tpope/status/1511481584674873346
  - RMPR 4y ago
    Still using it though https://twitter.com/tpope/status/1453620225153409026 https://twitter.com/tpope/status/1453620225153409026
  - capableweb 4y ago
    I think that's a joke, reads like one at least. I think even if you're in a "tribe" like that, you can recognize the cult-like environment. Many Clojure followers would acknowledge the community can sometimes be like a cult. Same thing for Rust and a bunch of other languages. Doesn't mean we don't like it :)
Emigre_ 4y ago
Cool! NeoVim rules
pkkm 4y ago
I'm happy to see that Neovim is still going strong. Most promising text editor projects (xi, oni2, ...) seem to stall after 1-4 years, so this is a pleasant surprise. To be honest, I wish that the Neovim devs had forked Emacs instead of Vim but oh well, can't have everything.

Neovim Conf 2022

189 points by davidkunz 4y ago

Is neovim what was MacVim or are those two separate things? Nice photo for the keynote speaker BTW - very cyberpunk -- thanks for the help keeping emacs down ;-)

davidkunz 4y ago
Neovim is a continuation of Vim, you can find more info here: https://neovim.io/charter/ https://neovim.io/charter/ Edit: This doesn't mean Vim is discontinued.
- halostatue 4y ago
  s/continuation/hard fork/ Neovim is a hard fork, not a continuation. Vim is still being developed by Bram and other contributors, and has a lot of the same functionality now with different API surfaces. Questionable choices by both development groups (but, IMO, mostly from the initial arrogance of the neovim developers) are increasing the gap to the point where, in a couple of years, I do not expect there to be meaningful compatibility between them. A lot of people don’t like Vimscript, but I personally find the Lua integrations which neovim has to be harder to use because the language isn’t built around the editor, it requires bridging, and there’s a definite impedance mismatch involved. For me, without an equivalent of `gvim`/`MacVim`, neovim is a non-starter. The OS-level integration is important, and none of the various neovim GUIs that exist are nearly as good as the original `gvim` for X or Windows or MacVim for macOS.
  - israrkhan 4y ago
    I find lots of arguments about who was actually more arrogant. But lets look at it from objective perspective. Looking at neovim[1] vs vim[2] contribution Bram is top contributor for vim. 16,211 commit right now. Second top most contributor has 194 commits only. Neovim top contributor has 2285 commits, followed by 21,66 commits for second. It looks to me that neovim is more open to community contribution. Then look at commit graph over period of time. It looks like Neovim is more actively developed. There development activity level around vim also increased in 2016. Perhaps that was the time when bram realized that he need to do more with vim, to compete with neovim. I myself was a longtime vim user, who switched to neovim 2 years ago, and am happy with it. [1] https://github.com/vim/vim/graphs/contributors https://github.com/vim/vim/graphs/contributors [2] https://github.com/vim/vim/graphs/contributors https://github.com/vim/vim/graphs/contributors
  - kurtreed 4y ago
    What did you find arrogant about the neovim developers?
    - halostatue 4y ago
      Pretty much everything, including the ongoing lie that Neovim is a "continuation" of Vim. I replied in a different comment (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33922783 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33922783) about the async patches, which is where the whole things started. Because the patches weren’t accepted as is, they hard forked. That requires an incredible amount of arrogance. Neovim is not better than Vim. It is (increasingly) different. They have made different choices, some of which are interesting, some of which are baffling, and most of which are just different, although I consider the removal of GUI support to be about as arrogant as the gemini protocol stuff. There is a pernicious strain of software developer that thinks that they know better on everything and that GUIs are bad. I felt that way in 1992 or so, despite having been exposed in 1990 to X, because it was easy to pick on Windows 3.1 and (then) Mac users. I got over it because there are things which are better, easier, and faster with GUIs than without. Not everything needs a GUI, but if you want people to use your software, leaving it in the terminal is unlikely to be a long-term success strategy.
      - soperj 4y ago
        > Because the patches weren’t accepted as is, they hard forked. They weren't accepted for years, and if you're being honest, they never were going to be accepted. I'm guessing you thought Bram was also arrogant for forking vi?
        halostatue 4y ago
        You’re right. They weren’t going to be accepted, because they didn’t work the way that Bram thought they should and the people who pushed them would not change them to fit Bram’s goals. As package maintainer myself, if I get a PR/patchset the implements something in a way with which I disagree, I will not accept the changes. If I don’t care enough about the changes, then I probably won’t implement them either. Or I might do so later when I have time. On the history of things, please be more precise. Bram did not fork vi. He worked from the Stevie code, which only ran on the Atari ST, so that he could use it on Amiga. It quickly expanded to other systems (I believe I encountered it after trying other DOS-based vi-like editors). That expansion eventually made it into the relative juggernaut it is today.
  - shmerl 4y ago
    I'm glad for neovim addressing issues that vim ignored for years. The fact that vim picked some of those features is competitive pressure.
  - sodapopcan 4y ago
    Hard agree on lua v. viml. Viml really isn't that bad. I'm certainly not claiming it doesn't have its warts and shouldn't keep improving, but it's a DSL for a text editor... And as you point out, you still need to know a bunch of viml that you have to wrap in Lua calls. At the same time, I haven't actually given vim scripting in Lua a fair shot, so I'd be happy if anyone could shed some light on why they might think it's better.
  - wirrbel 4y ago
    > but, IMO, mostly from the initial arrogance of the neovim developers Vim really was in a sad state prior to the fork which turned out to be a wake up call to Bram it seems.
