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> For instance, as one camper noted, in just one lottery to hike Mount Whitney, more than 16,000 people applied, and only a third got in. Yet everyone paid the

> For instance, as one camper noted, in just one lottery to hike Mount Whitney, more than 16,000 people applied, and only a third got in. Yet everyone paid the $6 registration fee, which means the gross income for that single location is over $100,000. Wow, it's like those scummy all-pay auction sites you see advertised, where you can buy/win a TV for just $4.29. Incredible that this is allowed. It sounds like there's still no answer as to whether Booz Allen was paid cash upfront to build the sites, and it is possible that the amount being paid is "fair" in some sense. But if they're making six-figures of profit on one lottery for Mount Whitney, that seems exceedingly unlikely.

warbler73 4y ago
recreation.gov is a .gov site. Which is supposed to mean it is owned by the government and not a private run site collecting fees for a for-profit defense contractor.
- kube-system 4y ago
  "Hiring a contractor" ≠ "the contractor owns it" ≠ "the contractor runs it" The government hires contractors for most things, but the projects are still owned and directed by the government.
- PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
  Where is this meaning of ".gov" to be found?
  - jonnybgood 4y ago
    https://home.dotgov.gov/ https://home.dotgov.gov/
  - stonogo 4y ago
    Here: https://home.dotgov.gov https://home.dotgov.gov Operated by CISA care of the GSA. Specifically: https://home.dotgov.gov/registration/requirements/#eligibility https://home.dotgov.gov/registration/requirements/#eligibili... See also RFC 920: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc920 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc920 Section "Initial Set of Top Level Domains"
- biftek 4y ago
  I previously had little issue with the fees because I assumed they went back to the parks due to the .gov domain. Now that I know it's just a private 3rd party collecting them and our parks and public lands are still underfunded is infuriating.
  - warbler73 4y ago
    Yes. I've been booking back country camping and trail access for a couple of years now and at no time did I suspect the money was going anywhere other than the National Park Service and BLM to support the programs and sites. I never would have imagined significant amounts, in some cases the majority of funds collected at a .gov park service site was going to a for profit defense contractor. In fact the site states in places that fees go to support the parks. No where does it say fees go to support for profit defense contractors.
    - kube-system 4y ago
      When you buy a stamp, the fees also "go to support defense contractors". ... because the USPS also pays their contractors.
thaumasiotes 4y ago
>> For instance, as one camper noted, in just one lottery to hike Mount Whitney, more than 16,000 people applied, and only a third got in. Yet everyone paid the $6 registration fee, which means the gross income for that single location is over $100,000. > Wow, it's like those scummy all-pay auction sites you see advertised, where you can buy/win a TV for just $4.29. Incredible that this is allowed. My impression was that those sites use a much scummier model, in which whoever buys the last ticket wins. Tickets are cheap, but the priority system ("last guy wins") means people buy a large number of tickets. A true lottery in which you buy a ticket for $6 and then either win or lose at random is a very different thing. You can't spend more than $6 on that.

warbler73 4y ago

recreation.gov is a .gov site. Which is supposed to mean it is owned by the government and not a private run site collecting fees for a for-profit defense contractor.

kube-system 4y ago
"Hiring a contractor" ≠ "the contractor owns it" ≠ "the contractor runs it" The government hires contractors for most things, but the projects are still owned and directed by the government.
PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
Where is this meaning of ".gov" to be found?
- jonnybgood 4y ago
  https://home.dotgov.gov/ https://home.dotgov.gov/
- stonogo 4y ago
  Here: https://home.dotgov.gov https://home.dotgov.gov Operated by CISA care of the GSA. Specifically: https://home.dotgov.gov/registration/requirements/#eligibility https://home.dotgov.gov/registration/requirements/#eligibili... See also RFC 920: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc920 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc920 Section "Initial Set of Top Level Domains"
biftek 4y ago
I previously had little issue with the fees because I assumed they went back to the parks due to the .gov domain. Now that I know it's just a private 3rd party collecting them and our parks and public lands are still underfunded is infuriating.
- warbler73 4y ago
  Yes. I've been booking back country camping and trail access for a couple of years now and at no time did I suspect the money was going anywhere other than the National Park Service and BLM to support the programs and sites. I never would have imagined significant amounts, in some cases the majority of funds collected at a .gov park service site was going to a for profit defense contractor. In fact the site states in places that fees go to support the parks. No where does it say fees go to support for profit defense contractors.
  - kube-system 4y ago
    When you buy a stamp, the fees also "go to support defense contractors". ... because the USPS also pays their contractors.

thaumasiotes 4y ago

>> For instance, as one camper noted, in just one lottery to hike Mount Whitney, more than 16,000 people applied, and only a third got in. Yet everyone paid the $6 registration fee, which means the gross income for that single location is over $100,000. > Wow, it's like those scummy all-pay auction sites you see advertised, where you can buy/win a TV for just $4.29. Incredible that this is allowed. My impression was that those sites use a much scummier model, in which whoever buys the last ticket wins. Tickets are cheap, but the priority system ("last guy wins") means people buy a large number of tickets. A true lottery in which you buy a ticket for $6 and then either win or lose at random is a very different thing. You can't spend more than $6 on that.