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I'm a Catholic and fairly traditionally minded and am surprised by what you're saying since at my church, couples in this age range are on their fourth or fift

I'm a Catholic and fairly traditionally minded and am surprised by what you're saying since at my church, couples in this age range are on their fourth or fifth kid by the time they're 30. Even amongst the newest married couples, most are expecting within the first year. I understand we have different beliefs and such but since we're all in the same environment, how do we explain the simultaneous existence of the seemingly normal-to-hyper fertile? Surely there is more than just 'its environmental'

kneebonian 4y ago
> I understand we have different beliefs and such but since we're all in the same environment, Interesting you mention that the group I am referring to and myself are all members of religion generally associated with large families as well. I should also clarify all of them have at least 2 kids at this point. Which is another interesting data point of many of them didn't have difficulty with their first couple of kids but now are struggling.
- anon291 4y ago
  Okay, well you didn't mention this. This is certainly more interesting. I've heard of one couple that I know who are having issues, but they are now much older than they were. I'll have to wait and see. I don't really have any anecdata to confirm or dispute here. I wish them the best of luck. I will say, the first couple of kids make it harder to conceive the rest. Logistically speaking... And also , men's and women's stress levels with young children cannot be good for fertility
someweirdperson 4y ago
> are on their fourth or fifth kid by the time they're 30. That's the difference. Couples that plan explicitly typically don't plan their firstborn before 30.
- anon291 4y ago
  In what sense? My wife and I certainly planned our first child very young (for the US at least; internationally, we were on the late end, like most Americans)
  - ldh0011 4y ago
    I suspect the increasingly shrinking demographic of churchgoers is different in this regard from the rest of the population. I think they're right in saying people who plan typically don't plan children for before 30, I don't know anyone near my age (early 20s) who is doing that; many don't want children at all.
- idlehand 4y ago
  My wife and I plan to have all our kids before 30. We're doing well above average financially, and we want to be young while our kids are young. She is currently pregnant with our first. It helps that she is not very career-minded, I have the opportunity to work from home, and I'm working a role where I earn well and never need to do overtime.
nemo44x 4y ago
Age matters massively. People getting married in their 30s and trying to conceive in their mid-30s are going to have a much harder time than young people in their early and mid 20s. It's really not a linear drop off in terms of difficulty either - it's fairly exponential.
- bombcar 4y ago
  I think people assume that since a woman who had her first kid at 20 can still have kids at 40 that you can start anytime along that line - I suspect that's not the case for various reasons.
- anon291 4y ago
  The comment I responded to was about 20 - 30 year olds though. Age .. I totally get that, and the effect in this very group is also obvious. Children are typically front loaded and then the youngest are born in a more spaced out fashion.
bombcar 4y ago
Some of it may be psychosomatic - of the "Catholic group" I know of only two couples have had issues, and one resolved after they adopted (and immediately got twins and have three girls that are the same age). You may also have the age issue - starting at 20 is a lot different than starting at 30.
- anon291 4y ago
  The age I agree with, but the comment I responded to said that anecdotally, he knew many people in the 20-30 age range, which is surprising to me.
jvanderbot 4y ago
Yep--age is everything. Most professional couples don't even marry until 30s, and even if married sooner, don't try for kids until later. My wife and I struggled, yet my wifes sister keeps having kids. Difference was wife's sister started early, whereas wife and I were married at 35.
mlac 4y ago
Anecdata also Catholic. NFP and hormone therapy worked but it was a journey. Tried for 2+ years before realizing we had an issue and did NFP to conceive. Lots of other Catholic couples struggling with it go that route as it is a church-approved method. Tried for 6 years (age 25-31). Finally considered adoption and then got pregnant and lost the first baby in a miscarriage. Had a healthy second baby at 32. Now have a third healthy baby at 34. I think a lot of factors combine, but will state that we moved an average of once per year until age 30, so subconsciously we probably didn’t feel settled. It’s a very complex topic with too many variables to effectively model. And even when pregnancy occurs miscarriage rates are high. I’ll note that young couples with kids are much more obvious in church (they make noise) and more likely to be at masses with other families. Young couples without kids often go to the later masses (in cities sometimes 9 PM).
AntiRemoteWork 4y ago
swat535 4y ago
Not sure why your comment is downvoted but you have a point.. The difference is that religious couples should always be open to life so in a sense they are always "trying" as contraceptives are not allowed (except for NFP) hence their chances go up. Further they are encouraged to married sooner than later sense they should abstain from sex until then. It makes sense that younger couples having lots of sex without contraception will end up having more children than their counterparts.
- anon291 4y ago
  Yeah that makes sense to me. I also think a lot of fertility doctors are hoodwinking couples into thinking something is wrong with them if they haven't conceived within a year. I think it'll happen for most people eventually (and the stats agree). Of course, it eases nerves if your 'eventually' is longer because you're younger.

