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Perhaps you are overly connected with reality. If you and I were on a desert island, and attempted to forcibly extract 40% of your foraging efforts, saying I w

Perhaps you are overly connected with reality. If you and I were on a desert island, and attempted to forcibly extract 40% of your foraging efforts, saying I was going to invest it for the greater good, you would probably rise up and attack me, finding the idea unacceptable. Now, if I and 5 others did the same you might feel forced to accept the proposal. I hope you would agree that the idea of forcible extraction of your wealth is still not right. Well, at what point does it become right? How many people need to go along with forcible extraction to make it a just social contract? The answer is - it is never right. Any time even one individual is forced, it is wrong. But its not a case of one individual - we are all infringed upon multiple times daily, even though we are doing no harm to anyone. This is a perverse system, that will even try to mould and entrain its citizens, for the benefit of a tiny minority who would preserve their power. (Its not even about money for them, as they control the printing presses, and means of production.) People will often say anarchy would ensue if this system stopped - we are better with the devil we know (a hierarchical governance structure, that restrains the individual). But, the truth is, while we choose this system we can never be free - this is a certainty. We choose to always be slaves, and to be ruled by the worst of us (psychopaths who are unburdened by care towards others) who rise to the top.

BeetleB 4y ago
Again: Abstractions and analogies, with no concrete connection to the real world. I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm saying that if someone agrees with your comment, it is because they already know what you're talking about in the context of the world we live in. For those who do not know what you're talking about, your comment does not enlighten in the least. Put another way, I can agree with everything you said in the abstract, and still not see what it has to do with reality. I can set up all kinds of hypotheticals involving islands, and have them all be logically correct, and yet have nothing to do with how the world really is. Giving examples is a rather basic expository technique. I'm not here to philosophize.
- verisimi 4y ago
  I'm glad you can agree with my reasoning in the abstract. Bear in mind, HN is not a wildly tolerant place to air unpopular opinions - if I keep to the abstract, its hard to dismiss. In fact - this is something I hope for - to make a reasoned philosophical case - to provide a hypothesis that other individuals can test for themselves and see if they find it to be true (as I have). This is contrast to the feel good nonsense most believe, despite no evidence, and no personal verification. I'm not sure what concrete connection you require. What is it you want? Names, places? Perhaps you should take a look at my submission and comment history - I do sometimes go into more detail.
  - BeetleB 4y ago
    > I'm not sure what concrete connection you require. What is it you want? Names, places? I want what you mention here: > This is contrast to the feel good nonsense most believe, despite no evidence, and no personal verification. Evidence. As I said: Giving examples is a rather basic expository technique.
    - yunwal 4y ago
      I mean, the literature is out there and it seems crazy to me that you’re pretending to have never seen a well-sourced article about wealth inequality and rent seeking, but here: Trends in wealth inequality - https://apps.urban.org/features/wealth-inequality-charts/ https://apps.urban.org/features/wealth-inequality-charts/ Rich kids stay rich, poor kids stay poor - https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/rich-kids-stay-rich-poor-kids-stay-poor/ https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/rich-kids-stay-rich-poo... How rent seeking is at the heart of America’s economic troubles - https://jpia.princeton.edu/news/something-nothing-how-growing-rent-seeking-heart-americas-economic-troubles https://jpia.princeton.edu/news/something-nothing-how-growin... I could go on there’s about a million articles about this. I’m sure you’ll find something to criticize but at this point it’s like denying climate change.
    - verisimi 4y ago
      Most people believe all sorts of stuff - simply because someone has told them. You probably believe in gravity, why? Are alternative explanations possible? You probably believe in evolution, why? Or perhaps you believe in some religious texts, again why? Did you verify anything? You probably believe in h2o, why? Have you put hydrogen and oxygen gases together to make water? You probably don't believe in the aliens we saw in the film 'Independence Day', why? Is it because you were told it is fiction? You probably do believe the world is getting warmer, and that we are in danger of a mass extinction event, why? How was this proven to you? If one scientist says something, is that proof? If 100 say the same thing, is that better proof? Etc. What measure do you use to filter the truth from noise, lies and reality? Is it just what you are told - do you doubt your lying eyes? Or is there internal discernment and primary experience is the gold standard?

BeetleB 4y ago

Again: Abstractions and analogies, with no concrete connection to the real world. I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm saying that if someone agrees with your comment, it is because they already know what you're talking about in the context of the world we live in. For those who do not know what you're talking about, your comment does not enlighten in the least. Put another way, I can agree with everything you said in the abstract, and still not see what it has to do with reality. I can set up all kinds of hypotheticals involving islands, and have them all be logically correct, and yet have nothing to do with how the world really is. Giving examples is a rather basic expository technique. I'm not here to philosophize.

verisimi 4y ago
I'm glad you can agree with my reasoning in the abstract. Bear in mind, HN is not a wildly tolerant place to air unpopular opinions - if I keep to the abstract, its hard to dismiss. In fact - this is something I hope for - to make a reasoned philosophical case - to provide a hypothesis that other individuals can test for themselves and see if they find it to be true (as I have). This is contrast to the feel good nonsense most believe, despite no evidence, and no personal verification. I'm not sure what concrete connection you require. What is it you want? Names, places? Perhaps you should take a look at my submission and comment history - I do sometimes go into more detail.
- BeetleB 4y ago
  > I'm not sure what concrete connection you require. What is it you want? Names, places? I want what you mention here: > This is contrast to the feel good nonsense most believe, despite no evidence, and no personal verification. Evidence. As I said: Giving examples is a rather basic expository technique.
  - yunwal 4y ago
    I mean, the literature is out there and it seems crazy to me that you’re pretending to have never seen a well-sourced article about wealth inequality and rent seeking, but here: Trends in wealth inequality - https://apps.urban.org/features/wealth-inequality-charts/ https://apps.urban.org/features/wealth-inequality-charts/ Rich kids stay rich, poor kids stay poor - https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/rich-kids-stay-rich-poor-kids-stay-poor/ https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/rich-kids-stay-rich-poo... How rent seeking is at the heart of America’s economic troubles - https://jpia.princeton.edu/news/something-nothing-how-growing-rent-seeking-heart-americas-economic-troubles https://jpia.princeton.edu/news/something-nothing-how-growin... I could go on there’s about a million articles about this. I’m sure you’ll find something to criticize but at this point it’s like denying climate change.
  - verisimi 4y ago
    Most people believe all sorts of stuff - simply because someone has told them. You probably believe in gravity, why? Are alternative explanations possible? You probably believe in evolution, why? Or perhaps you believe in some religious texts, again why? Did you verify anything? You probably believe in h2o, why? Have you put hydrogen and oxygen gases together to make water? You probably don't believe in the aliens we saw in the film 'Independence Day', why? Is it because you were told it is fiction? You probably do believe the world is getting warmer, and that we are in danger of a mass extinction event, why? How was this proven to you? If one scientist says something, is that proof? If 100 say the same thing, is that better proof? Etc. What measure do you use to filter the truth from noise, lies and reality? Is it just what you are told - do you doubt your lying eyes? Or is there internal discernment and primary experience is the gold standard?