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Just when it seems like we’ve reached the bottom on the level of Samsung’s incompetence, it just drops deeper. I’ve avoided Samsung anything for years because

Just when it seems like we’ve reached the bottom on the level of Samsung’s incompetence, it just drops deeper. I’ve avoided Samsung anything for years because of their total disregard for security and total contempt towards their users.

ChuckNorris89 4y ago
>I’ve avoided Samsung anything for years because of their total disregard for security and total contempt towards their users. The thing is, if you live in the west then all the other major Android brands aren't better at all. There just are no good options anymore. HTC went bust, OnePlus turned to shit, LG threw in the towel, Sony's SW updates cycle is unimpressive for how expensive they are, Google Pixels are buggy as hell and not available in every country, and Motorola, Nokia and Blackberry are basically rebadged Chinese OEM designs. This lack of good options explains why Android lost so much market share to iOS in the last years. Excluding Chinese phone makers, Samsung is pretty much the only big player in town from a western aligned nation, that has its shit mostly together as of present, promising 5 years of updates, having service and distribution centers in most countries around the world and a wide portfolio covering all price brackets. For example, if you're in the market for a new relatively affordable mid-range ~300 Euro phone, then Samsung is pretty much your safest bet in the Android space. Sure, there are better option like Fairphone but those are far away from being globally mainstream.
- wnevets 4y ago
  > Google Pixels are buggy as hell, That hasn't been my experience.
  - ChuckNorris89 4y ago
    That's funny since the Pixel 6 has had so many people complaining about various bugs. Google has no quality consistency both with SW and HW, it's all hit and miss with their Pixel range. Some turned out great, some were abasically e-waste. IMHO they peaked with the Nexus 5 and then went downhill after that. Then current Pixel 7 seems to be an exception.
    - wnevets 4y ago
      > That's funny since the Pixel 6 has had so many people complaining about various bugs. Like what?
      - vladikoff 4y ago
        * Buggy pull down brightness switcher. * Buggy do not disturb mode * Camera app bugs out when taking photos, random frame drops in video recordings. * Sharing menus - slow, suggestions are poor. * broken launcher + third-party launcher support. * buggy compass calibration * buggy 911 support
        wnevets 4y ago
        I haven't needed to call 911 or use a 3rd party launcher but I haven't noticed any of those other issues.
  - r12343a_19 4y ago
    Hm... 1. GPS didn't work in the background for me. A few OS updates and some Waze updates later it seems I do get turn-by-turn directions. 2. GPU artefacts in Minecraft and Firefox. A few OS, Minecraft and Firefox updates later and it all "just works". 3. Fingerprint sensor works well except when you need it. Murphy's law for sure. 4. I'm in a low signal area and it seems to be unable to receive calls sometimes. I've had people tell me they called and my phone just didn't ring (it's not do not disturb). Overall is a decent phone but it was a struggle for the high price it had.
    - wnevets 4y ago
      > . I'm in a low signal area and it seems to be unable to receive calls sometimes. I've had people tell me they called and my phone just didn't ring (it's not do not disturb). My 5G/LTE performance definitely seems much worst than the Pixel 3a XL I had previously.
- ornornor 4y ago
  For about 300 eur you can get 1.5 used iPhone SE 2020 in perfect condition. I know, I’ve bought several recently. Not saying Apple is the greatest in general but that’s an alternative. I personally don’t regret switching over to iPhones years ago. And I only ever buy iPhones from Apple. And I buy them used because they’re insanely expensive otherwise. That aside, Samsung’s shittiness extends far beyond smartphones. Their TVs are a disaster, their appliances fail just outside warranty, their wearable and speakers are spyware just like the rest of their products… the only thing from them not on my shitlist are semis or components like ram because there isn’t much that can go wrong on this kind of commodity product.
  - ChuckNorris89 4y ago
    You're moving the goal-posts. I was talking about new phones, not second hand one, as many people prefer buying new for the full 2 year warranty and that added peace of mind. A basic new SE is 550 Euros, far away from the ~300 Euros price bracket. Also, I haven't found used iPhones to buy directly from Apple in EU. Maybe you can point me in the right direction. I tried to get my mom a 2020 SE since that's the phone my employer gave me and she hated the tiny, dim, low resolution display but she loves her Samsung A52 though, with its big and bright OLED display while being cheaper than the SE. Also battery life is longer on her A52 than on my work SE. Different people have different requirements for a smartphone that go beyond the brand and reputation (display size, brightness, USB-C, etc). iPhone SE is not a one-size fits all solution for everyone.
    - petesergeant 4y ago
      Used iPhones from Apple in the EU: https://www.apple.com/de/shop/refurbished/iphone https://www.apple.com/de/shop/refurbished/iphone
GekkePrutser 4y ago
Samsung isn't actually that bad. They augment parts of Android's security model under the 'knox' branding (which is mostly marketing, yes, but they do improve a few things, especially because their Enterprise users ask for these). It's not quite grapheneos but I wouldn't call it disregard for security. For example, they have added an IKEv2 VPN client to the supported system VPN options since Android 6 or so. They also pioneered the work container before Google started offering this as part of AOSP under the name 'Work Profile'. A feature which is really nice for privacy, separating a user's personal activity from their work activity. And they're really good at rolling out security patches. Even before apps like SnoopSnitch drew attention to Android OEMs playing loose and fast with patch levels and missing out patches, Samsung was one of the most complete in this area. https://9to5google.com/2018/04/12/android-security-update-missing-patches-report/ https://9to5google.com/2018/04/12/android-security-update-mi... I was a mobile MDM admin of a huge fleet until last year. No commercial involvement with the vendors though because in our company each country picks their own models but technical management is global. I do have complaints about Samsung like the huge amount of crapware they ship. Upday, facebook, etc. And their ads in their apps. And it's bugging the users to sign up for a personal onedrive account even when they're already signed in to a corporate one :( But on security I consider them quite good for an Android vendor.

