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I've got to think a utilitarian culture would say something like "huh, maybe we should build homes that are easily served by transit." But American culture is m

I've got to think a utilitarian culture would say something like "huh, maybe we should build homes that are easily served by transit." But American culture is much more strongly opposed to this than most those in most other countries.

kodyo 4y ago
One thing you notice if you've been in an airplane is that there's a lot of room to spread out if people want to.
- renewiltord 4y ago
  As they should, but a thing that needs planning maps and isn't visible from an airplane is that those who don't want to spread out can't not spread out. So the freedom is one-way. Example: almost all of SF bans building apartments
- actionablefiber 4y ago
  And then those people will want things like “electricity” and “a network of wide paved roads” and “Internet” and “drinking water” and “sewage” and “timely package delivery to their front door” and “big box stores with parking lots the size of two city blocks” - and those things at that density have absolutely terrible unit economics and environmental externalities. I frequently see people complain about how traffic is so bad, gas prices are so high, their local drivers are insane, and how dare they have to pay tolls and parking fees. Wow, I wish there were some form of spatial displacement that didn’t involve any of that!
  - bombcar 4y ago
    Heh everything you mention there is available in thousands upon thousands of small towns across the US - basically anywhere there's a Walmart that isn't a city.
    - actionablefiber 4y ago
      Yes, and those have terrible unit economics and environmental externalities! We should not be looking at the unsettled land in between as an opportunity to stretch ourselves even thinner!
- Schroedingersat 4y ago
  If you want to spread out you can do it without robbing the people who didn't to pay for your roads and utilities, and then banning them from building mid rise or transit.
- moloch-hai 4y ago
  What people want is of far less moment than what real-estate agents, collectively, want. They drive local government and planning almost everywhere in the US, to the exclusion of almost everyone else.

kodyo 4y ago

One thing you notice if you've been in an airplane is that there's a lot of room to spread out if people want to.

renewiltord 4y ago
As they should, but a thing that needs planning maps and isn't visible from an airplane is that those who don't want to spread out can't not spread out. So the freedom is one-way. Example: almost all of SF bans building apartments
actionablefiber 4y ago
And then those people will want things like “electricity” and “a network of wide paved roads” and “Internet” and “drinking water” and “sewage” and “timely package delivery to their front door” and “big box stores with parking lots the size of two city blocks” - and those things at that density have absolutely terrible unit economics and environmental externalities. I frequently see people complain about how traffic is so bad, gas prices are so high, their local drivers are insane, and how dare they have to pay tolls and parking fees. Wow, I wish there were some form of spatial displacement that didn’t involve any of that!
- bombcar 4y ago
  Heh everything you mention there is available in thousands upon thousands of small towns across the US - basically anywhere there's a Walmart that isn't a city.
  - actionablefiber 4y ago
    Yes, and those have terrible unit economics and environmental externalities! We should not be looking at the unsettled land in between as an opportunity to stretch ourselves even thinner!
Schroedingersat 4y ago
If you want to spread out you can do it without robbing the people who didn't to pay for your roads and utilities, and then banning them from building mid rise or transit.
moloch-hai 4y ago
What people want is of far less moment than what real-estate agents, collectively, want. They drive local government and planning almost everywhere in the US, to the exclusion of almost everyone else.