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Linux developers have created dependencies on Linux. Portability is a lot of work and perfect portability does not exist. If you think you don't want systemd,

Linux developers have created dependencies on Linux. Portability is a lot of work and perfect portability does not exist. If you think you don't want systemd, why don't you use BSD?

dijit 4y ago
> Linux developers have created dependencies on Linux. Sorry, ignoring the rest of the thread: this statement isn't true even marginally. There are linux distributions that can operate on other kernels than Linux. Debian was my favourite choice for this with their HURD (https://www.debian.org/ports/hurd/ https://www.debian.org/ports/hurd/) and kFreeBSD (https://www.debian.org/ports/kfreebsd-gnu/ https://www.debian.org/ports/kfreebsd-gnu/) implementation. The GNU userland itself does not depend on Linux either. You can run GNU utilities on MacOS, FreeBSD, OpenBSD.
- flumpcakes 4y ago
  > There are linux distributions that can operate on other kernels than Linux. Then by definition they're not specifically a Linux distribution?
  - dijit 4y ago
    Richard Stallman agrees with you. I’m happy to take a different name, but Wikipedia at least refers to it this way. Debian themselves say that they’re an operating system. Regardless; many (if not most, if not close to all) utilities developed on top of Linux are portable across not only distributions, but other kernels or even operating systems. It’s not fair to say that “those people who develop on systems with Linux kernels only support linux”.
karteum 4y ago
There are cases where you might want to use Linux (for the hardware support, or for the userland) but without systemd: e.g. if you want to use musl libc, Lennard has said clearly he won't fix the incompatibility https://www.mail-archive.com/systemd-devel@lists.freedesktop.org/msg23523.html https://www.mail-archive.com/systemd-devel@lists.freedesktop... "we will rely on good APIs exposed in the generally accepted Linux API which is the one glibc exposes" (i.e. he won't integrate any required patch to make systemd work without glibc's nonstandard behaviors, and musl doesn't aim for a bug-for-bug compatibility with glibc).
- rahen 4y ago
  Lennard now works for Microsoft anyway. It clearly suits him better.
Koshkin 4y ago
Because systemd is not the reason why people choose to use Linux over a BSD.

Linux developers have created dependencies on Linux. Portability is a lot of work and perfect portability does not exist. If you think you don't want systemd, why don't you use BSD?

dijit 4y ago

> Linux developers have created dependencies on Linux. Sorry, ignoring the rest of the thread: this statement isn't true even marginally. There are linux distributions that can operate on other kernels than Linux. Debian was my favourite choice for this with their HURD (https://www.debian.org/ports/hurd/ https://www.debian.org/ports/hurd/) and kFreeBSD (https://www.debian.org/ports/kfreebsd-gnu/ https://www.debian.org/ports/kfreebsd-gnu/) implementation. The GNU userland itself does not depend on Linux either. You can run GNU utilities on MacOS, FreeBSD, OpenBSD.

flumpcakes 4y ago
> There are linux distributions that can operate on other kernels than Linux. Then by definition they're not specifically a Linux distribution?
- dijit 4y ago
  Richard Stallman agrees with you. I’m happy to take a different name, but Wikipedia at least refers to it this way. Debian themselves say that they’re an operating system. Regardless; many (if not most, if not close to all) utilities developed on top of Linux are portable across not only distributions, but other kernels or even operating systems. It’s not fair to say that “those people who develop on systems with Linux kernels only support linux”.

karteum 4y ago

There are cases where you might want to use Linux (for the hardware support, or for the userland) but without systemd: e.g. if you want to use musl libc, Lennard has said clearly he won't fix the incompatibility https://www.mail-archive.com/systemd-devel@lists.freedesktop.org/msg23523.html https://www.mail-archive.com/systemd-devel@lists.freedesktop... "we will rely on good APIs exposed in the generally accepted Linux API which is the one glibc exposes" (i.e. he won't integrate any required patch to make systemd work without glibc's nonstandard behaviors, and musl doesn't aim for a bug-for-bug compatibility with glibc).

rahen 4y ago
Lennard now works for Microsoft anyway. It clearly suits him better.

Koshkin 4y ago

Because systemd is not the reason why people choose to use Linux over a BSD.