ChuckNorris89 4y ago

>I’ve avoided Samsung anything for years because of their total disregard for security and total contempt towards their users. The thing is, if you live in the west then all the other major Android brands aren't better at all. There just are no good options anymore. HTC went bust, OnePlus turned to shit, LG threw in the towel, Sony's SW updates cycle is unimpressive for how expensive they are, Google Pixels are buggy as hell and not available in every country, and Motorola, Nokia and Blackberry are basically rebadged Chinese OEM designs. This lack of good options explains why Android lost so much market share to iOS in the last years. Excluding Chinese phone makers, Samsung is pretty much the only big player in town from a western aligned nation, that has its shit mostly together as of present, promising 5 years of updates, having service and distribution centers in most countries around the world and a wide portfolio covering all price brackets. For example, if you're in the market for a new relatively affordable mid-range ~300 Euro phone, then Samsung is pretty much your safest bet in the Android space. Sure, there are better option like Fairphone but those are far away from being globally mainstream.

wnevets 4y ago
> Google Pixels are buggy as hell, That hasn't been my experience.
- ChuckNorris89 4y ago
  That's funny since the Pixel 6 has had so many people complaining about various bugs. Google has no quality consistency both with SW and HW, it's all hit and miss with their Pixel range. Some turned out great, some were abasically e-waste. IMHO they peaked with the Nexus 5 and then went downhill after that. Then current Pixel 7 seems to be an exception.
  - wnevets 4y ago
    > That's funny since the Pixel 6 has had so many people complaining about various bugs. Like what?
    - vladikoff 4y ago
      * Buggy pull down brightness switcher. * Buggy do not disturb mode * Camera app bugs out when taking photos, random frame drops in video recordings. * Sharing menus - slow, suggestions are poor. * broken launcher + third-party launcher support. * buggy compass calibration * buggy 911 support
      - wnevets 4y ago
        I haven't needed to call 911 or use a 3rd party launcher but I haven't noticed any of those other issues.
- r12343a_19 4y ago
  Hm... 1. GPS didn't work in the background for me. A few OS updates and some Waze updates later it seems I do get turn-by-turn directions. 2. GPU artefacts in Minecraft and Firefox. A few OS, Minecraft and Firefox updates later and it all "just works". 3. Fingerprint sensor works well except when you need it. Murphy's law for sure. 4. I'm in a low signal area and it seems to be unable to receive calls sometimes. I've had people tell me they called and my phone just didn't ring (it's not do not disturb). Overall is a decent phone but it was a struggle for the high price it had.
  - wnevets 4y ago
    > . I'm in a low signal area and it seems to be unable to receive calls sometimes. I've had people tell me they called and my phone just didn't ring (it's not do not disturb). My 5G/LTE performance definitely seems much worst than the Pixel 3a XL I had previously.
ornornor 4y ago
For about 300 eur you can get 1.5 used iPhone SE 2020 in perfect condition. I know, I’ve bought several recently. Not saying Apple is the greatest in general but that’s an alternative. I personally don’t regret switching over to iPhones years ago. And I only ever buy iPhones from Apple. And I buy them used because they’re insanely expensive otherwise. That aside, Samsung’s shittiness extends far beyond smartphones. Their TVs are a disaster, their appliances fail just outside warranty, their wearable and speakers are spyware just like the rest of their products… the only thing from them not on my shitlist are semis or components like ram because there isn’t much that can go wrong on this kind of commodity product.
- ChuckNorris89 4y ago
  You're moving the goal-posts. I was talking about new phones, not second hand one, as many people prefer buying new for the full 2 year warranty and that added peace of mind. A basic new SE is 550 Euros, far away from the ~300 Euros price bracket. Also, I haven't found used iPhones to buy directly from Apple in EU. Maybe you can point me in the right direction. I tried to get my mom a 2020 SE since that's the phone my employer gave me and she hated the tiny, dim, low resolution display but she loves her Samsung A52 though, with its big and bright OLED display while being cheaper than the SE. Also battery life is longer on her A52 than on my work SE. Different people have different requirements for a smartphone that go beyond the brand and reputation (display size, brightness, USB-C, etc). iPhone SE is not a one-size fits all solution for everyone.
  - petesergeant 4y ago
    Used iPhones from Apple in the EU: https://www.apple.com/de/shop/refurbished/iphone https://www.apple.com/de/shop/refurbished/iphone

GekkePrutser 4y ago

Samsung isn't actually that bad. They augment parts of Android's security model under the 'knox' branding (which is mostly marketing, yes, but they do improve a few things, especially because their Enterprise users ask for these). It's not quite grapheneos but I wouldn't call it disregard for security. For example, they have added an IKEv2 VPN client to the supported system VPN options since Android 6 or so. They also pioneered the work container before Google started offering this as part of AOSP under the name 'Work Profile'. A feature which is really nice for privacy, separating a user's personal activity from their work activity. And they're really good at rolling out security patches. Even before apps like SnoopSnitch drew attention to Android OEMs playing loose and fast with patch levels and missing out patches, Samsung was one of the most complete in this area. https://9to5google.com/2018/04/12/android-security-update-missing-patches-report/ https://9to5google.com/2018/04/12/android-security-update-mi... I was a mobile MDM admin of a huge fleet until last year. No commercial involvement with the vendors though because in our company each country picks their own models but technical management is global. I do have complaints about Samsung like the huge amount of crapware they ship. Upday, facebook, etc. And their ads in their apps. And it's bugging the users to sign up for a personal onedrive account even when they're already signed in to a corporate one :( But on security I consider them quite good for an Android vendor.