6 ms·

It is becoming increasingly difficult to not just recommend an iPhone to the average person with privacy/security concerns. Sure, you can tell them to go the Gr

by dopu 4y ago

It is becoming increasingly difficult to not just recommend an iPhone to the average person with privacy/security concerns. Sure, you can tell them to go the GrapheneOS route, but I don't think you can trust the average user not to just go and install Google Maps/Google Photos/etc as soon as the alternative FOSS option inconveniences them. I've certainly struggled with this. Then they're arguably worse off than if they'd just stuck with the Apple equivalents.

therealmarv 4y ago
The marketing is strong with Apple.
- hackmiester 4y ago
  Also the products, though.
- DrBenCarson 4y ago
  If by marketing you mean product development and putting their money where their mouth is, yeah, it's pretty strong. There isn't another mainstream product that offers that.
  - therealmarv 4y ago
    People seem to forget fast (this is only 2 weeks ago) https://gizmodo.com/apple-iphone-privacy-dsid-analytics-personal-data-test-1849807619 https://gizmodo.com/apple-iphone-privacy-dsid-analytics-pers...
    - faet 4y ago
      This was tied to an action in the App Store. Not sure how you purchase apps without tying it to your Apple ID. It is also laid out in the ToS "We use information about your browsing, purchases, searches, and downloads. These records are stored with IP address, a random unique identifier (where that arises), and Apple ID" No one (or even the author) has been able to replicate it or find the Apple ID in any other logs calls.
pixl97 4y ago
Apple produces a very nice set of golden handcuffs. Polished shiny look, comfortable fur lining. Customers are really going to going to scream bloody murder when Apple latches them down tight. The problem here is we are wholly dependant on Apples goodwill. It is not required in anyway (hence Googles behavior). At any moment Apple can revoke said goodwill and exploit us to our hearts content and we will have no fallback what so ever because we decided to let the market codify our freedoms rather than preventing companies from being ruthless.
- MagicMoonlight 4y ago
  >Because in theory Apple could go completely against their own philosophy and our decades of prior experience with them, you should instead give all your information to Google so that they can sell it Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
  - smoldesu 4y ago
    Apple's own philosophy? The one they pay to put in advertisements, or the one Edward Snowden leaked to us?
- Terretta 4y ago
  Let's assume they do eventually flip their brand on its head and turn on the users. While waiting for them to latch you down tight, you could have already been enjoying the most consumer-centric and privacy-conscious mainstream mobile OS since 2007.
  - andybee 4y ago
  - pixl97 4y ago
    "I am in a benevolent dictatorship, nothing ever could go wrong" Just because Apple is playing nice at the moment, there is no reason not to force them, and all the other players to have a legal requirement of playing nice. I mean, the hog that is fattened for slaughter thinks its life is great, right up until its not.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
RjQoLCOSwiIKfpm 4y ago
Their software is NOT open source (well, some parts are, but AFAIK it's a minority). Thus the privacy claims are just advertisement, there is no way to verify them. Apple devices might as well be fully backdoored.
- madeofpalk 4y ago
  Apart from some very niche options, so is everything else. This is about trust. If you don't trust the manufacturer of your hardware (or developers of software), that puts you down a very specific path of what you can happily purchase.
HL33tibCe7 4y ago
I’m a FOSS person and run Linux as a daily driver. But I recommend every single person who asks to just buy an iPhone or a Mac (if they can afford it). The user experience alone is so superior to the other options. Security and privacy too, these days.
Pr0ject217 4y ago
> Sure, you can tell them to go the GrapheneOS route, but I don't think you can trust the average user not to just go and install Google Maps/Google Photos/etc as soon as the alternative FOSS option inconveniences them Isn't it fine to install Google Maps, etc, in a separate profile, inside GrapheneOS?

by dopu 4y ago

therealmarv 4y ago

The marketing is strong with Apple.

hackmiester 4y ago
Also the products, though.
DrBenCarson 4y ago
If by marketing you mean product development and putting their money where their mouth is, yeah, it's pretty strong. There isn't another mainstream product that offers that.
- therealmarv 4y ago
  People seem to forget fast (this is only 2 weeks ago) https://gizmodo.com/apple-iphone-privacy-dsid-analytics-personal-data-test-1849807619 https://gizmodo.com/apple-iphone-privacy-dsid-analytics-pers...
  - faet 4y ago
    This was tied to an action in the App Store. Not sure how you purchase apps without tying it to your Apple ID. It is also laid out in the ToS "We use information about your browsing, purchases, searches, and downloads. These records are stored with IP address, a random unique identifier (where that arises), and Apple ID" No one (or even the author) has been able to replicate it or find the Apple ID in any other logs calls.

pixl97 4y ago

Apple produces a very nice set of golden handcuffs. Polished shiny look, comfortable fur lining. Customers are really going to going to scream bloody murder when Apple latches them down tight. The problem here is we are wholly dependant on Apples goodwill. It is not required in anyway (hence Googles behavior). At any moment Apple can revoke said goodwill and exploit us to our hearts content and we will have no fallback what so ever because we decided to let the market codify our freedoms rather than preventing companies from being ruthless.

MagicMoonlight 4y ago
>Because in theory Apple could go completely against their own philosophy and our decades of prior experience with them, you should instead give all your information to Google so that they can sell it Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
- smoldesu 4y ago
  Apple's own philosophy? The one they pay to put in advertisements, or the one Edward Snowden leaked to us?
Terretta 4y ago
Let's assume they do eventually flip their brand on its head and turn on the users. While waiting for them to latch you down tight, you could have already been enjoying the most consumer-centric and privacy-conscious mainstream mobile OS since 2007.
- andybee 4y ago
- pixl97 4y ago
  "I am in a benevolent dictatorship, nothing ever could go wrong" Just because Apple is playing nice at the moment, there is no reason not to force them, and all the other players to have a legal requirement of playing nice. I mean, the hog that is fattened for slaughter thinks its life is great, right up until its not.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

RjQoLCOSwiIKfpm 4y ago

Their software is NOT open source (well, some parts are, but AFAIK it's a minority). Thus the privacy claims are just advertisement, there is no way to verify them. Apple devices might as well be fully backdoored.

madeofpalk 4y ago
Apart from some very niche options, so is everything else. This is about trust. If you don't trust the manufacturer of your hardware (or developers of software), that puts you down a very specific path of what you can happily purchase.

HL33tibCe7 4y ago

I’m a FOSS person and run Linux as a daily driver. But I recommend every single person who asks to just buy an iPhone or a Mac (if they can afford it). The user experience alone is so superior to the other options. Security and privacy too, these days.

Pr0ject217 4y ago

> Sure, you can tell them to go the GrapheneOS route, but I don't think you can trust the average user not to just go and install Google Maps/Google Photos/etc as soon as the alternative FOSS option inconveniences them Isn't it fine to install Google Maps, etc, in a separate profile, inside GrapheneOS?