3 ms·

Tbh I thought David Lynchs Dune captured the oddity of the universe, the cruelty of the universe, and did it's own stuff as well. I know not everyone likes it,

Tbh I thought David Lynchs Dune captured the oddity of the universe, the cruelty of the universe, and did it's own stuff as well. I know not everyone likes it, but I think it has it's place, especially in the context of all his other movies and tv shows.

at_a_remove 4y ago
I strongly agree with you. Dune is weird, insular, looped back on itself, and has had thousands of years to do so. They've switched from one "sin" (making a machine in the likeness of the human mind) to another (thou shalt not deform the soul, by the creation of ultraspecialized humans such as Mentats). It's a nasty, paranoid place (the voice-overs helped with that), wherein you constantly had to think about how others would think, and on. The Weirding Way is essentially something that cannot be filmed (you would have to invent a martial art that looked unique, spectacular on screen, and was somehow wildly effective), and so it became the Weirding Modules, and that worked, too. Herbert like the "third stage" Guild Navigator idea so much he incorporated it into his later works. This later effort left me cold.
- Apocryphon 4y ago
  I found the new Dune to be solid but somewhat slavishly faithful, which prevented it from interesting innovations. And the visuals themselves, with the austere grey granite cyclopean edifices, were interesting but nothing we haven't seen before- Ridley Scott's questionable Prometheus really pioneered that art direction for sci-fi. It really could've used a better visual palette and color editing. Also now they're starting to stick Mongolian throat singing everywhere (it shows up a bit in Wakanda Forever) so we only have Dune to blame if it becomes overused.
  - mnky9800n 4y ago
    The new Dune does what villeneuve does in all his films. Like go watch Arrival or Bladerunner 2049, they all have this big sweeping shots, every frame is a painting. Villeneuve sees films as a way to capture the visual feeling of something being bigger then you. All his films do this. In Bladerunner 2049 Villeneuve literally has the hologram girl as a giant hologram that Ryan Gosling's character encounters when he is deciding whether he exists as a person or not. She stands there demonstrating that the world has digitized and moved away from humanity so far that whatever humanness is left is whatever you decide for yourself. The best part of this movie I thought was that then this relationship between Ryan Gosling and the hologram girl becomes the most human relationship in the film. Because they chose it to be that way. Even though neither one is actually human.
    - Apocryphon 4y ago
      Oh, I totally agree. (The austere grandeur also reminds me of Christopher Nolan's work, too). I just think in Dune he's reusing a good amount of his past visual language. Some of the ships look a lot like the Heptapod vessels from Arrival. The part when Arrakeen is on fire reminded me of the fighting in Sicario after the Juarez mob boss is arrested. Wish he had invented more novel elements, and again, more varied use of color. Your points about the giant Joi hologram in 2049 are valid. I wish he had done just a bit more of that. (That scene, with its neon blues and purples, was also distinct from the usually grey Prometheus palette that Dune dipped into too much imo.) Personally I felt a lot of the desert scenes looked a little artificial, maybe it was the color grading or lack of scale. The best desert scene imo is the second sandworm encounter where the rock mouse establishes the scale.
- mnky9800n 4y ago
