4 ms·
Externalities are the thing that get you, and I think are what the article is obliquely getting at with that phrasing (and the "amid concern about the state of
by TheDong 4y ago
Externalities are the thing that get you, and I think are what the article is obliquely getting at with that phrasing (and the "amid concern about the state of fish stocks" later).
Each poacher who kills an african elephant for the ivory is paid handsomely, and individually it perhaps makes sense to them, but it's illegal because the externality is that the african elephant would go extinct if we treated this purely as a market where "if someone will pay for ivory, that justifies it".
The health of the planet is usually not able to be factored into market economics.
Laws intervene, but ideally we would recognize the externalities and adjust our behavior _before_ laws come into play. We shouldn't have to wait on the law to limit carbon emissions to recognize that destroying the planet, even if it gives us more dollars in our lifetime, is a move that does not make sense for humanity as a whole.
I think the framing of the article is that this inefficient use of resources makes less sense from an externalities perspective, and you're saying that it makes perfect sense from an economic perspective.
- xboxnolifes 4y agoWhat are the externalities in this lobster example? It looks less like externalities to me, and more that people would rather pay $X for a pound of lobster than <$X for 2 pounds of lobster bait. This is unlike the ivory example, where the externality is an entire species going extinct.
- paulryanrogers 4y agoDriving the bait extinct
- AlbertCory 4y agoDo you have any evidence for that? Because [1] says that mackerel are of "least concern." > Despite its highly commercial status, the Atlantic mackerel is listed as Least Concern by the International Union for Conservation of Nature (IUCN) and global catch has remained sustainable. Now, for herring: [2]'s most recent date was 2010. However, Google says: "Is herring being overfished? Image result for are herring going extinct Population Status. According to the 2022 stock assessment, Atlantic herring is overfished, but not subject to overfishing. Summary stock assessment information can be found on Stock SMART. Herring populations are naturally highly variable." [3] says "U.S. wild-caught Atlantic herring is a smart seafood choice because it is sustainably managed and responsibly harvested under U.S. regulations." [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_mackerel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_mackerel [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_herring https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_herring [3] https://www.fisheries.noaa.gov/species/atlantic-herring https://www.fisheries.noaa.gov/species/atlantic-herring
- barbazoo 4y agoWith all due respect, did you read the article?
- AlbertCory 4y agoAs a matter of fact, yes. Did you read the comment this was a response to? But OK, I went back and reread it. I found one unsupported statement: "But Atlantic mackerel and some populations of Atlantic herring have dropped to a fraction of their former levels. Many stocks are now in the critical zone—meaning that serious harm is likely occurring to the stock—and in some cases, have been that way for decades." And yet, I cited some authoritative data from agencies that are in a position to know. Those agencies say the species are not endangered. So I think it's your move.
- AlbertCory 4y agoNote that I did not say it was all a matter of economics. I'd love to see the ivory trade and rhino horn trade stamped out. I explicitly said regulations might be appropriate, and since fishing is already heavily regulated, it needn't require a revolution in consciousness to extend it to baitfish.