kneebonian 4y ago

> I understand we have different beliefs and such but since we're all in the same environment, Interesting you mention that the group I am referring to and myself are all members of religion generally associated with large families as well. I should also clarify all of them have at least 2 kids at this point. Which is another interesting data point of many of them didn't have difficulty with their first couple of kids but now are struggling.

anon291 4y ago
Okay, well you didn't mention this. This is certainly more interesting. I've heard of one couple that I know who are having issues, but they are now much older than they were. I'll have to wait and see. I don't really have any anecdata to confirm or dispute here. I wish them the best of luck. I will say, the first couple of kids make it harder to conceive the rest. Logistically speaking... And also , men's and women's stress levels with young children cannot be good for fertility

someweirdperson 4y ago

> are on their fourth or fifth kid by the time they're 30. That's the difference. Couples that plan explicitly typically don't plan their firstborn before 30.

anon291 4y ago
In what sense? My wife and I certainly planned our first child very young (for the US at least; internationally, we were on the late end, like most Americans)
- ldh0011 4y ago
  I suspect the increasingly shrinking demographic of churchgoers is different in this regard from the rest of the population. I think they're right in saying people who plan typically don't plan children for before 30, I don't know anyone near my age (early 20s) who is doing that; many don't want children at all.
idlehand 4y ago
My wife and I plan to have all our kids before 30. We're doing well above average financially, and we want to be young while our kids are young. She is currently pregnant with our first. It helps that she is not very career-minded, I have the opportunity to work from home, and I'm working a role where I earn well and never need to do overtime.

nemo44x 4y ago

Age matters massively. People getting married in their 30s and trying to conceive in their mid-30s are going to have a much harder time than young people in their early and mid 20s. It's really not a linear drop off in terms of difficulty either - it's fairly exponential.

bombcar 4y ago
I think people assume that since a woman who had her first kid at 20 can still have kids at 40 that you can start anytime along that line - I suspect that's not the case for various reasons.
anon291 4y ago
The comment I responded to was about 20 - 30 year olds though. Age .. I totally get that, and the effect in this very group is also obvious. Children are typically front loaded and then the youngest are born in a more spaced out fashion.

bombcar 4y ago

Some of it may be psychosomatic - of the "Catholic group" I know of only two couples have had issues, and one resolved after they adopted (and immediately got twins and have three girls that are the same age). You may also have the age issue - starting at 20 is a lot different than starting at 30.

anon291 4y ago
The age I agree with, but the comment I responded to said that anecdotally, he knew many people in the 20-30 age range, which is surprising to me.

jvanderbot 4y ago

Yep--age is everything. Most professional couples don't even marry until 30s, and even if married sooner, don't try for kids until later. My wife and I struggled, yet my wifes sister keeps having kids. Difference was wife's sister started early, whereas wife and I were married at 35.

mlac 4y ago

Anecdata also Catholic. NFP and hormone therapy worked but it was a journey. Tried for 2+ years before realizing we had an issue and did NFP to conceive. Lots of other Catholic couples struggling with it go that route as it is a church-approved method. Tried for 6 years (age 25-31). Finally considered adoption and then got pregnant and lost the first baby in a miscarriage. Had a healthy second baby at 32. Now have a third healthy baby at 34. I think a lot of factors combine, but will state that we moved an average of once per year until age 30, so subconsciously we probably didn’t feel settled. It’s a very complex topic with too many variables to effectively model. And even when pregnancy occurs miscarriage rates are high. I’ll note that young couples with kids are much more obvious in church (they make noise) and more likely to be at masses with other families. Young couples without kids often go to the later masses (in cities sometimes 9 PM).

AntiRemoteWork 4y ago

swat535 4y ago

Not sure why your comment is downvoted but you have a point.. The difference is that religious couples should always be open to life so in a sense they are always "trying" as contraceptives are not allowed (except for NFP) hence their chances go up. Further they are encouraged to married sooner than later sense they should abstain from sex until then. It makes sense that younger couples having lots of sex without contraception will end up having more children than their counterparts.

anon291 4y ago
Yeah that makes sense to me. I also think a lot of fertility doctors are hoodwinking couples into thinking something is wrong with them if they haven't conceived within a year. I think it'll happen for most people eventually (and the stats agree). Of course, it eases nerves if your 'eventually' is longer because you're younger.