- microsoftdoes 4y ago
  “Continuation” is a nasty lie when the original is by no means discontinued or dormant.
  - israrkhan 4y ago
    If you look at vim commit history, it was pretty much stagnant for a long period of time, and then activity picked up in 2016, when it finally got competition from neovim. IMO governance model for vim, is not much receptive to community contribution, while neovim is more open. Looking at commit history and contributors graph on github seems to validate this.
  - turndown 4y ago
    You’re right, at one point nvim was a continuation, but no more. For example nvim significantly cleaned up and reorganized and rewrote vim’s C code, they added complex new features like Lua config, floating windows, better plugin support. Vim copied many features they released independently… maybe vim is the continuation here now? I think one of my favorite things about vim the continuation is that after sitting on a terrible config language for >2 decades somehow when nvim released Lua support all of the sudden vim was working on a new incompatible version of vimscript.
    - halostatue 4y ago
      This is also a sanitized version of the truth. Neovim was never a continuation. Bram has never stopped developing Vim. As I understand it, the people behind Neovim developed some async patches which were not accepted by Bram for various reasons, and there was an ongoing discussion. Rather than reworking them to something that Bram thought was acceptable, they performed a hard fork. In the process of hard forking, they removed everything that they considered unimportant. This included gvim, support for older OSes, etc. Vim has not, to the best of my knowledge, copied any features back from neovim, although it does now (shortly after Neovim forked) have async features (written with an API and user surface that Bram prefers) and various other features that may be similar. Please note that Vim has had Lua, Ruby, Python, Perl, and other scripting language support for a very long time. The main difference is that rather than being compiled as an add-on and using bridging, neovim has added a Lua engine into the core (increasing complexity that way) and creating a DX-poor bridge for common vim configuration things so that startup scripts can be written in Lua. Yes, Bram started working on Vimscript9 late, but your characterization of the history also is (unintentionally?) dishonest in that Vimscript has had extensive expansion and updates through time. Neovim is not and has never been a continuation of the Vim project, despite their press. It has always been a hard fork that is getting increasingly incompatible with the source project, and I personally find it less usable than Vim because there’s not a single good GUI for it (there are several which may eventually become promising, and there are several which have taken bizarre directions like Oni2 did).
mikestew 4y ago
To directly answer your question, MacVim is a GUI wrapper around plain ol' vim. AFAICT, MacVim has no relation to neovim.
- ARandomerDude 4y ago
  Great comment, I’ll add there’s a MacVim-like GUI wrapper but for Neovim called VimR that i really like. https://github.com/qvacua/vimr https://github.com/qvacua/vimr
  - predmijat 4y ago
    There's also Neovide which is written in Rust, which makes it, well, blazingly fast. https://github.com/neovide/neovide https://github.com/neovide/neovide
    - halostatue 4y ago
      Neovide is fast, but does not have any macOS-level integration. While it’s nice that it’s not electron like so many other neovim GUIs, it does not work well on macOS.
      - greggarious 4y ago
        Ugh, no offense but I'll skip neovide then -- I hate stuff that does the crap GIMP does where it doesn't blend in with the rest of macOS
  - halostatue 4y ago
    Can't stand it, myself. Of the various Neovim macOS UIs, this is the one that is perhaps closest to MacVim, but the UI choices about having the drawers present all the time and other pieces make it both less reliable and less usable than MacVim itself. That's the main problem with most of the neovim GUIs—they get opinionated about what a Vim GUI should be. First, foremost, and always, it must be vim in a GUI window. Second, it must have native OS keybindings and integration (clipboard, menu, etc.). Finally, it should be able to have possible extensions that work well with existing plug-ins. (I use Fern for my file tree. I don’t need a built-in file tree that is always visible.) They must, at the core, always be vim. This is why I think that Oni2 was a mistake and why it’s one of the few software packages I regret paying. I don’t want vim motion keys with VSCode extensions. I want a Vim GUI.
EToS 4y ago
VIM = OG NVIM = A fully compatible re-write with focus on better scripting (lua), performance etc GUIs = Alternative for using VIM/NVIM inside a terminal, with better optimisation for performance, smooth scrolling, animations etc (e.g MacVim, Neovide etc)
- stingraycharles 4y ago
  I didn’t know that Neovim was a complete rewrite, thanks for sharing. The fact that I didn’t know while actively using nvim is a testament to the quality of compatibility they deliver.
  - EToS 4y ago
    apologies, yes i believe its a fork
  - lc9er 4y ago
    I don't believe it's a full rewrite. From Neovim's Vision statement: "Neovim is a refactor, and sometimes redactor, in the tradition of Vim (which itself derives from Stevie). It is not a rewrite but a continuation and extension of Vim." https://neovim.io/charter/ https://neovim.io/charter/
- halostatue 4y ago
  The Neovim hard fork is not fully compatible, nor is it always better performing. I also do not find that Lua is better for scripting overall, because there is an impedance mismatch when you need to interact with the editor model. (If you’re doing just programming then, yes, it’s better. But it’s the interface layer which is difficult, and which I find worse than Vimscript or Vimscript9.) MacVim is a macOS packaged version of Vim with (fairly) light customizations of gvim which is part of the vim source bundle. All neovim GUIs are from-scratch constructions because the neovim developers decided that they did not want to support GUIs directly. IMO, this was a mistake, because none of the neovim GUIs that exist work as well or are as well OS integrated as gvim or make for as "easy" packaging as MacVim has.
  - 4y ago

