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I'd be surprised if anyone tried to argue that fossil fuels have been anything less than instrumental in achieving our modern comforts. The issue is: 1. Oil c

I'd be surprised if anyone tried to argue that fossil fuels have been anything less than instrumental in achieving our modern comforts. The issue is: 1. Oil companies knew about fossil fuel harm to the environment, and then lied about/tried to cover it up. They've directly played a role in climate misinformation. They've done that so well that we now have armies of people with no relevant knowledge on the topic arguing that climate change is a hoax. 2. If the danger of fossil fuels was acknowledged long ago, we could have prepared for it in advance. This would have eaten into profits, hence the motivation to deny it's a problem.

edgyquant 4y ago
I’ve met very few people who believe climate change is a hoax. The belief is that the climate is not static and that it’s better for humans to adapt (as they always have) than to commit economic suicide. This is unpopular online, but is the actual view of a majority of Americans imo. The reason climate activists are not getting anywhere with these people is that they are having an argument with the climate denier in their head.
- rybosworld 4y ago
  "The belief is that the climate is not static and that it’s better for humans to adapt (as they always have) than to commit economic suicide." Whose belief? I don't understand how belief is relevant. "This is unpopular online, but is the actual view of a majority of Americans imo" Not true. Most Americans accept the scientific consensus - that recent changes in temperature are driven by human activities: https://www.ipsos.com/en-us/news-polls/extreme-weather-poll-2022 https://www.ipsos.com/en-us/news-polls/extreme-weather-poll-...
  - edgyquant 4y ago
    You didn’t read my comment because you aren’t engaging faithfully. I said that most people do believe it’s caused by humans but that humans will have to adapt to it as they have to multiple other changes in climate. I’m not kidding about you arguing with yourself here. This comment is actual proof
    - rybosworld 4y ago
      "You didn’t read my comment because you aren’t engaging faithfully." Except, I quoted most of your comment directly. "I said that most people do believe it’s caused by humans but that humans will have to adapt to it as they have to multiple other changes in climate." You absolutely did not say this.
- ZeroGravitas 4y ago
  - rybosworld 4y ago
    This has been a lot more common in my experience. Driven primarily by folks realizing how wrong/ridiculous their views were years ago, and trying to rewrite history.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - edgyquant 4y ago
    Funny how I didn’t mention anything about myself yet you still attacked me as if I had. Again, you’re arguing with a climate denier in your head
    - ZeroGravitas 4y ago
      I was attacking the thing you said, in the comment I replied to: > I’ve met very few people who believe climate change is a hoax. The belief is that the climate is not static and that it’s better for humans to adapt (as they always have) than to commit economic suicide.
- ako 4y ago
  Continuing using oil as we do today might also end in economical suicide. And embracing more green technology might offer more economic opportunities than oil.
- matthewdgreen 4y ago
  I've met many climate change deniers, both in real life and online. They used to be very thick on the ground on sites like this one and particularly on Slashdot. (Ugh, remember "Climategate”?) It has been something of a pleasure watching them gradually disappear from sites with more thoughtful readers. Sadly, the reason they're disappearing is because boldfaced climate denial doesn't fly with reasonably intelligent HN folks anymore, given what we can see with our own eyes. The smarter new ones have switched away from rants about "AGW" and scientists being untrustworthy. They now tell us climate change won't be that bad and we can "adapt."
- mdcds 4y ago
  > The belief is that the climate is not static It's a justified belief. Climate isn't static. For example, Sahara desert used to be an oasis: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_humid_period https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_humid_period
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]

edgyquant 4y ago

I’ve met very few people who believe climate change is a hoax. The belief is that the climate is not static and that it’s better for humans to adapt (as they always have) than to commit economic suicide. This is unpopular online, but is the actual view of a majority of Americans imo. The reason climate activists are not getting anywhere with these people is that they are having an argument with the climate denier in their head.

rybosworld 4y ago
"The belief is that the climate is not static and that it’s better for humans to adapt (as they always have) than to commit economic suicide." Whose belief? I don't understand how belief is relevant. "This is unpopular online, but is the actual view of a majority of Americans imo" Not true. Most Americans accept the scientific consensus - that recent changes in temperature are driven by human activities: https://www.ipsos.com/en-us/news-polls/extreme-weather-poll-2022 https://www.ipsos.com/en-us/news-polls/extreme-weather-poll-...
- edgyquant 4y ago
  You didn’t read my comment because you aren’t engaging faithfully. I said that most people do believe it’s caused by humans but that humans will have to adapt to it as they have to multiple other changes in climate. I’m not kidding about you arguing with yourself here. This comment is actual proof
  - rybosworld 4y ago
    "You didn’t read my comment because you aren’t engaging faithfully." Except, I quoted most of your comment directly. "I said that most people do believe it’s caused by humans but that humans will have to adapt to it as they have to multiple other changes in climate." You absolutely did not say this.
ZeroGravitas 4y ago
- rybosworld 4y ago
  This has been a lot more common in my experience. Driven primarily by folks realizing how wrong/ridiculous their views were years ago, and trying to rewrite history.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- edgyquant 4y ago
  Funny how I didn’t mention anything about myself yet you still attacked me as if I had. Again, you’re arguing with a climate denier in your head
  - ZeroGravitas 4y ago
    I was attacking the thing you said, in the comment I replied to: > I’ve met very few people who believe climate change is a hoax. The belief is that the climate is not static and that it’s better for humans to adapt (as they always have) than to commit economic suicide.
ako 4y ago
Continuing using oil as we do today might also end in economical suicide. And embracing more green technology might offer more economic opportunities than oil.
matthewdgreen 4y ago
I've met many climate change deniers, both in real life and online. They used to be very thick on the ground on sites like this one and particularly on Slashdot. (Ugh, remember "Climategate”?) It has been something of a pleasure watching them gradually disappear from sites with more thoughtful readers. Sadly, the reason they're disappearing is because boldfaced climate denial doesn't fly with reasonably intelligent HN folks anymore, given what we can see with our own eyes. The smarter new ones have switched away from rants about "AGW" and scientists being untrustworthy. They now tell us climate change won't be that bad and we can "adapt."
mdcds 4y ago
> The belief is that the climate is not static It's a justified belief. Climate isn't static. For example, Sahara desert used to be an oasis: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_humid_period https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_humid_period
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]