  The thing the new movie did was capture the cruelty of the haves and havenots and the cheapness of life in Dune. Dune is a universe where a tiny select group of people matter and everyone else exists in their servitude. Not even as people, but as currency. The scene where they murder people to take their blood so that the Sardukur have war paint in the new movie perfectly captures this. They don't even dwell on what they are doing, it's just there in the background. This is a major theme in the book and what the Freemen fight against and live a life that recognizes each life as sacred. They do this by essentially subjecting themselves to a desert environment that actively tries to kill them every second. This visceral experience makes each life precious.
throw0101c 4y ago
> Tbh I thought David Lynchs Dune captured the oddity of the universe What I liked about Lynch's version is hold old everything felt. The Empire was around for a long time and so had become mostly ossified and decadent (which the Golden Path was/is meant to rectify), and you could tell that by the clothes people wore and many of the sets (e.g., the room where the Navigator and Emperor meet). The Sci-Fi miniseries hewed closer to the story, but everything felt too 'shiny' (no doubt due to budget constraints). Villeneuve wasn't as old looking as Lynch, but not as shiny as Sci-fi, but somewhere in the middle. The costumes were also pretty good. I also appreciated Zimmer's 'alien sounding' musical score, and the way it blended in with the sound design many times (the teams ended up working together a lot instead of being strictly siloed like often happens).
romwell 4y ago
>Tbh I thought David Lynchs Dune captured the oddity of the universe, the cruelty of the universe, and did it's own stuff as well. Wait till you hear about Jodorowsky's Dune[1][2], the best film never made. With Pink Floyd doing the soundtrack, H.R. Giger doing the visuals, Jean "Moebius" Geiraud creating the story board, Dan O'Bannon on VFX, and Salvador Dali agreeing to play the Emperor, you'd get a lot to say about the oddity and cruelty of that universe. ...had anyone had the guts to actually fund Jodorowsky on that one. Alas, after assembling the all-star team, doing the pre-production, securing the rights, and being ready to go, he simply didn't get the funding to implement his vision. Giger, who hasn't been involved with film till that point, went on to make Alien with O'Bannon; and the project - despite never been made! - has influenced all subsequent space sagas. The documentary about it[3] is fascinating. [1]https://www.jodorowskysdune.com/ https://www.jodorowskysdune.com/ [2]https://www.openculture.com/2016/10/14-hour-epic-film-dune-that-alejandro-jodorowsky-never-made.html https://www.openculture.com/2016/10/14-hour-epic-film-dune-t... [3]https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1935156/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1935156/
- mnky9800n 4y ago
  I am anti-jodorowsky because he raped a woman, talked about how it was super important to the artistic integrity of the movie, then when people started having problems with that kind of thing, said he was just saying all that stuff to get the movie noticed because hollywood hates mexican cinema. so i don't really mourn that he didn't get to make a dune movie.
  - Apocryphon 4y ago
    That's really terrible. Now I'm wondering what '70s director would have been a good fit to replace him, while preserving the all-star cast of Welles, Jagger, Dali, etc. The comedy option would be if George Lucas tried psychedelics and took the gig instead of making Star Wars.
    - romwell 4y ago
      See my other comment. TL;DR: we have as much basis to believe he raped anyone as we have to believe thart he literally raped Frank Herbert: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKjpH2qO8XY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKjpH2qO8XY That's to say, nothing aside from some words he said to promote his film, and later retracted.

