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Isn't it totally weird that we long for jobs, instead of the fruits of the jobs? This backwards incentive structure is one of the reasons capitalism works so we

Isn't it totally weird that we long for jobs, instead of the fruits of the jobs? This backwards incentive structure is one of the reasons capitalism works so well - and so badly at the same time. If I cannot work a job anymore, great! But I demand to be able to take part in society, and I demand my share of societal production. This is one of many many cases where new technology clashes with the boundaries of our societal system. There are only three solutions: - Ban the new technology to prop up these jobs - Let the people become "unnecessary" and try to fix it with wellfare, which will cause all kinds of unrest - Embrace the new technology. Find a way to feed all the people who lost their jobs (the food is still being produced, it is just a question of how to distribute it). And find new meaningful activities for them (Remember: wage labor is not neccessarily == meaningful activity.)

kypro 4y ago
You're touching on my primary long-term concern with AI and automation here. One of the issues with the argument that we'll all be able to live great work-free lives on welfare is that AI fundamentally changes the dynamic between labourer and government. Historically the power nations, governments, business and individuals have is really just product of the labourers below them. Or put another way, the US is only as powerful as the total output of its labourers. This means historically the greatest threat to the US government (and governments generally) is unhappy labours - US revolution being the obvious example here. The same is true for companies though, just on a smaller scale. If you're in a position of power, historically your power has depended on ensuring those below you don't revolt. So for that reason historically we have always been able to protest for workers rights, higher wages, welfare, etc. But as soon as our labour is worthless we have very little bargaining power. In fact in the extreme it's possible we might all just become waste of resources and space to those at the top. And this gets even more concerning when you consider how AI could be used to prevent protests or to financially punish those involved in them. It seems to me wherever we like it or not civilization will depend entirely on those with power being charitable because as workers we will eventually have no power to influence anything. I'm not saying anything is certain, but these are outcomes I think we at least need to be thinking about today because the cost of getting this wrong is so high.

kypro 4y ago

You're touching on my primary long-term concern with AI and automation here. One of the issues with the argument that we'll all be able to live great work-free lives on welfare is that AI fundamentally changes the dynamic between labourer and government. Historically the power nations, governments, business and individuals have is really just product of the labourers below them. Or put another way, the US is only as powerful as the total output of its labourers. This means historically the greatest threat to the US government (and governments generally) is unhappy labours - US revolution being the obvious example here. The same is true for companies though, just on a smaller scale. If you're in a position of power, historically your power has depended on ensuring those below you don't revolt. So for that reason historically we have always been able to protest for workers rights, higher wages, welfare, etc. But as soon as our labour is worthless we have very little bargaining power. In fact in the extreme it's possible we might all just become waste of resources and space to those at the top. And this gets even more concerning when you consider how AI could be used to prevent protests or to financially punish those involved in them. It seems to me wherever we like it or not civilization will depend entirely on those with power being charitable because as workers we will eventually have no power to influence anything. I'm not saying anything is certain, but these are outcomes I think we at least need to be thinking about today because the cost of getting this wrong is so high.