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Your journey is is literally the epitome of self-governance, and yet the party that ostensibly advocates for more self-governance seems to fear you and others o

Your journey is is literally the epitome of self-governance, and yet the party that ostensibly advocates for more self-governance seems to fear you and others on that journey as the top threat to society today. The only way that makes sense is when viewed with a cynical eye: people are spooked by "not normal", and spooked people are more easily manipulated. It's disgusting on so many levels.

poszlem 4y ago
You can both say that people should be able to self-govern themselves and at the same time have a cut-off age before which they should not. The trans debate would be much less heated if it did not involve other people's children.
- pstuart 4y ago
  I have to imagine it's got to be painful and challenging as a parent to go through that. Obviously this is not to be done lightly but it seems like it's ultimately the business of the child, their doctor, and their parents. > The trans debate would be much less heated if it did not involve other people's children. Oh really? What about bathrooms? I hear that trans people love to go to bathrooms and molest children.
  - poszlem 4y ago
    I can assure you that any discussion that involves other people's children is on another level of heat when compared to even the most heated debate about bathrooms.
  - bbbbbp 4y ago
    Are you referring to incidents like this: https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/4002789/morrisons-sex-attack-girl-fife-transgender-katie-dolatowski https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/4002789/morrisons-sex-...? If so, these are rare, and aren't the main reason why most people want to keep certain spaces as sex-segregated.
    - 0ct4via 4y ago
      Ignoring that the Sun is tabloid trash, nobody raises as many complaints when men sexually assault women or children, nor do they make the same complaints about the "risks" or "predators" when it comes to trans men -- this is specifically a boogeyman rhetoric designed to denigrate trans women. If you're reading this, you've probably been in a bathroom with a trans person, or someone you know has, and they've been absolutely fine. Trans people by and large want to get in, pee, and get out, same as everyone else -- but perhaps moreso, given the risk of transphobic rhetoric and abuse if they were to be "clocked" (identified) as a trans person. The primary abusers of women and children are men, followed by (cis) women. Trans women make up an exceedingly small portion of that particular criminal element, but they're vilified and used as boogeymen so much more, to attempt to deny trans women's existence under "think of the children" handwaving.
      - bbbbbp 4y ago
        [dead]
        0ct4via 4y ago
        * trans-exclusionary feminists, you mean. Plenty feminists are intersectional, TERFs are in the minority (and before someone claims it's a slur, a cis woman feminist came up with the term, to refer to the trans-exclusionary minority). Trans is a descriptor, so "trans woman" is the appropriate usage, nor "transwoman" -- and those feminists aren't taking umbrage with non-binary trans people, or trans men -- only trans women... Hmm. That aside, the link you provided is disingenuous -- the author may be trans, but they conflate sex and gender, and have often been transphobic, as have the CCJS themselves. You don't seem to be engaging in good faith -- ignoring the "whataboutism" and ignorant terminology, you're also conflating sex with gender, and deciding that a minority justify excluding the vast majority. Are you next going to say that only women who can bleed and bear children are women? -- because plenty of cis women can't, and that's the kind of exclusionary rhetoric that's used next.
        bbbbbp 4y ago

poszlem 4y ago

You can both say that people should be able to self-govern themselves and at the same time have a cut-off age before which they should not. The trans debate would be much less heated if it did not involve other people's children.

pstuart 4y ago
I have to imagine it's got to be painful and challenging as a parent to go through that. Obviously this is not to be done lightly but it seems like it's ultimately the business of the child, their doctor, and their parents. > The trans debate would be much less heated if it did not involve other people's children. Oh really? What about bathrooms? I hear that trans people love to go to bathrooms and molest children.
- poszlem 4y ago
  I can assure you that any discussion that involves other people's children is on another level of heat when compared to even the most heated debate about bathrooms.
- bbbbbp 4y ago
  Are you referring to incidents like this: https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/4002789/morrisons-sex-attack-girl-fife-transgender-katie-dolatowski https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/4002789/morrisons-sex-...? If so, these are rare, and aren't the main reason why most people want to keep certain spaces as sex-segregated.
  - 0ct4via 4y ago
    Ignoring that the Sun is tabloid trash, nobody raises as many complaints when men sexually assault women or children, nor do they make the same complaints about the "risks" or "predators" when it comes to trans men -- this is specifically a boogeyman rhetoric designed to denigrate trans women. If you're reading this, you've probably been in a bathroom with a trans person, or someone you know has, and they've been absolutely fine. Trans people by and large want to get in, pee, and get out, same as everyone else -- but perhaps moreso, given the risk of transphobic rhetoric and abuse if they were to be "clocked" (identified) as a trans person. The primary abusers of women and children are men, followed by (cis) women. Trans women make up an exceedingly small portion of that particular criminal element, but they're vilified and used as boogeymen so much more, to attempt to deny trans women's existence under "think of the children" handwaving.
    - bbbbbp 4y ago
      [dead]
      - 0ct4via 4y ago
        * trans-exclusionary feminists, you mean. Plenty feminists are intersectional, TERFs are in the minority (and before someone claims it's a slur, a cis woman feminist came up with the term, to refer to the trans-exclusionary minority). Trans is a descriptor, so "trans woman" is the appropriate usage, nor "transwoman" -- and those feminists aren't taking umbrage with non-binary trans people, or trans men -- only trans women... Hmm. That aside, the link you provided is disingenuous -- the author may be trans, but they conflate sex and gender, and have often been transphobic, as have the CCJS themselves. You don't seem to be engaging in good faith -- ignoring the "whataboutism" and ignorant terminology, you're also conflating sex with gender, and deciding that a minority justify excluding the vast majority. Are you next going to say that only women who can bleed and bear children are women? -- because plenty of cis women can't, and that's the kind of exclusionary rhetoric that's used next.
        bbbbbp 4y ago