rjzzleep 4y ago

Is there a conference for everything nowadays? I mean with the digital conference it's not really going to happen, but didn't some companies declare bankruptcy because they kept pouring all their money and effort into conferences?

azemetre 4y ago
I like niche conferences, especially more-so if you're part of the group! I've been using vim for my entire career and neovim since around v0.2. One of vim/neovim conferences (forgot which one) I was introduce to one of my favorite plugins: harpoon [1]. I would have never learned about this plugin if it wasn't for these types conferences. [1] https://github.com/ThePrimeagen/harpoon https://github.com/ThePrimeagen/harpoon
- TymekDev 4y ago
  It is the same conference! They have rebranded this year to Neovim conf [0]. The conference however is not exclusive to Neovim content. [0]: https://www.neovimconf.live/rebranding-rationale https://www.neovimconf.live/rebranding-rationale
  - capableweb 4y ago
    That's confusing to say, at best. If it's called VimConf, I could understand including content from anything vim related, even vi or neovim stuff (or from the other forks/variations/bases). But if it's called NeovimConf, I wouldn't expect that to include the entire Vi ecosystem.
    - ehutch79 4y ago
      According to the FAQs they rebranded because all the traditional vim people complained about too much neovim content. Apparently the neovim people are more chill about it.
      - rhaway84773 4y ago

