5 ms·

Why not open-source it?

by tomp 4y ago

Benjamin_Dobell 4y ago
Nothing to add on Clara.io. However, just wanted to state that Ben Houston is/was one of the more prolific three.js contributors (https://github.com/mrdoob/three.js/graphs/contributors https://github.com/mrdoob/three.js/graphs/contributors) and consistently pushed three.js in a better direction. Thank you!
- bhouston 4y ago
  Thanks! In many ways Mrdoob's Three.js was critical to Clara.io working. His leadership of Three.js over the past decade has transformed online 3D. And the community around Three.js was critical to it actually working. WebGL was so buggy on devices in 2013-2015 that it was only through joint community effort that we were about to work around those device-specific bugs.
  - techsavygamer0 4y ago
    Hey Ben - thoughts on WebGPU support, and the potential for a web-based metaverse?
    - bhouston 4y ago
      I think success in a web-based metaverse isn't likely dependent upon technology, but rather figuring out how to appeal to users. But Rust/WASM+WebGPU can be very efficient. But building your own engine from scratch is not a minor undertaking.
bhouston 4y ago
Fun fact, a lot of it is open source, just not where you would expect it. During the creation of Clara.io I created over 200 PRs to Three.js: https://github.com/mrdoob/three.js/pulls?q=is%3Apr+author%3Abhouston+is%3Aclosed https://github.com/mrdoob/three.js/pulls?q=is%3Apr+author%3A... Open sourcing it wholesale at this point is a challenge because parts of the tech stack became parts of Threekit.com. Threekit.com is VC funded and an ongoing business operation. I do what I can with open source still, see: https://github.com/bhouston/behave-graph https://github.com/bhouston/behave-graph https://github.com/threeify/threeify https://github.com/threeify/threeify
MuffinFlavored 4y ago
If 20,000 people are using it a month, why not ask some of them to pay?
- bhouston 4y ago
  We did. https://clara.io/pricing https://clara.io/pricing. It was incredibly ineffective.
  - brutus1213 4y ago
    Thank you for being so forthright. I'm curious if you considered lowering the price to where it became stupidly obvious for a user to get. E.g. 1 dollar a month (or year). I recall Whatsapps early pricing model where I'd never pay for a paid messaging app personally, but since it was free the first whole year and 1 dollar a year after, it seemed essentially free. When I see something that's 10 dollars a month (100 w/ year discount), I think of the higher number as the price (x1.5-x2). I can see the danger of devaluing the product, not covering costs, etc. but am curious if a price point between free and monthly exists .. ultra-good-value? Use that to bring in some recurring revenue, and grow from that base. If you have thoughts on this, would appreciate hearing them.
    - bhouston 4y ago
      I think the main issue was that we were very popular with students and dabblers. They were not using our tool to make money. Thus they were not very easy to provide value that would justify them paying. It just a horrible market to serve if you want to make any money.

Why not open-source it?

by tomp 4y ago

Why not open-source it?

Nothing to add on Clara.io. However, just wanted to state that Ben Houston is/was one of the more prolific three.js contributors (https://github.com/mrdoob/three.js/graphs/contributors https://github.com/mrdoob/three.js/graphs/contributors) and consistently pushed three.js in a better direction. Thank you!

bhouston 4y ago
Thanks! In many ways Mrdoob's Three.js was critical to Clara.io working. His leadership of Three.js over the past decade has transformed online 3D. And the community around Three.js was critical to it actually working. WebGL was so buggy on devices in 2013-2015 that it was only through joint community effort that we were about to work around those device-specific bugs.
- techsavygamer0 4y ago
  Hey Ben - thoughts on WebGPU support, and the potential for a web-based metaverse?
  - bhouston 4y ago
    I think success in a web-based metaverse isn't likely dependent upon technology, but rather figuring out how to appeal to users. But Rust/WASM+WebGPU can be very efficient. But building your own engine from scratch is not a minor undertaking.

bhouston 4y ago

Fun fact, a lot of it is open source, just not where you would expect it. During the creation of Clara.io I created over 200 PRs to Three.js: https://github.com/mrdoob/three.js/pulls?q=is%3Apr+author%3Abhouston+is%3Aclosed https://github.com/mrdoob/three.js/pulls?q=is%3Apr+author%3A... Open sourcing it wholesale at this point is a challenge because parts of the tech stack became parts of Threekit.com. Threekit.com is VC funded and an ongoing business operation. I do what I can with open source still, see: https://github.com/bhouston/behave-graph https://github.com/bhouston/behave-graph https://github.com/threeify/threeify https://github.com/threeify/threeify

MuffinFlavored 4y ago

If 20,000 people are using it a month, why not ask some of them to pay?

bhouston 4y ago
We did. https://clara.io/pricing https://clara.io/pricing. It was incredibly ineffective.
- brutus1213 4y ago
  Thank you for being so forthright. I'm curious if you considered lowering the price to where it became stupidly obvious for a user to get. E.g. 1 dollar a month (or year). I recall Whatsapps early pricing model where I'd never pay for a paid messaging app personally, but since it was free the first whole year and 1 dollar a year after, it seemed essentially free. When I see something that's 10 dollars a month (100 w/ year discount), I think of the higher number as the price (x1.5-x2). I can see the danger of devaluing the product, not covering costs, etc. but am curious if a price point between free and monthly exists .. ultra-good-value? Use that to bring in some recurring revenue, and grow from that base. If you have thoughts on this, would appreciate hearing them.
  - bhouston 4y ago
    I think the main issue was that we were very popular with students and dabblers. They were not using our tool to make money. Thus they were not very easy to provide value that would justify them paying. It just a horrible market to serve if you want to make any money.