at_a_remove 4y ago

I strongly agree with you. Dune is weird, insular, looped back on itself, and has had thousands of years to do so. They've switched from one "sin" (making a machine in the likeness of the human mind) to another (thou shalt not deform the soul, by the creation of ultraspecialized humans such as Mentats). It's a nasty, paranoid place (the voice-overs helped with that), wherein you constantly had to think about how others would think, and on. The Weirding Way is essentially something that cannot be filmed (you would have to invent a martial art that looked unique, spectacular on screen, and was somehow wildly effective), and so it became the Weirding Modules, and that worked, too. Herbert like the "third stage" Guild Navigator idea so much he incorporated it into his later works. This later effort left me cold.

Apocryphon 4y ago
I found the new Dune to be solid but somewhat slavishly faithful, which prevented it from interesting innovations. And the visuals themselves, with the austere grey granite cyclopean edifices, were interesting but nothing we haven't seen before- Ridley Scott's questionable Prometheus really pioneered that art direction for sci-fi. It really could've used a better visual palette and color editing. Also now they're starting to stick Mongolian throat singing everywhere (it shows up a bit in Wakanda Forever) so we only have Dune to blame if it becomes overused.
- mnky9800n 4y ago
  The new Dune does what villeneuve does in all his films. Like go watch Arrival or Bladerunner 2049, they all have this big sweeping shots, every frame is a painting. Villeneuve sees films as a way to capture the visual feeling of something being bigger then you. All his films do this. In Bladerunner 2049 Villeneuve literally has the hologram girl as a giant hologram that Ryan Gosling's character encounters when he is deciding whether he exists as a person or not. She stands there demonstrating that the world has digitized and moved away from humanity so far that whatever humanness is left is whatever you decide for yourself. The best part of this movie I thought was that then this relationship between Ryan Gosling and the hologram girl becomes the most human relationship in the film. Because they chose it to be that way. Even though neither one is actually human.
  - Apocryphon 4y ago
    Oh, I totally agree. (The austere grandeur also reminds me of Christopher Nolan's work, too). I just think in Dune he's reusing a good amount of his past visual language. Some of the ships look a lot like the Heptapod vessels from Arrival. The part when Arrakeen is on fire reminded me of the fighting in Sicario after the Juarez mob boss is arrested. Wish he had invented more novel elements, and again, more varied use of color. Your points about the giant Joi hologram in 2049 are valid. I wish he had done just a bit more of that. (That scene, with its neon blues and purples, was also distinct from the usually grey Prometheus palette that Dune dipped into too much imo.) Personally I felt a lot of the desert scenes looked a little artificial, maybe it was the color grading or lack of scale. The best desert scene imo is the second sandworm encounter where the rock mouse establishes the scale.
mnky9800n 4y ago
The thing the new movie did was capture the cruelty of the haves and havenots and the cheapness of life in Dune. Dune is a universe where a tiny select group of people matter and everyone else exists in their servitude. Not even as people, but as currency. The scene where they murder people to take their blood so that the Sardukur have war paint in the new movie perfectly captures this. They don't even dwell on what they are doing, it's just there in the background. This is a major theme in the book and what the Freemen fight against and live a life that recognizes each life as sacred. They do this by essentially subjecting themselves to a desert environment that actively tries to kill them every second. This visceral experience makes each life precious.

throw0101c 4y ago

> Tbh I thought David Lynchs Dune captured the oddity of the universe What I liked about Lynch's version is hold old everything felt. The Empire was around for a long time and so had become mostly ossified and decadent (which the Golden Path was/is meant to rectify), and you could tell that by the clothes people wore and many of the sets (e.g., the room where the Navigator and Emperor meet). The Sci-Fi miniseries hewed closer to the story, but everything felt too 'shiny' (no doubt due to budget constraints). Villeneuve wasn't as old looking as Lynch, but not as shiny as Sci-fi, but somewhere in the middle. The costumes were also pretty good. I also appreciated Zimmer's 'alien sounding' musical score, and the way it blended in with the sound design many times (the teams ended up working together a lot instead of being strictly siloed like often happens).

romwell 4y ago

>Tbh I thought David Lynchs Dune captured the oddity of the universe, the cruelty of the universe, and did it's own stuff as well. Wait till you hear about Jodorowsky's Dune[1][2], the best film never made. With Pink Floyd doing the soundtrack, H.R. Giger doing the visuals, Jean "Moebius" Geiraud creating the story board, Dan O'Bannon on VFX, and Salvador Dali agreeing to play the Emperor, you'd get a lot to say about the oddity and cruelty of that universe. ...had anyone had the guts to actually fund Jodorowsky on that one. Alas, after assembling the all-star team, doing the pre-production, securing the rights, and being ready to go, he simply didn't get the funding to implement his vision. Giger, who hasn't been involved with film till that point, went on to make Alien with O'Bannon; and the project - despite never been made! - has influenced all subsequent space sagas. The documentary about it[3] is fascinating. [1]https://www.jodorowskysdune.com/ https://www.jodorowskysdune.com/ [2]https://www.openculture.com/2016/10/14-hour-epic-film-dune-that-alejandro-jodorowsky-never-made.html https://www.openculture.com/2016/10/14-hour-epic-film-dune-t... [3]https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1935156/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1935156/

mnky9800n 4y ago
I am anti-jodorowsky because he raped a woman, talked about how it was super important to the artistic integrity of the movie, then when people started having problems with that kind of thing, said he was just saying all that stuff to get the movie noticed because hollywood hates mexican cinema. so i don't really mourn that he didn't get to make a dune movie.
- Apocryphon 4y ago
  That's really terrible. Now I'm wondering what '70s director would have been a good fit to replace him, while preserving the all-star cast of Welles, Jagger, Dali, etc. The comedy option would be if George Lucas tried psychedelics and took the gig instead of making Star Wars.
  - romwell 4y ago
    See my other comment. TL;DR: we have as much basis to believe he raped anyone as we have to believe thart he literally raped Frank Herbert: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKjpH2qO8XY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKjpH2qO8XY That's to say, nothing aside from some words he said to promote his film, and later retracted.