EToS 4y ago

Wow, its in 2 hours.. that's Blazingly fast

n0ot 4y ago
That's what happens when you use coconut oil
- burritas 4y ago
  I see you've been around the block a few times
  - fold_left 4y ago
    The name...

tw1984 4y ago

w0m 4y ago
Anything that has enough users interested to watch :)

adamsmith143 4y ago

Real coders still program with punch-cards, you kids with your fancy text editors are spoiled.

greggarious 4y ago
I know where you can get some if you're Jones-ing for a fix, but it's ambiguous if I can give them to you since no one showed me the will.
burritas 4y ago
I get a chuckle out of people looking for an outlet for their device while I'm carefree with my Port-a-Punch.
rhaway84773 4y ago
Real programmers program on…the best tools for what they’re trying to do. And for many it’s VIM or EMacs which have stood the test of time for decades without offering any less functionality than any modern editor.
- nucleogenesis 4y ago
  No. I have been programming for upwards of 8 years and I can tell you with absolute certainty that real coders use punch cards.

casey2 4y ago

sam conf 20xx

MrMan 4y ago

Neovim really taking off you love to see it. I am really enjoying it for programming.

hwayne 4y ago
Yeah, being able to write my vim scripts in lua has been a gamechanger for me.

justinhj 4y ago

Nice to see this trending up the page today. Neovim has a great active community and is a very fun application to use and work on.

goodpoint 4y ago

capableweb 4y ago
Besides CCC, I'm not sure what kind of infrastructure you could use, if you expect (lets say) 1000+ viewers from around the world. Running it yourself would be a lot, and you'd have to reach out to CCC way before in order to set things up with them to ensure good service. What alternative are you suggesting here?
- BeetleB 4y ago
  The EmacsConf folks managed to do it.
  - azangru 4y ago
    Were they streaming real-time? I could only find that they are hosting their videos on https://media.emacsconf.org https://media.emacsconf.org (would be interested to know who the host is and how much it costs to host videos in this way).
    - capableweb 4y ago
      Hosting videos is trivial, especially for a relatively low-traffic event like this. Getting a dedicated host with unlimited traffic (like what Hetzner offers), you usually get a 1G uplink or better, should be able to host it no problem. Under 100 USD/month should be doable.
      - hwayne 4y ago
        Right now there's 1,400 streamers.
        capableweb 4y ago
        I assumed parents second question was about hosting videos for download, not hosting live streaming.

badosu 4y ago

I wonder if someone tried reaching out to tpope? I think that guys influence on the vim ecosystem is understated.

recuter 4y ago
I recognize that sequence of characters.
jhvkjhk 4y ago
It seems he doesn't like neovim: https://twitter.com/tpope/status/1511481584674873346 https://twitter.com/tpope/status/1511481584674873346
- RMPR 4y ago
  Still using it though https://twitter.com/tpope/status/1453620225153409026 https://twitter.com/tpope/status/1453620225153409026
- capableweb 4y ago
  I think that's a joke, reads like one at least. I think even if you're in a "tribe" like that, you can recognize the cult-like environment. Many Clojure followers would acknowledge the community can sometimes be like a cult. Same thing for Rust and a bunch of other languages. Doesn't mean we don't like it :)

Emigre_ 4y ago

Cool! NeoVim rules

pkkm 4y ago

I'm happy to see that Neovim is still going strong. Most promising text editor projects (xi, oni2, ...) seem to stall after 1-4 years, so this is a pleasant surprise. To be honest, I wish that the Neovim devs had forked Emacs instead of Vim but oh well, can't have everything.