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That's what I thought. If consumer products tend to use the bleeding edge, which will be the state-of-the-art chips produced in Taiwan, then I still don't get:

That's what I thought. If consumer products tend to use the bleeding edge, which will be the state-of-the-art chips produced in Taiwan, then I still don't get: 1. What's so exciting about a prev-gen fab possibly being completed in 2024? 2. Who will buy the chips produced by the 4nm Arizona fab, and why? The only plausible answer offered for 1 in this thread has been that it's too difficult to jump straight into the bleeding edge, and this is the most the US can do to lay the foundation for an eventual catch-up with the state of the art in chip fabrication.

rsj_hn 4y ago
Lower end consumer electronics are fine with chips that aren't the absolute latest. The point isn't that they won't find buyers, but rather that they will earn less money building a fab in a location with much higher labor costs and producing chips that are a bit behind. My guess is that the decision to build fabs in the U.S. was the result of geopolitical strong-arming by the U.S., but TSMC will still find buyers and that the fab will at least pay for itself.
bonestamp2 4y ago
If mission critical applications (military, automotive, aerospace) are using older chips, and smartphones/computers are using the latest, then everything else is using chips between those two extremes... computer peripherals, office machines, toys, audio/video systems, communication equipment, lights, HVAC, anything rechargeable. The list is massive, you name an industry and they will probably be buying 4nm over the next couple decades.
walterbell 4y ago
Starting in 2022, the high-volume iPhone has been switched to the N-1 generation SoC, while the bleeding edge SoC is reserved for the lower volume iPhone Pro/Max.
rnk 4y ago
Because overall the us chip production capacity and technical reach has been reducing over time. We need to establish and pull over a much larger amount of production so our strategic needs can be met inside the us. This helps us avoid problems like our key sources being cut off or destroyed with our allies like Taiwan and South Korea, or China does more and more production and technical leadership and decides to squeeze us. Intel has sinking in at least technical leadership for a long time. It's obviously a priority a need for the us to on-shore more chip prod.

rsj_hn 4y ago

Lower end consumer electronics are fine with chips that aren't the absolute latest. The point isn't that they won't find buyers, but rather that they will earn less money building a fab in a location with much higher labor costs and producing chips that are a bit behind. My guess is that the decision to build fabs in the U.S. was the result of geopolitical strong-arming by the U.S., but TSMC will still find buyers and that the fab will at least pay for itself.

bonestamp2 4y ago

If mission critical applications (military, automotive, aerospace) are using older chips, and smartphones/computers are using the latest, then everything else is using chips between those two extremes... computer peripherals, office machines, toys, audio/video systems, communication equipment, lights, HVAC, anything rechargeable. The list is massive, you name an industry and they will probably be buying 4nm over the next couple decades.

walterbell 4y ago

Starting in 2022, the high-volume iPhone has been switched to the N-1 generation SoC, while the bleeding edge SoC is reserved for the lower volume iPhone Pro/Max.

rnk 4y ago

Because overall the us chip production capacity and technical reach has been reducing over time. We need to establish and pull over a much larger amount of production so our strategic needs can be met inside the us. This helps us avoid problems like our key sources being cut off or destroyed with our allies like Taiwan and South Korea, or China does more and more production and technical leadership and decides to squeeze us. Intel has sinking in at least technical leadership for a long time. It's obviously a priority a need for the us to on-shore more chip prod.